The Bacchae....Anyone?- Page 2

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 2:10am

I saw this tonight, and I have to agree with everyone. It was just a mess of ideas. There were a lot of little ideas thrown around, but no huge ideas to hold them all together. It started off really interestingly and cool with the actors on stage while the audience is coming in and Groff skirting around the stage and playing in the water and stuff. But once the Chorus came on it was all downhill. There was just nothing here to hold your attention. The monologues seemed never ending at times, and there wasn't much in the way of storytelling to help aid the audience along. I laughed out loud at the Chorus' entrance. They were running in and screaming and they were dressed like ninjas of some sort. The woman playing Agave wasn't nearly over-the-top. I thought she was very just "eh" about the whole situation, which is totally wrong considering she just killed her son. She had a really good scream, and then that was it, there was no where else to build the monologue from there. I thought Groff actually did a pretty good job. He wasn't exactly perfect for the part, but I thought he did a fine job with what he was given. He was interesting, which is totally a compliment. I wish they had cast someone else with a more rock star sex appeal because Groff does come off a little Boy Bandish, but like I said, it didn't really ruin anything for me. I thought he did a great job.

The problem lies in the direction and the overall concept. The parts that Groff sang were great. I thought "wow, this is really cool and an interesting take" because it sort of mixes musical theater/opera/Greek Tragedy, but then the Chorus sings over and over and over again and it sort of ruins it. Does every Greek play need a Chorus if synchronized movements? And why did the actors who weren't needed in the scene suppose to slowly walk on, sit, and then slowly walk off? What's the point of that? What was the point of the water on stage? It wasn't used nearly enough to justify it being there. And what was with the fire? It was so sudden and random. I thought the lighting was pretty good, but in the end, I just can't imagine that someone thought about this production for that long and this is what they came up with?

[CAX]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 11:40am

RENTBOY:
Glad you posted. I've been waiting to see more responses to this thing. Maybe people just aren't logging on here to weigh in. A few thoughts about your thoughts...

" It started off really interestingly and cool with the actors on stage while the audience is coming in and Groff skirting around the stage and playing in the water and stuff."

TOTALLY AGREE. It can be a very strong choice, theatrically speaking, to have some of the characters in action as the audience enters. I think it establishes the world of the play well... Breaks the idea of a "play" getting ready to start a little bit.
Groff's entrance was anticlimactic, which perhaps was the intention. Just enters. The bits with the suitcase were somewhat engaging but I felt he didn't play THROUGH anything. It was just sorta hinted at. Sorta walk on stage, sorta play with the water, sorta foreshadow what's going to happen... But the only way to make these older than dirt plays engaging is for us to see the LIFE underneath the status (God, King, Chorus) or whatever... Otherwise you're just playing the idea of something and that gets old FAST.

" I laughed out loud at the Chorus' entrance."

AS DID I!!!!! HAHA. What was puzzling was how some of the 12 of them seemed like they had specific understanding of what their function in the play actually is. The taller, short haired African American woman seemed like she was IN it. but because some of the other ladies looked like general doe eyed "BROADWAY chorus" girls, it made her look CRAZY.

The weird walk ins were just that... WEIRD. There were a few characters who came in very early and didn't speak till the end and I thought, "WHO THE HELL IS THAT PERSON WHO KEEPS ENTERING BUT ISN'T SPEAKING?" Very distracting.

The water could have been used a lot more. The fire under the stage was lame. As I think about it again I just get sad. For somebody this was their first and last Greek play. These plays have the potential to be knock outs. DID ANYONE SEE FIONA SHAW in MEDEA? FANTASTIC!

Can't wait to see more responses.

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 11:56am

Yeah, overall a disappointment. I wish she had used the space more and made it more of an environmental show with the Chorus running through the audience and stuff. I think that would have helped us stay engaged. Also, aren't the women suppose to be like savages? They seemed very nicely dressed to be savages. Also, the play needs SEX. I didn't really get the seduction when Groff "seduces" the other guy into dressing up like a woman. It came off more as comical than a seduction; therefore, I was kind of confused as to why it was all happening in the first place.

[CAX]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 12:07pm

Oh, TOTALLY. I had almost forgot the seduction of Pentheus.... It looked like a weird To Wong Foo moment which was very comical... This could have been a very SCARY, ENTICING theatrical moment.... The undressing of the man, dressing of the woman, as he falls more and more under the spell. That IS the problem. The real problem with staging these plays. You have to be careful not to telegraph the end of the play from the beginning or why should we care? That, and the fact that all the action of these plays takes place OFFSTAGE and the get reported about later is problematic. Perhaps it is the fault of the play itself. Something like Agamemnon or Medea is more immediate... we don't get much "foreshadowing"... Just BOOM! It happens, then we have to deal with the fallout.

