Scalpers
Scalpers
LxGstv
Broadway Star Joined: 11/22/16
#4Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 9:03am
As much as I hate scalpers it's a fairly simple problem to be solved. Harry Potter and the Cursed Child is doing an excellent job at that, unlike Hamilton whose decision to deal with scalpers was "make tickets more expensive". Yeah, that solved the issue. Eye roll.
boonanas
Featured Actor Joined: 9/25/08
#6Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 10:17am
boo: If those "scalpers" you saw were buying tix at the box office that means anyone who wants tix could buy at the box office or online. Not the same as bots buying up tickets to an event the second they go on sale leaving out other folks who would like a chance to buy.
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#7Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 10:19am
LxGstv said: "As much as I hate scalpers it's a fairly simple problem to be solved. Harry Potter and the Cursed Child is doing an excellent job at that, unlike Hamilton whose decision to deal with scalpers was "make tickets more expensive". Yeah, that solved the issue. Eye roll.
"
What is Harry Potter and the Cursed Child doing?
Rainah
Broadway Star Joined: 11/24/16
#8Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 10:21am
LxGstv said: "As much as I hate scalpers it's a fairly simple problem to be solved. Harry Potter and the Cursed Child is doing an excellent job at that, unlike Hamilton whose decision to deal with scalpers was "make tickets more expensive". Yeah, that solved the issue. Eye roll."
Hamilton fought hard to pass new laws against scalpers, implemented new technology to detached them, seized any tickets they could determine were scalped and rereleased them to the public (Surely you've seen the boards of people who got caught up in it by mistake, there were a few)
What's more, it worked. If you look at the number of secondary market tickets on sale compared to this time last year, there's a huge difference. Those tickets are now in the hands of fans.
It's also Hamilton prerogative to raise ticket prices when they see people buying tickets for $900 elsewhere. It's not wrong for them to want more of that money to go to the people who created the show (Especially since they coupled it with releasing more lotto tickets I believe)
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#9Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 10:28am
Rainah said: "LxGstv said: "As much as I hate scalpers it's a fairly simple problem to be solved. Harry Potter and the Cursed Child is doing an excellent job at that, unlike Hamilton whose decision to deal with scalpers was "make tickets more expensive". Yeah, that solved the issue. Eye roll."
Hamilton fought hard to pass new laws against scalpers, implemented new technology to detached them, seized any tickets they could determine were scalped and rereleased them to the public (Surely you've seen the boards of people who got caught up in it by mistake, there were a few)
What's more, it worked. If you look at the number of secondary market tickets on sale compared to this time last year, there's a huge difference. Those tickets are now in the hands of fans.
It's also Hamilton prerogative to raise ticket prices when they see people buying tickets for $900 elsewhere. It's not wrong for them to want more of that money to go to the people who created the show (Especially since they coupled it with releasing more lotto tickets I believe)
"
Hamilton did fight and did pass a new law. The law applies only to NY, so people with bots (the only ones they are really concerned about) are still in play for stated other than NY. It's really hard to get caught using one. It's a cat and mouse game ticketmaster plays constatnly.
One of the reasons that there are less resale tickets is the price increase. The margins weren't there for people to take a risk and put up money a year in advance.
They can't do anything about a person that buys within the stated limits and resells them, not can they do anything about the guy that walks up to the box office and sells what he purchased. Doing so is against the law in NYC as long as they don't do it within a certain distance from the theater.
#10Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 10:32am
Wee Thomas2 said: "boo: If those "scalpers" you saw were buying tix at the box office that means anyone who wants tix could buy at the box office or online. Not the same as bots buying up tickets to an event the second they go on sale leaving out other folks who would like a chance to buy.
"
What boonanas is describing is what scalpers used to do in the old days, before the internet and bots were a thing. I feel that we will begin to see a return of this method.
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#11Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 10:36am
AC126748 said: "Wee Thomas2 said: "boo: If those "scalpers" you saw were buying tix at the box office that means anyone who wants tix could buy at the box office or online. Not the same as bots buying up tickets to an event the second they go on sale leaving out other folks who would like a chance to buy.
"
What boonanas is describing is what scalpers used to do in the old days, before the internet and bots were a thing. I feel that we will begin to see a return of this method.
