NOT REAL BROADWAY FANS.- Page 2

[StateOfJade]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 7:42pm

Well, Monkey, despite the apology in advance, you can't really expect people to sit back in their chair and twiddle their thumbs after a post like that. You sort of deserved it.

[bythesword84]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 8:47pm

I'm nineteen and I've seen over 160 Broadway performances, and its a lot less than people older than me but a lot more than a good percentage of people my age. I can say that there are a lot of people out there who drive me crazy- the people who claim to have a show be their favorite before they've actually seen a production of it. A good CD does not make a good show. But I don't think you can judge that based on the age of the person. Besides, most of those people wouldn't know this theater board if they fell on it. I give credit to people who come and attempt to participate because hopefully they'll learn something from it and be opened to the older (and some newer ones they might not know about) by the other people here.

[NuggetMonkeys]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 8:50pm

o--freaking--kay. i am sorry for HOW i said what i said.

-d.b.j-

[TheGirlinTheFrock]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:18pm

Well, there are 'not real broadway fans' on the board. But they dont last long. These are the people who joined because of a pop star joined a show (can anyone say MelB4ever?) but age has nothing to do w/ it. I am 18 and recognize that i have not been as lucky to see some of the shows as the older posters have. I love RENT, I enjoy watching WICKED, i thought that HAIRSPRAY was alright. I could listen to Miss Siagon all day long. Age cant qualify a true broadway fan.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:27pm

We need to nurture new fans to theatre--never attack them. Instead of starting an attack thread, how about starting threads that could possibly educate a few folks? There were some great threads like that on Broadway.com--where everyone shared their views on classic plays and musicals.

[MusicPos2]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:44pm

I've not only seen, but while not even close to professionally, I've performed in some of those older musicals, and I don't like them as much. Often, the music is trite, and it's forced into the plot (Rogers and Hammerstein especially). People like Sondheim write accompaniments that are way too big (Schwartz's "Defying Gravity" is even a little much, although the last time I saw WICKED, the conductor went much slower, and that made a huge improvement in the orchestrations). WICKED is the best show that I know, whether I saw or was in it, but "Defying Gravity" is not the best song in it. It is a magical moment, and the last time I saw it, it was absolutely amazing, but the operatic moments in "No One Mourns the Wicked..." And then there's my favorite song of all time "For Good," which is so simple in comparison, but it's gorgeous.

[My Fair Lady]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:45pm

I AM NOT a poser. Sure, I'm only 13 and have only seen about 25 Broadway shows (not all of them on Broadway but yes, professional) but you have NO RIGHT to attack me. So what if I like the modern shows and hate some of the older classics like The Music Man? I know more about Broadway than most people my age age I appreciate me so don't call me a poser.

[MusicPos2]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:52pm

God I hate THE MUSIC MAN. I played Olin, and I hated it then. Seen the movie, hated that, and I was a counselor in a camp that did the Junior version, which is worse than the senior...There is one good song ("Goodnight My Someone"). The plot SUCKS! And, it's just a really bad show. I'm not saying there aren't good older musicals, btw, FIDDLER is great! I haven't seen it on stage, but I love the movie, and I played Lazar in Middle School (we did the full MTI version, no stupid Junior stuff).

[Songsstresss]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:52pm

JRBActor- You hit it right on the head. Instead of criticising the younger generation for embracing Wicked and Rent, we should be telling them that it is a wonderful thing that they are interested in musical theater, and use their interest in the modern works to introduce to them the older works and history of this craft. I too, am a bit surprised at how "Defying Gravity" is on such a high percentage of posters' "Best Song" list, but instead of telling them, "You are stupid for thinking a new musical song is among the BEST musical theater songs EVER written," we should simply point them in the direction of older material that they may also enjoy. Anyway, I think you see my point. I am only 21 and don't have near the knowledge of the theater that I would like, so I look to older, more experienced posters to teach me or inform me of older shows I may not be as familiar with. But don't sit there and yell at me for enjoying belting along with Idina... "Tell them how I'm defying gravity!"

[MusicPos2]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 9:55pm

Why does no one ever talk about "For Good"?

[NuggetMonkeys]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:02pm

as a last note, i didn't mean to say (even thought re-reading my post, it does sound like it) that young broadway fans are bad. i just think that they need to (or superlatively SHOULD)look to the past and recognize the past achievements in musical theatre, or theatre in general.

again, i am sorry for being a crumudgeon.

-d.b.j-

[brdwaybaby17]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:04pm

Wow, a few of you seem to be making NuggetMonkeys point for him...but don't attack me, I still don't agree with it...

[MusicPos2]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:08pm

Sometimes to do that, we have to even look at shows we don't like. The whole movement of operas on Broadway started with Webber's JOSEPH. I'm not Webber's biggest fan (he has a couple nice songs, PHANTOM is an ok show), but he's one of the most important composers b/c he brought opera into the 20th/21st century. Many people think the only modern operas are "Peter Grimes" or "Porgy and Bess," but they forget the definition of an opera. Thanks to Webber, we have shows like LES MIS and MISS SAIGON, or RENT, or TITANIC and RAGTIME. All shows are all song or speaking as part of song. That's pretty big. Without Jerome Kern, there'd be no musicals worth watching. As Broadway progresses, the shows are more and more realistic with better and better music to fit into the plot rather than being forced in. Sure there are some bad shows, now, but they tend not to last.

