'Assassins' questions

[BroadwayBoy2005]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 8:38am

Obviously I never saw 'Assassins', but I have a few questions based on what I heard on the CD (the new one).

1. In "What Does A Man Do?", I'm not understanding the point of that at all. I can't really explain it any better- I just don't get it.

2. What is the main difference between the Proprietor and the Balladeer? I didn't put 2 and 2 together til yesterday and realize that Balladeer has the word Ballad in it, so I guess that means he is one who sings ballads. But that kind of puts the proprietor in disuse, doesn't it? I mean, what good is he because all I can tell is he invites the assassins to shoot the presidents and make other little cameos throughout the score.

3. I get the feeling that this musical has many moral messages. I mean, yeah, 'Everbody's Got The Right' is full of them, but in the songs that don't flat out say the morals, I don't know, I just feel them there. I know that's kind of way out there, but I just wanted to see what anyone else thought.

-bb2005

Posted: 8/13/04 at 8:48am

Oh, Assassins... How I love thee. Amazing.

'What does a man do'. What's it for? Just a track for me to skip after I recite the first line in that accent. I wish they had the scene with Emma and James er Czolgosz.

The proprietor and the balladeer are like opposites. The proprietor is sneaky, bald, H.O.T. and unsympathetic, leaning toward the "evil" side. He's the temptor, I think, the snake. The balladeer is truthful, country, and Doogie Howser. He tells it like it is. He's the teacher: why these people did what they did, what we learn from it, what *they* should learn from it.

[FreakyMartian]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 9:04am

1. In "What Does A Man Do?", I'm not understanding the point of that at all. I can't really explain it any better- I just don't get it.

In the show, Emma Goldman (Anne Nathan) is the anarchist that gives the speech; Czolgosz has been following her from city to city without really knowing why. She meets Czolgosz in the train station and encourages him to take a stand for himself and not let himself be kept down. Although she does not specifically suggest it, meeting her gives Czolgosz the inspiration to meet President McKinley at the Pan American Exposition in Buffalo and shoot him.

I don't really know why they cut the dialog tracks the way they did, but I think they are trying to make it very clear that the immediately preceding dialog track tends to demonstrate the motive for the assassin being described in the next track (Zangara, Czolgosz, etc.).

2. What is the main difference between the Proprietor and the Balladeer? I didn't put 2 and 2 together til yesterday and realize that Balladeer has the word Ballad in it, so I guess that means he is one who sings ballads. But that kind of puts the proprietor in disuse, doesn't it? I mean, what good is he because all I can tell is he invites the assassins to shoot the presidents and make other little cameos throughout the score.

The role of the Proprietor being expanded was from what I understand it was Joe Mantello's "experiment" with the show and it was with this understanding that Kudisch took the role in the first place. Originally he just sang "Everybody's Got the Right" and disappeared from the show. In the new production he acted as a sort of opposing force to the Balladeer - the Balladeer kind of represents the common man who can't understand the assassins and why they did what they did. The Proprietor, although he doesn't say much and only sings in "Everybody's Got the Right" and "Another National Anthem" is a force that silently urges the assassins forward...he helps John Hinckley find the right chords in the beginning of "Unworthy of Your Love," he hands Czolgosz the gun during The Ballad of Czolgosz... it is weird because Booth kind of takes over that role in the final scene with Lee Harvey Oswald in a verbose way... but anyway, the Proprietor in its current state was an experiment with the show that Joe Mantello wanted to try. A lot of people thought it was really cool, and I thought it definitely added another dimension to the show for people to question and come up with possible theories for - because in general, this show offers little explanation or apology for what it says, and its up to the audience to decide what it means.

I hope at least some of that made sense.

[Millie42]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 9:04am

1. Czolgosz is, for lack of a better word, infatuated with the activist speaking on "What does a man do?" He goes to all her speaking engagement and her message of throwing of oppression is what motivates him to assassinate Pres McKinley. There is a scene where after the speech he stops her and talks with her.