That said, I found the actor who played the Messenger who delivered the last speech to be very effective. It was bizarre because he has the "smallest" role in the play and yet he was the most effective in my mind. He was on the scale of the stakes of the play and the night that I went he actually got an ovation.

I had to stifle laughter at the old man and agave during the "banished, banished, banished" segment. Jesus. And her looking at the face. Talk about deep belly laughter.

Did you notice how few laughs there were?

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 2:50pm

Yeah, and the messenger got applause during his scene as well, so good for him for overcoming the awful direction and staging. And I thought Agave was terrible, which sucks because she was so good in "Father Comes Home From the Wars," but whatever.

[bwayrose2]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 4:05pm

For those interested, the Public posted a video about the show. As I mentioned above, I enjoyed it, though it looks like I am in the minority:

http://publictheater.smugmug.com/gallery/9259812_Wc8V8

I'm interested to see if they do more Greek Tragedy next year or if they go back to two Shakespeares. They had HAIR last summer so maybe it's time to go back to the two Shakespeares.

[Eponine]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 6:08pm

I'm planning on seeing it on Tuesday. How has the stand-by line been doing?

Also, since it's 90 minutes, it'll all be over by 10, I'm assuming?

[dramamama611]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 6:35pm

Over by 9:30...out of the park before 10.

I went Thursday night. I think I liked it more than most here....but only liked parts of it.

I couldn't stand the "observers" that would come out and just sit and then leave again. To what point??? I liked the movement of the chorus, but not the singing. And what was up with the amazon woman?

I thought Agave was ATROCIOUS. She was in an enitrely different production than every one else.

Groff and de Shields, while trying, couldn't rise above the misguided direction/vision. I didn't hate either one...but I couldn't quite get sold on them either. It was nice to see Groff as something other than the golden boy....and I think he could have pulled it off in a different production.

Greek theater isn't for everyone, but this didn't even try too hard to be for very many.

[Eponine]

Posted: 8/16/09 at 7:13pm

Thanks.

I'm seeing it with a classics major who's really into Greek stuff so maybe she'll have some insight for me!

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 12:53am

There is information in the Playbill which is useful as the production doesn't try to help explain anything to the audience. And I did the stand-by line on Saturday, and we got offered two tickets by this other couple, so we didn't really do the stand-by line persay, but the people behind us got in as well because we saw them inside the theater. And we got there around 7:40. Oh, and there were a few empty seats inside the theater.

[scott68]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 1:20am

I saw the production on Saturday night, and I agree with literally everything dramamama says.

Overall, I'm glad I saw it, and there were small parts that I loved, but overall it didn't add up to a cohesive production at all.

[mgcproductions]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 3:06am

Jonathan Groff backstage at The Bacchae discussing his role in the productions.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8SShtV1Ryc

[claudioislove]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 11:46am

bwayrose2- and before they did Hair they did Mother Courage, so who knows.

Has anyone gotten up in the morning and done the main line, not standby? what time?:)

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 5:42pm

I hope they don't go back to doing two Shakespeares, but rather, a Shakespeare and a more obscure play. Something like an absurdist play that will probably never get a big revival.

[Corine2]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 6:41pm

I love the cast in the show but painful is an understatement.
It was really very boring. It did not help matters that I had to go to the bathroom and the line before the show was so long that had I gone I would have missed the show. Sadly, I wish I went on line and skipped it. It is really dull.

[CAX]

Posted: 8/17/09 at 7:38pm

It's when I read posts like Rentboy's and Corine that I really wonder how this stuff gets greenlit? and what's more, where is the Artistic Director before this stuff opens? Some very sharp shifts in direction could have saved this trainwreck. Or at least made it more visually appealing. As someone else said, a huge opportunity was MISSED to use the damn water!!!!!!!! What I did not realize until today was that Philip Glass was the HOURS Philip Glass. I love that soundtrack, but even his magic couldn't resurrect this dead horse.

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 8/18/09 at 12:42am

His music is awesome at some points, but at other times it sounds like Prince of Egypt or something.

I'm just not sure what you'd do to save this show. I think it's safe to say that after the reviews come out, it will be super easy to get tickets to this.

[A Director]

Posted: 8/18/09 at 2:20am

RentBoy and Cax - From your comments, it's obvious you know little about Greek tragedy. It might have helped if you had done a google or checked wikipedia before you saw the show.

