Into The Woods: the Witch and Rapunzel- Page 8

[justoldbill]

Posted: 8/10/12 at 6:28pm

I swear to Heaven, people on this thread would probably find something smutty in Frank Morgan's line, "Well, bust my buttons!"

Updated On: 8/10/12 at 06:28 PM

[henrikegerman]

Posted: 8/10/12 at 7:02pm

Let's define our terms, Gaveston. Because I don't know if you are saying:

1) there's an insidious sexual component to all possessive parents' resentment and sabotage of their children's love lives. "Sexual" as in the complexity of human sexuality including the Oedipal dynamic. "Sexual" as in psychosexual longings to be wanted, joined with, cared for, not abandoned by, loved, accepted and desired (as a human being, not as a piece of &*()).

In which case we all agree with you, or at least understand what Freud would say about it (even if we don't agree with Freud).

2) that when the Witch asks Rapunzel if she would have her be "handsome as a Prince" that she is revealing a sexual attraction to Rapunzel in the common sense of the phrase. As in an unquenchable and marked (as in driving her crazy hot) longing - conscious or subconscious - to make love to her daughter.

In which case I, and it seems the majority of people posting here, don't agree with you.

Sometimes in this thread, I thought you were suggesting 1) and other times it seems you are suggesting 2). And because of that I have the profound and aggravating sense that we are going around in circles.

Put more simply, is ITW more like "Bewitched" or "Lolita'? Which character does the Witch resemble more?
I realize you agree that there is no actual sex between the Witch and Rapunzel, but that's not what I'm asking. I'm asking if you think the Witch more closely resembles Nikolai Bolkonsky (who's neediness keeps Princess Marya unmarried, and I'm sure Freud would have a psychosexual field day with that), or Nicole Diver's father who wanted to (and, as it happens did, &*()) his daughter), which eventually leads to her nervous breakdown.

In thought rather than in deed, Is she more like Jessica Tandy in The Birds or John Huston in Chinatown? And, anticipating how you might respond, if your answer be that considering their thoughts and or desires (conscious or un) concerning, respectively, their son and daughter, Tandy in The Birds and Huston in Chinatown are exactly the same. I beg to differ.

















Updated On: 8/10/12 at 07:02 PM

[My Oh My]

Posted: 8/10/12 at 7:17pm

When I was a tyke and my older sis would have the boyfriend over, I'd often see a figure lurking about the keyhole to the door of the living room where they'd be smooching, no doubt. The egregious voyeur was none other than mother. I'd catch her and she'd shush me and run away red as a tomato with awkward smile on her face. I'd go back awhile later, and sure enough, that figure in the dark was once again at the damned keyhole!

Say what you will, my mother is not a lesbian, a pervert, or scandalous voyeur for cheap thrills as I'm sure Freud would have had us believe. She's an over protective mother who was watching over her daughter in a erm...unconventional way.

Overly protective parents can and will do things that seem a bit extreme, even inappropriate. Don't know why that's so apparently far-fetched, something incestuous seems like the only answer.

I don't really blame those who are interpreting it that way though. Not if they're getting that message from directors of productions that clearly suggests that. And that's why I just won't shut up when it comes to the things that make musical theatre lousy, like egocentric directors with Madonna reinvention complexes.

I don't consider distraction tacked onto a proven piece to be the least bit inventive or creative. Not if it detracts from a show's basic message by pointing to an outrageous one. I know the sexual angle was courtesy of another production and not so much this one. Just thought I'd make that clear as I haven't seen this current revival and wasn't necessarily referring to its director, even if I'm so far not too thrilled with some of the things I've read on it.