2. The Proprietor runs the "Shoot to Win" game. He eggs everyone on. He also plays other roles like the executioner. He is the one that hangs Guiteau and flips the switch on Zangara.
The Balladeer is more optimistic and kind of summarizes the stories. He kind of just hangs around and watches the scenes of the assassinations. My favorite is right after Booth has committed suicide, he starts with the upbeat "Johnny Booth was a head-strong fella..." and Booth sits up and gives him a dirty look.

3. I think thats kind of the cool thing that you sense the morals and it doesnt clearly state any. Its one of those plays where you walk out just thinking about everything. It has such chilling lines. It is full of such contradictions and thats what makes it so cool. Like, Unworthy of your love is a beautiful song... and then you realize that a stalker is singing it...and that a woman is singing it to Charles Manson while she is carving something like a swastika on her forehead. It makes you challenge what you have been taught and thats just cool!

[FinnFanatic]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 9:07am

The "What Does A Man Do?" track is the ending of one of Emma Goldman's speeches that is heard right before a scene between her and Leon Czolgosz. He has been following her around the country. Her speeches inspire him and he tells her he has fallen in love with him. During the scene, Emma actually says to him "The idea wan't mine alone....but mine." If you notice, during "The Ballad of Czolgosz", the balladeer says that Czolgosz said this line about assassinating President McKinley. "The idea wasn't mine alone, but mine, and that's a sign..In the USA you can have your say, etc" The track is there just to lead into "The Gun Song" and "The Ballad of Czolgosz". After all, Emma Goldman seems to have had a very large impact on why Czolgosz assassinated McKinley. I, too, wish they had included the scene between Goldman and Czolgosz. It is a very tender scene.

Just like SarahHIYE mentioned, the Proprietor's role is to help everything happen. I don't think he necessarily FORCES all the action, he simply facilitates it and urges it on. He is active in the assassinations. The Balladeer is more of just the storyteller. He does not get invovled in any of the action, he is merely looking on from the outside and telling the stories. I believe the Assassins are AWARE of his presence, however. During "Another National Anthem", the Assassins gather around the Balladeer and force him into becoming Lee Harvey Oswald. After looking on and making so many comments throughout the show, the Balladeer ends up becoming the most well-known assassin of them all. That moment was one of my favorites from the show. It's a sham you didn't get the chance to see it!

I hope that answers your questions. Updated On: 8/13/04 at 09:07 AM

Posted: 8/13/04 at 9:29am

Can we just never stop talking about Assassins, please? I love it so... I literally haven't stopped listening to it since I got it. You'd figure I'd have gotten sick of it by now, but I haven't! I wish they'd recorded this for video sale. I love everyone in this cast. And I hope Sondheim lives forever.

Thank you for reading my rant.

[marebare]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 10:48am

WHY did I not see this???!!! Updated On: 8/13/04 at 10:48 AM

Posted: 8/13/04 at 10:57am

You didn't see this because people are stupid and it closed earlier than it should have. There wasn't even time to fight the earlier closing. One minute there were goig to be here til October, the next minute they're closing next week.

I hate it when this happens. The bosses suck. They cancelled Angel. They closed Assassins. Plus countless other atrocities, but these are the two that still hurt me. At least when Assassins closed they didn't kill of the more intricate character from the series (Wesley). True, Angel was a TV show and Assassins a musical, so it's a little easier to kill off a character...

Sorry. I'm ranting.

[marebare]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 11:05am

Not to mention "Caroline"...this is too depressing!

[Qfan]

Posted: 8/13/04 at 12:57pm

the part with the Balladeer in the Proprieter/Balladeer question i have another take you don't have to like it but here is my thoughts on him.

In the Ballad of Booth He sort of respects Booth.(which in my opinion helps the change for this production in another national anthem) Then In the Ballad of Czolgosz he sort of turns a little to not liking Czolgosz. And The Ballad of Guiteau, he justs respects Guiteau's ambitions. So when in "another Naional Anthem" when they crowd around him and then they leave and he looks slightly shocked that he is Oswald it proves that even though you might've not liked them you can become one. Which is why i believe the changes made to the show you know like proprietor in the rest of the show and balladeer is also oswald works.

