Was Kristolyn Lloyd making a dig towards DEH?- Page 2

[VotePeron]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 1:16pm

This brings up a very important conversation but definitely not one the industry is ready to have.

Re: Waitress, they’ve always made sure on broadway that one of the 3 main women are a POC.

Re: Dolls House, Erin joined the same time Steven did, who’s a black man.

Re: DEH, “token” is a harsh word to use, but we’re lying to ourselves if we think otherwise.

Also, we will never see a POC Evan Hansen - audiences would never give him the ridiculous “pass” and empthay they do since he’s just a skinny attractive white kid. Notice how none of his understudies are of color.

I think there’s a difference between color aware casting and color blind casting. And broadway sure as hell has no clue what to do about it. (Except for perfect examples already mentioned, like Comet and Waitress)

[Elfuhbuh]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 1:21pm

Yeah, I don't see why it matters who takes over a part if the role, on paper, is never specified to be a certain race. I thought the idea was to embrace colorblind casting and let POC feel like they're being given the real opportunity to play "normal" roles that aren't tokenized, not furthering the division by continuing the trend of designating POC to THESE specific parts.

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 1:36pm

MEAN GIRLS 

[binau]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 1:39pm

Someone in a Tree2 said: "^ The OriginalBroadway Castof GREAT COMET featured a white actor in the part Patinkin was up for."

And yet the backlash still happened and put everyone out of a job! 

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 2:25pm

I think what Kristolyn has a problem with is that she was brought into DEH to play a white role. She wasn’t allowed to bring any of her own ethnicity into it, besides her appearance. They only cast her, only on her appearance. Not her personality or culture.

[JBradshaw]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 2:58pm

Don’t bring “Chicago” into this. There have been people of color in all the roles. 

Rainah said: "But I think the point people are trying to make is, we should be expecting better 
And sometimes, the answer will be yes. Doubt springs to mind, as rac
But Dear Evan Hansen? Hello Dolly? Next to Normal? Chicago, MFL, Phantom, Waitress, Wicked? So many shows are all white and shouldn't be. MANY of them have casting notices that don't even allow non-white actors to audition."

 

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 3:46pm

Rainah said: "But Dear Evan Hansen? Hello Dolly? Next to Normal? Chicago, MFL, Phantom, Waitress, Wicked? So many shows are all white and shouldn't be. MANY of them have casting notices that don't even allow non-white actors to audition."

I don't want to seem like I'm denying any problem, but a lot of those shows have done well at diverse casting in recent years (although there is definitely room for improvement!). N2N ran for a little under two years and had their original cast there for most of it. While it was all-white, they didn't have many cast turnovers to bring POC in. Also Hello Dolly hasn't been running for very long either, therefore having a similar issue. I completely agree that POC need to be included more and I hope a show like Hello Dolly really makes more of an effort in their future replacement casting.

Also, fact check: at least in recent years, literally none of those shows have asked for white people only except for Glinda in Wicked. While they may have issues with POC, saying they don't even let POC audition isn't actually correct.

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 3:53pm

Call_me_jorge said: "I think what Kristolyn has a problem with is that she was brought into DEH to play a white role. She wasn’t allowed to bring any of her own ethnicity into it, besides her appearance. They only cast her, only on her appearance. Not her personality or culture."

That definitely seemed to be her point. I believe Lloyd was the first black person to touch the role (including workshops and the D.C. run) and it was written with those white women in mind. It's not that this color blind casting is really wrong; it's great that many classic roles written for white people are now being opened for everyone to play them. But it seems like Lloyd is asking for a step further than that, meaning she wants more deep roles that are written with the experiences and cultures of POC in mind, which is absolutely a great thing to fight for.

Even if POC are given the chance to play these roles, it's a POC filling a role that was written to tell a story of white people. Even if nothing is explicitly about race, it was written with white people's lives and experiences in mind. It's time for some stories of POC experiences.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 4:14pm

Just saying there's no reason the families in DEH can't be mixed race giving us an ethnic Evan Hansen. But it will never happen. They'll keep churning out the dorky white guys.

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 4:18pm

RippedMan said: "Just saying there's no reason the families in DEH can't be mixed race giving us an ethnic Evan Hansen. But it will never happen. They'll keep churning out the dorky white guys."