[brdwaybaby17]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:12pm

Hmmm... do you mean operetta?? Because that's what some of those are...

[Dollypop]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:20pm

Those of us who are older forget what it was like when we were first infatuated with Broadway. I remember wondering how Hollywood would film the "Telephone Hour" in the BYE BYE BIRDIE movie and was fascinated by what we now might call "Grade B" musicals like SKYSCRAPER and BAJOUR--shows that could never survive in today's financial situation. I remember getting annoyed with people who claimed that That Streisand Woman was lip-synching "People" in FUNNY GIRL (it turns out she did!), and I became enamored with a certain musical comedy that stays with me to this very day. I read Louella Parsons and Dorothy Kilgallen with the same fervor that these kids read Michael Reidel.

What I'm trying to say here is that we shouldn't forget how exciting it was when we first experienced Broadway shows the way so many of the kids on these boards are. Let them have their infatuation with various shows. Maybe 20 years from now there'll be a Wickedpop spouting these same words to another generation.

[MusicPos2]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:23pm

No, I don't mean operetta. Operettas would have too much speaking.

[TheaterGeek91]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:25pm

Well, with all due respect, I am 12 years old and I think some of your points weren't entirely accurate. I love all varieties of musicals, old and new. Some that stand out right now: Les Miserables, Secret Garden, Hairspray, Jane Eyre, Godspell, Suessical, INTO THE WOODS (although first act is better)... the darker and sappier, the better! However, I apologize if you find my tastes are immature and would love any ideas on musicals to which I simply must listen. Oh, and I've performed in over 25 shows in many theaters around my home, professional and community alike. And I hate Annie, although I was Annie a few years ago when I was cute and little.

[brdwaybaby17]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:26pm

Ragtime is for sure an operetta... it is awfully close to just being a musical... or at least I think so, who knows, I could be wrong...

[MusicPos2]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:27pm

Good for you, just be careful you don't hurt your voice before you get old. Remember, if when you sing, it hurts, it's wrong!

[BroadwayDiva]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:28pm

I'm only 13, but I've been exposed to Broadway shows from the 60s and 70s. My favorite shows include JCS, Pippin, Godspell, Hair, MoLM, and Cabaret. Those are all from before I was born. But I also enjoy the modern stuff, like RENT (which is one of my favorites), Wicked, Ave.Q, Aida, and many others.

Just because my favorite show may be RENT, doesn't mean I don't know there's others shows out there. I think some of the best of Broadway was written in the 70s and 80s. Too bad I couldn't see them when they were on Broadway....

[Dollypop]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:35pm

By definition, "operetta" had a frivolous plot and large chunks of spoken dialogue. There isn't anything "frivolous" about the plot of RAGTIME.

[JoizeyActor]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:37pm

Is that RENT on your Icon, NuggetMonkeys?

[NuggetMonkeys]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:40pm

most definetly not. it is a picture of the current revival of ASSASSINS. first produced in 1991. within the last fifteen years. take me to the firing wall.

-d/b/j-

[JoizeyActor]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:49pm

Okay.

[Type_A_Tiff]

Posted: 5/22/04 at 10:54pm

While NuggetMonkeys probably didn't state his P.O.V. particularly eloquently (by everyone's admission - no offense), I think there's some truth to what he says. I definitely agree with everyone that said that instead of flaming new "Broadway fans" for their taste in modern shows we should educate them more on other classics, here's what pisses me off, and maybe this is just my own experience.

After recently vacationing in NYC with my Broadway "virgin" friend, I took her to see Phantom, Wicked, Aida and Boy From Oz. She refused to watch Rent right off the bat with no good reason. She fidgeted through Phantom, wrote BFO as being "stupid" before even seeing it, and only enjoyed Wicked and Aida. Now, she claims that because she loved Wicked and Aida, she's a "die hard Broadway fan", yet she refuses to even watch any local theatre here in Vancouver, and has no interest in seeing the Rent, Les Mis or Lion King tours when they come to the north west. After all, as she says, "Those (Wicked & Aida)were the best shows. Period." and she admits that her appreciation for Aida diminished solely because of her extreme enjoyment of Wicked.

Understandably, people are allowed to make judgments on what shows they are interested and not interested in seeing. However, my biggest problem lies with people who claim to be "Broadway fans" without having the DESIRE to broaden their theatre horizon, as well as people who's "fan-ship" for one or two shows is so fickle that not only is a "superior show" better than another, but the other show is just considered "bad" now, not just "not as good". Is that a true Broadway fan? No.

Ok, off my soap box now. I just needed to rant about that because it's been pissing me off non stop.