"
They did that at the Box Office for Hamilton in Chicago. There were 8 people that got in line, purchased their seats, and all left in the same car. They were on the local news and were not trying to hide that they were going to cash in. If you buy something, it's yours to do what you want with. If you go back and read the articles on the issue, LMM said nothing about people that just purchase tickets within the allowed limits and resell them. He was only mentioned bots used by professionals that are capable of buying blocks of tickets in milliseconds before the general public has a chance to purchase them.
boonanas
Featured Actor Joined: 9/25/08
#12Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 11:00am
Oddly enough... I was on a line for Evan Hansen attempting to get SRO sometime last weekend as well... and a similar thing occurred where two men were on line... one of them purchased a block of 8 tickets... and handed the credit card off to the next dude... who attempted to purchase 8 more tickets. This person was turned away, stating that you're only allowed 8 per card and said "you know this already sir you were here earlier".
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#13Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 11:46am
This happened last week - http://www.billboard.com/articles/business/7625257/president-obama-signs-bots-act-law
If you look at it, it's not limiting resellers or people that make a living reselling tickets. It simply makes using a program that allows you to buy multiple blocks of seats and deliberately circumvent measures the artist / venue has in place.
#15Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 11:59am
^ And that is something you can do at a 199-seat Off Broadway theater. It would never work in a larger house. Imagine the chaos if all 1,300 people seeing HAMILTON had to pick up their tickets in a two-hour window before the performance. It would be a disaster.
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
Updated On: 12/21/16 at 11:59 AM
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#16Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 11:59am
Andy51 said: "For Othello at the New York Theater Workshop, you need to pick up your tickets at the box office in a 2hr window before the performance and show a photo ID. This has, thankfully, been pretty effective in deterring scalpers.
"
I'm pretty sure that is technically not legal in NY State unless they provide an easy way to transfer tickets. I also don't think that no one will make an issue of it for that production. If that was done by the Yankees or MSG there would be a lawsuit.
#17Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 11:59am
Hamilton has done nothing to stop people reselling their tickets right on Ticketmaster for a profit.
When I see the phrase "the ____ estate", I imagine a vast mansion in the country full of monocled men and high-collared women receiving letters about productions across the country and doing spit-takes at whatever they contain.
-Kad
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#19Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 12:16pm
superyan said: "givesmevoice said: "Hamilton has done nothing to stop people reselling their tickets right on Ticketmaster for a profit.
Doing so violates NY State law.
Yes, but I do not believe it would violate NY State law for the Hamilton producers to tell Ticketmaster that if they continue to participate in the resale of tickets they will seek an alternative vendor who will agree not to do this (unless they have a long term contract that prevents their changing vendors; and even if they are so prevented, they could seek to shame them and threaten to use an alternative vendor in future LMM shows).
#20Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 12:30pm
Rainah said: "
What's more, it worked. If you look at the number of secondary market tickets on sale compared to this time last year, there's a huge difference. Those tickets are now in the hands of fans.
"
The original cast was still present a year ago. Yes I know it's still selling out but the resale market has gone down ever since LMM left the show.
#21Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 12:36pm
Andy51 said: "Yes, but I do not believe it would violate NY State law for the Hamilton producers to tell Ticketmaster that if they continue to participate in the resale of tickets they will seek an alternative vendor who will agree not to do this"
Hamilton producers chose Ticketmaster, specifically, to do this because at least when you buy a resold ticket on Ticketmaster, you will actually get in to see the show. StubHub, Craiglist, etc., can't prevent someone from selling the same PDF multiple times. Stopping Ticketmaster doesn't stop the secondary market, only the ability to know you have a valid ticket.
If you read on the U2 user forums, after their last tour had a lot of the better seats only available as ticketless, it was a lot of hassle for people who bought them as a gift for their kids, got pregnant and couldn't attend in the 11 month window before their show started, etc., so wherever you draw the line on how to make this more fair, you will make the scalpers move to that line and affect more legitimate ticket buyers in the process.
If you have a simple solution for this, it usually means it is just introducing a new set of issues.
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#22Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 12:40pm
Andy51 said: "superyan said: "givesmevoice said: "Hamilton has done nothing to stop people reselling their tickets right on Ticketmaster for a profit.
Doing so violates NY State law.
Yes, but I do not believe it would violate NY State law for the Hamilton producers to tell Ticketmaster that if they continue to participate in the resale of tickets they will seek an alternative vendor who will agree not to do this (unless they have a long term contract that prevents their changing vendors; and even if they are so prevented, they could seek to shame them and threaten to use an alternative vendor in future LMM shows).