Cax, you wrote, "That, and the fact that all the action of these plays takes place OFFSTAGE and the get reported about later is problematic. Perhaps it is the fault of the play itself." This is the style of classic Greek theatre. The play is not at fault; the director is. She is over-rated. As soon as I read who was directing this production, I knew it was doomed!

[jansal]

Posted: 8/18/09 at 3:10am

^Agreed! Don't blame the play for your lack of imagination or ability to LISTEN. rather than see. One of my favorite parts of this play (the only greek play I've ever seen live) is that the most repulsive, terrible things that occur are told secondhand and not seen. And I think the herdsman and the messenger are some of the stronger parts of the show. That being said, the play is pretty much a trainwreck. Not quite sure what the heck the director is going for.

[CAX]

Posted: 8/18/09 at 5:36pm

Actually, A Director -

I'm pretty well-versed in the stage conventions of Greek Theatre. Minored in the Classics, have been in, staged and even adapted pieces from the Greek canon... and in fact have seen productions of The Bacchae and Churchill's Mouthful of Birds which is an adaptation of the tale of Dionysus... and still I stand by my statements. I'm not sure if you got what I meant by them.

What I meant, when discussing the convention of reporting action that takes place offstage WAS that a director has a choice when staging this for a contemporary audience. You can perform the play as a museum piece or you can attempt to update the model. How one chooses to do this is up to them... I have seen productions where the action that's being described is represented on stage (video clips, "movement" representation of the act have been some that have worked) and I have seen productions, as this BACCHAE chose to do, where the spectacle is the single actor's retelling of the events, with the aid of music, lights/effects... However you do it, a director must know for an audience whose attention span has been greatly depleted by tv/film and the internet, you run the risk of losing audience members if it's merely a retelling of something we can't actually SEE.

Now, having said this, I personally LOVE the plays as they are written. I think it's an amazing acting challenge to hold that level of focus, intensity and intention of the writing, but I have seen VERY few actors who can actually pull it off. Even the vocal presence that these texts require seem to be missing. It is why the two messengers (older actors) were standouts. I was surprised by Mackie's lack of support considering he went to Julliard.

All the same, as I said in one of my posts, I'm glad these plays are being DONE, I just wish that they were being done more successfully.

[A Director]

Posted: 8/18/09 at 5:40pm

There is a difference between a play and a production.

The play, The Bacchae is a masterpiece.

This production of The Bacchae is a train wreck.

Posted: 8/19/09 at 2:37am

I just want to say that Groff had the audience eating out of the palm of his hand tonight- laughed at everything he did! I thought he was great but as a fan I'm biased. I liked Anthony Mackie too but thought the rest of the production was average at best. Also, didn't see anybody walk out. Updated On: 8/19/09 at 02:37 AM

[Eponine]

Posted: 8/19/09 at 4:52pm

So I watched it last night and I liked it a lot.

We got to the standby line by 5 ish and there were only a couple of people in front of us. However, we didn't get our tickets until 7:50.

Enjoyed the story, the chorus, and the sexy beast that is Jonathan Groff with his Adam Lambert jacket can do no wrong. I thought he was wonderful as Dionysus.
Updated On: 8/22/09 at 04:52 PM

[claudioislove]

Posted: 8/21/09 at 3:47pm

Saw this yesterday, and while I didn't enjoy it as much as Twelfth Night, i definitely DID enjoy it.

First, we got there around 9:00 and the line was ridiculously short, which I found surprising, but comforting, because then I knew I'd get tickets. And then when we saw the show itself, I saw quite a lot of empty seats, including the entire row in front of me (though we WERE in the last row...).

Anyway, I thought Jonathan Groff was awesome. And while people have been attributing disinterest to the fact that a lot of the action is reported instead of acted out, I found these to be the best moments, when I was certainly paying the most attention. If anything, I found the chorus parts most boring, because they just went on and on and on.

I also enjoyed the music, but not when people were singing. Like, the way Dionysus was going, when he sang I wanted him to belt it out. Instead, there was just this light, airy falsetto, that almost ruined the moment for me.

As far as the moment when *spoilers* seduces Pentheus to dress as a woman, I didn't find it humorous at all, and definitely saw the seduction.

But I also didn't understand the people aimlessly wandering onto the stage. It almost felt like the director just wanted us to know that their were in fact more characters in the play.

But all and all, I thought it was quite enjoyable, and definitely a new experience for me, for the only experience I've ever had with Greek Tragedy was reading Antigone in 9th grade. So I definitely think it's worth seeing for free.

Oh, and while you're there, pick up the twelfth night soundtrack (:

...definitely didn't intend to write so much.

Posted: 8/21/09 at 7:10pm

^ Totally, like those guys sitting on the bleachers in suits? I kept wondering why they were there.