But, then again that's one persons opinion.

Posted: 8/13/04 at 2:31pm

I *personally* do not think that the Balladeer respects Guiteau AT ALL. I think he think's that he's the most foolish one of all. And I have no idea what he thinks of Czolgosz except what I can get off the recording. Because whenever James was onstage my eyes never left him. hehe

[Millie42]

Posted: 8/14/04 at 12:29am

You know, it really is horrible that it closed even before the OBC was released. I will forever love the CD but I do b/c I can see the show in my head. I hate that others havent and I just cannot not do it justice by describing the set and the irony and the action. A lot of the power and the humor is lost without having seen the production.

"I am a terrifying and imposing figure!"
Me: laughing hysterically
my sister: blank stare

This just makes me think of how I could have seen it a time or two more had it not been ended so suddenly... I realize how lucky I am to have seen it twice.
What made it most sad is how it hit the actors hard, as well.

[serendipity9]

Posted: 8/14/04 at 1:07am

I'm new to the board but I've been an avid Assassins fan for about five years and studying the show. I know Joe Mantello and have had a few conversations with him about the show as well.

The Balladeer and the Proprietor:
It's not as clear cut as the 'good' and 'evil' ones. The Balladeer's purpose, especially in the beginning, is to be someone the audience can identify. Generally the audience won't invest themselves, onstage, with the people they see as wrong or 'evil' so the Balladeer is someone much more like the average person. Though, also like the average person, he often mocks the Assassins for their 'excuses' putting them at a lower place and yet eventually becoming their ultimate spokesperson, so to speak.

The Proprietor is similar to a ringleader for the Assassins. He's very much more an abstract than a real character. Their little spirit to give them a hand here or there - the accomplice that can't be connected to the crime. Someone here said that the extention of the character was an experiment which it very much was. The fault in the experiment is that, as written, Booth does a similar, egging on to the rest of the Assassins. But nothing can be perfect... In the reprise of 'Everybody' the Proprietor stands to the side and watches the assassins, similar IMO to an artist admiring a finished product. One thing that I also thought was brilliant is that Marc Kudisch (Proprietor) does all the 'voice-overs' in the script, including an amazing Reagan impression after Unworthy. This makes the lines much more potent than just having the voice.

I know this is getting long BUT
A few obvious themes of the show are understanding/perspective, Love, Who is Ultimately True and the more underlying theme Grief.
And, of course, what really is the american dream:
Before Marc actually begins singing 'Everybody' the ensemble (in all white - they are always in all white costumes) stand at the back of the stage waving, etc as confetti falls creating the Postcard Perfect American Dream - quickly followed by Marc's aggressive confrontations with the assassins about their own dreams.
Many of the songs are just trying to show the humanity in a type of person that is shrugged off as being "An Assassin" and not a person.
One thing that I find interesting (or should I say one more, lol, I'm sorry but I do love Assassins and I've been analyzing it for a while) is that one of Sondheim's most melodic and beautiful songs, Unworthy of Your Love was written for two attempted assassins to their unhealthy obsessions. -Just food for thought.
I'll stop now. But I hope I helped a bit!

[cabarethed]

Posted: 8/14/04 at 1:29am

I hate it when this happens. The bosses suck. They cancelled Angel. They closed Assassins. Plus countless other atrocities, but these are the two that still hurt me. At least when Assassins closed they didn't kill of the more intricate character from the series (Wesley). True, Angel was a TV show and Assassins a musical, so it's a little easier to kill off a character...

Wow Sarah, are you and I one and the same??

When watching Assassins, a new realization and impact would hit me every time. Unfortunately, that only happened 3 times, but I'm thrilled and privileged to have those 3. There are so many layers and so many perfect details that one can't discover it all in 1 viewing...or 5...or 10! Honestly, I have had the CD on nonstop, and I'm still constantly delighted. I respected Sondheim before this show, but now I dare say I might love him.