"
That is true. TicketMaster agreements are extremely sticky, long term and they make it difficult and expensive to switch vendors. The TicketMaster agreement is not with the production of Hamilton, but with the Nederlander Corporation. I just spot-checked all their theaters and they all sell via TicketMaster and not TeleCharge.
I guess if the production is so concerned about what platform the venue uses, they can only look at venues from the Shubert Organization (TeleCharge) or others, but there are other variables in play like having an open theater, etc....
LxGstv
Broadway Star Joined: 11/22/16
#23Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 12:53pm
superyan said: "LxGstv said: "As much as I hate scalpers it's a fairly simple problem to be solved. Harry Potter and the Cursed Child is doing an excellent job at that, unlike Hamilton whose decision to deal with scalpers was "make tickets more expensive". Yeah, that solved the issue. Eye roll.
"
What is Harry Potter and the Cursed Child doing?
"
If I'm not mistaken they were matching up the tickets to ID and anyone who didn't match got turned away... It sucks for whoever paid more and wasn't able to enjoy it but with that policy in place and people being aware of it actually stops the issue. It's simple.
It may take it longer to get people in the theater but I see it as a better alternative than raising prices, which is absolutely fine, they are allowed to charge as much as they want, the demand is there, but don't claim it to be to stop scalpers because it didn't actually stop them, just made it pricier for everyone else.
For me, upping the price to stop scalping just feels like punishing the audience that had nothing to do with it...
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#24Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 1:08pm
haterobics said: "Andy51 said: "Yes, but I do not believe it would violate NY State law for the Hamilton producers to tell Ticketmaster that if they continue to participate in the resale of tickets they will seek an alternative vendor who will agree not to do this"
Hamilton producers chose Ticketmaster, specifically, to do this because at least when you buy a resold ticket on Ticketmaster, you will actually get in to see the show. StubHub, Craiglist, etc., can't prevent someone from selling the same PDF multiple times. Stopping Ticketmaster doesn't stop the secondary market, only the ability to know you have a valid ticket.
If you read on the U2 user forums, after their last tour had a lot of the better seats only available as ticketless, it was a lot of hassle for people who bought them as a gift for their kids, got pregnant and couldn't attend in the 11 month window before their show started, etc., so wherever you draw the line on how to make this more fair, you will make the scalpers move to that line and affect more legitimate ticket buyers in the process.
If you have a simple solution for this, it usually means it is just introducing a new set of issues.
"
Exactly. Paperless ticket are against the law in NY State. There was an issue with Springsteen once where Ticketmaster was the only way to transfer paperless tickets and they charged for it, and there was a glitch and people didn't get into the show.
Having TicketMaster's platform make sure that the ticket is real is pretty valuable.
No one ever speaks of the reverse. Often, I go on the same platform and buy Yankees tickets for pennies on the dollar.
superyan
Understudy Joined: 12/5/16
#25Scalpers
Posted: 12/21/16 at 1:12pm
LxGstv said: "superyan said: "LxGstv said: "As much as I hate scalpers it's a fairly simple problem to be solved. Harry Potter and the Cursed Child is doing an excellent job at that, unlike Hamilton whose decision to deal with scalpers was "make tickets more expensive". Yeah, that solved the issue. Eye roll.
"
What is Harry Potter and the Cursed Child doing?
"
If I'm not mistaken they were matching up the tickets to ID and anyone who didn't match got turned away... It sucks for whoever paid more and wasn't able to enjoy it but with that policy in place and people being aware of it actually stops the issue. It's simple.
It may take it longer to get people in the theater but I see it as a better alternative than raising prices, which is absolutely fine, they are allowed to charge as much as they want, the demand is there, but don't claim it to be to stop scalpers because it didn't actually stop them, just made it pricier for everyone else.
For me, upping the price to stop scalping just feels like punishing the audience that had nothing to do with it...
"
As the other posters said, doing that creates more problems than it solves. It's also against the law in NY.
If you think the production was crying because the show was less affordable, I've got a bridge to sell you.
In my case, I buy tickets for my parents. They aren't big on using the internet. This kind of policy would just complicate my life. I know that my parents can give me their password, but this is a can of worms that doesn't need to be opened.
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