Agreed. Whenever Olivia Puckett goes on for Zoe, it's two white parents, a white brother, and a mixed race daughter. It's theatre, people can easily suspend their disbelief.

[LaneBryant]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 4:32pm

qolbinau said: "I doubt it’s a dig at a specific show - maybe the culture of casting in general. But sad for her to think she might have been cast for token ‘diversity’ (or racial diversity* more specifically - I want to continue to challenge the notion that diversity is just skin-deep). Maybe she was cast because she was the best person for the role? At least, I hope so. 

Unfortunately, we all have to call BULL and SHIIIII. That show was in DC with an all white cast. People were throwing around the name, "Dear Evan Hansen: A New American Musical." When they opened that show, they had EVERY intention of bringing that EXACT cast to Broadway. The show opened, and suddenly people are writing the Washington Post PISSED that a "new american musical" has cast only white people.... 

Those WHITE producers looked at that cast and said, "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe, One of you White people has to go! Lets cast a random Black girl in that little role" Then they climbed back out of the whole they were hiding in and said, "See!!! We filled our diversity quote! Is everybody happy? Please don't boycott us!!!" 

It's show BUSINESS! They didn't re-write a single line of that character to showcase a Black girls POV or sensibilities in 2016. THEY DONT CARE. UGH!!!!!

 

[dearalanaaaa]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 4:43pm

I feel like there is a lack of POC in DEH, and also in Bandstand. Lloyd is absolutely correct in digging at DEH after leaving it. I remember last May when Dear Ethnic Hansen became a hashtag for a few weeks, then it disappeared after that. I'd love a sensation mixed Hansen, with a black loving mother. It would be amazing to see a Latino Connor, or an Asian Jared. I was representation! It would humanize them just a bit more. People demonize mixed or latino people but maybe these roles would see we arent violent criminals and "rapists". We're people.
I will never forget when we had a production of a musical in fifth grade. I was one of 3 people of color to be chose to be in it. They gave me, the most white passing of us three the line "music doesn't care what color you are" and even at that age (what was I? 12?) I realized it's so wrong to be the only POC and my whole point was to show representation. Her feelings are vaild.
She has every right to dig at Hansen, and she probably should.

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 6:56pm

Jared is specifically written to be a white jewish boy from the suburbs. Not a great example there.  But yes, Evan could be POC - that's fine. Hopefully they eventually make it so. 

[RippedMan]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 7:15pm

Can we also get rid of the nerdy Jewish boy thing?

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 8:19pm

Stereotypes exist because they're partially true, whether it's politically correct or not. 

[Ahmy]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 10:53pm

Wasn't Bright Star an unnecessarily all-white cast as well?
 

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/19/18 at 11:42pm

Liza's Headband said: "Stereotypes exist because they're partially true, whether it's politically correct or not."

I don’t think we want to dive too deeply into the discussion of what you just said...

[binau]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 4:27am

Evan could totally be a POC. The idea that he has to be an attractive skinny white boy is just not true of at least one of the Evans. I’m not going to say which because I have had posts deleted on this very subject before.

[gypsy101]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 4:40am

you think Ben Platt is ugly which is simply not true, he’s adorable.

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 4:59am

gypsy101 said: "you think Ben Platt is ugly which is simply not true, he’s adorable."

It’s also not relevant (and arguably never has been?). qolbinau, your aversion to Platt’s face doesn’t make any sense to bring up now, especially because no one disagrees with your main point, that not every Evan has to be white. What does your opinion on Platt’s attractiveness have to do with this?

[binau]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 5:04am

I am directly responding to a post in this very thread that claimed Evan has to be an attractive, white skinny male for the show to work.

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 5:10am

Where was that?

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 5:12am

qolbinau said: "I am directly responding to a post in this very thread that claimed Evan has to be an attractive, white skinny male for the show to work. "

This also matters less. You said the show could work without an attractive Evan because it has, which is a) a matter of opinion and b) not what we’re discussing.

[binau]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 5:25am

Elegance101 said: "Where was that?"

Post #25. 

[dearalanaaaa]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 8:40am

qolbinau said: "I am directly responding to a post in this very thread that claimed Evan has to be an attractive, white skinny male for the show to work. "

I haven't seen any Evan that was mildly attractive, despite being white. There's no excuse NOT to have a POC Evan.