SMASH wins at Creative Arts Emmys tonight! Also Tony Upset!- Page 2

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 5:34am

Really, tazber? I thought it was brilliant, particularly by the very low standards of specialty numbers written for award shows.

[tazber]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 7:21pm

Yea, I remember actually feeling embarrassed for NPH. Theater's appeal to gays is such a tired cliche; I'm not denying the veracity of it, it certainly is true, but it was like shooting fish in a barrel.

There are so many more clever angles they could have taken rather than trotting out hoary stereotypes and satirizing them.

And if I recall correctly it was followed by the performance of Brotherhood of Man which was either a brilliant and subversive comment by the producers, or more likely just a bad coincidence.

Updated On: 9/17/12 at 07:21 PM

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 8:34pm

Probably a coincidence.

And even more than other award shows, the Tonys have to try to hold on to the audience that doesn't care about Broadway theater. Yes, the satire of the opening number in question may be overly broad, but it's also something that everyone in the U.S. can understand.

The wittier the slant, the smaller the audience that will "get" it.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 8:51pm

No offense, but if you try to marginalize how someone feels about something by telling them they work too hard at being offended it tends to imply that the respect you think is due is little to none.

That's a great line, Phyl. Come to think of it, I can't remember ever hearing the phrase "with all due respect" not immediately followed by something disrespectful.

[JohnyBroadway]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 8:53pm

I liked this years song much better.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 10:27pm

That's a great line, Phyl. Come to think of it, I can't remember ever hearing the phrase "with all due respect" not immediately followed by something disrespectful.

With all due respect, Namo, not everyone here is the delicate flower that you seem to have become.

And few people post more bluntly than Phyllis, a fact that has never brought forth a complaint from me. But it's a tad pot/kettle to be told by Phyllis that I am "marginalizing" those opinions with which I disagree.

I am certainly expected to put on my "big girl" panties here, if not an entire suit of chain mail. I see no reason why the rest of you shouldn't do the same.

[Kad]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 10:30pm

...is it just me, or was the song rather well-accepted last year?

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 10:39pm

That's my memory, Kad. I was quite surprised to learn recently that the number was so despised. (But I don't keep a chart of such things and I'm not accusing anybody in this thread of changing his mind.)

I don't mind admitting that I watched it dozens of times on YouTube.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 10:42pm

I didn't say you were marginalizing them because you didn't agree, but because you said that people were working overtime to be offended by it. Generally someone saying a variation on "you just like to be offended" does come across as an attempt to marginalize the person or at the very least imply they shouldn't feel the way they do.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 10:53pm

Good point, Phyllis. However, I have reproduced and (mostly) cleaned up the lyrics from the song in question and, thus far, not a single poster has pointed to anything in them that is homophobic.

So "marginalizing" or not, I have to suspect some people were simply hell-bent on being offended.

Updated On: 9/17/12 at 10:53 PM

[Plum]

Posted: 9/17/12 at 11:32pm

It wasn't even the best musical number in that Tonys ceremony. For all its complete uselessness, I enjoyed the NPH/Jackman duet more.

And even more than other award shows, the Tonys have to try to hold on to the audience that doesn't care about Broadway theater.

Seriously, nothing is sadder than appeals to some perceived mass audience, and this was no exception. As soon as you go the "we're totes gay, but not too gay, mythical Middle America" you've already lost the fight for relevancy. Musicals can own what they are and still appeal to millions (hi Glee) if they stop apologizing all the freaking time for being musicals.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/18/12 at 8:53pm

Uh, the duet was a medley of some of the great songs in musical comedy history. OF COURSE a novelty number written for a few laughs and a quick-change ending didn't compare. That's probably why they give the Emmy for best new song, rather than simply the best song sung on TV at any time during the year.

It's very easy to get up on one's high horse and say "don't play to the lowest common denominator." And normally I would agree.

But if the Tony Awards opens with a Billy-Crystal-type number referencing the nominees, most of the TV audience (even the Middle American theater fans) will have no idea what the song is about. That is the Tonys' special dilemma: they don't represent a mass art form and can't depend on large sections of the audience knowing even the titles of nominees, much less insider gossip.

So they go for a broad target instead. Shocking!

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 9/19/12 at 12:34pm

Have we forgotten, this is the awards group that actually voted for "Dick in a Box" and "I'm F*cking Matt Damon" to win this same award in recent years.

If "It's Not Just for Gays Anymore" were written by the South Park/Book of Mormon guys, no one would be complaining.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/19/12 at 4:30pm

The Emmy voters do seem to have a fondness for parody, Mr. M.

[tazber]

Posted: 9/19/12 at 4:59pm

If "It's Not Just for Gays Anymore" were written by the South Park/Book of Mormon guys, no one would be complaining.

Well that's just a silly thing to say. I had no idea who wrote the song when I saw it on the Tonys. In fact I didn't even know who it was until much later. Stephen Sondheim could have written it and it would still be an awful song.

[My Oh My]

Posted: 9/20/12 at 12:24am

I admit I caught myself with a strained smirk when that number was over. I had begun with a huge Joker smile, though.

To me, it had the same effect of seeing yet ANOTHER Hispanic or Asian character on mainstream television being horribly stereotyped in the most expected manner. Even though I know the intention is usually NOT to offend and it's actually being inclusive and pimping diversity and love and rice and beans, and what have you, the vast majority of these attempts fail to warm the heart and instead set the wheels of heavy eye-rollage...in motion!!!

How strongly I feel about something is proportional to my post length (I kid), so I obviously don't lose sleep over this. XD But, but that Tonys ditty never actually morphed into feelings of offense, but I can totally see how it could, and it makes perfect sense. It also makes perfect sense how it could possibly NOT offend.

None of y'all are wrong for feeling what you felt; however, all of y'all are TOTALLY wrong for trying to suggest the other side is...er, wrong.

Stop it! XD

[AEA AGMA SM]

Posted: 9/20/12 at 12:34am

"And even more than other award shows, the Tonys have to try to hold on to the audience that doesn't care about Broadway theater."

I would argue that attempts to hold on to that audience are pointless, as the audience that doesn't care about Broadway theatre hasn't even tuned in to catch the song and be hooked or repelled, they are already on another channel.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 9/20/12 at 11:59am

Gaveston, precisely my point. It's nothing new for them to reward a song like this. I would have preferred the Smash song to win, but I thought this one was clever. I'm not offended by it. I don't understand why people would be offended, I thought it was very tongue-in-cheek. Might not be your cup of tea, but that's different.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/20/12 at 10:10pm

Beats me, too, obviously. That's why I printed the lyrics. The song not only refers to cliches about gays and theater, but also about Jews, intellectuals, etc.

ALL OF THESE CLICHES ARE CLICHES BECAUSE THEY CONTAIN SOME TRUTH.

The number in question merely acknowledged what everybody already knew, but which had long remained unspeakable in formal venues such as the Tonys. Taking offense at that strikes me as odd, to say the least.

But that doesn't mean I've stopped anyone from swooning. How could I?