Any Doctor Who Fans? **UK AIR-DATE SPOILERS ABOUND**- Page 45

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 5/29/10 at 11:21pm

I am SO pissed off what happened to Rory. He was becoming my favorite character and now he isn't even going to be remembered. And I don't think Matt Smith's Doctor is cruel. If Amy would have touched Rory, she would have been forgotten too, because the light was all ready engulfing him. But, MY GOD I am pissed off.

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 5/29/10 at 11:26pm

I was quite angry as well, but then again, my favorite characters always die. I still feel like the Doctor should've either a) got them in the TARDIS the first time and left the crack alone or b) at least dragged Rory's body into the TARDIS before the light got to him, especially if he knew that would happen if they left Rory there.

Now there's a complicated moral dilemma for him: he knows that Rory existed and it's his fault that he's dead, but Amy's forgotten that. So he's sort of got away with it. But that's wrong. So wrong. I want to see where this goes.

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 5/29/10 at 11:31pm

A part of me thinks that Rory will make a return in the finale (or I reeeeeeeally hope so), because the ring box was still there after Amy forgot him. But, I am still not happy at this. They built him up and then BAM.....he's gone. Also, if the Doctor stuck his hand in the light, wouldn't it have started to erase him from existence too?

[kec]

Posted: 5/29/10 at 11:56pm

Remember in a past episode the Doctor said that time can be -- it was either rewritten or unwritten... Either way, I got the impression from an interview Arthur Darvill did on BBC Breakfast earlier this week that we haven't seen the last of Rory. But it made me very upset. *sob* A brilliant episode though.

" b) at least dragged Rory's body into the TARDIS before the light got to him, especially if he knew that would happen if they left Rory there. "

He had to get Amy back into the TARDIS, otherwise she would have disappeared as well. I don't think he had much choice.

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 5/30/10 at 8:50am

I feel like they had a little bit of time. Or maybe not. I have to watch again.

And you're right, spider. He should have gotten sucked in, especially since in 'Flesh and Stone' the Angels told him that he could be absorbed by the crack.

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 5/30/10 at 5:18pm

I'm not EVEN going to lie; I actually cried watching this. haha I miss him so much, even though I am enjoying the new season immensely.
"My Way"

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 5/31/10 at 12:58am

haha

[Plum]

Posted: 5/31/10 at 4:48am

Oh, Rory's totally coming back. Maybe not as we left him, and maybe Amy won't remember him, but he'll be back. There were too many threads left hanging for it to go any other way - the true nature of Amy's Crack, the ring box in the TARDIS, the Doctor's repeated talk about certain points in history being flexible as opposed to fixed.

I'm not really seeing how Eleven is cruel, myself, especially coming after Ten. He was certainly a lot nicer to Ambrose than I would have been in the same position. But then, he wasn't the only one being insanely forgiving in "Cold Blood" - Moe had been dissected while awake by that nice-seeming scientist and he didn't once try to kill said scientist with his bare hands.

This two-parter was quite good for Chibnall writing, and I appreciated the optimism and idealism of it, but oh, the discontinuity between the two parts. Oy. There was also a bit too much telling instead of showing, but again, that's Chibnall for you.

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 5/31/10 at 11:17am

Moe was unusually calm for a guy who's been both dissected and had his son taken from him. He is a shining example of calmness.

I should probably amend that Eleven is cruel. He's not. I think what I meant is that, emotionally speaking, he's not quite aware of what other people need. And that the cruel part is the fact that he remembers what happened but Amy doesn't, which seems sort of wrong in that he gets away with letting Amy down (because, as we saw in 'Amy's Choice', she would have been furious had she remembered). Which doesn't make him cruel, for now. But it is a bit wrong. But, Moffat being who he is, there will probably be consequences.

Ten is a bit cruel as well. Actually, that's what I like about him. It makes him ten times more interesting than if he were just perfectly nice. (And, the way I see it none of the Doctors in the new series have been perfectly nice so far.)

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 5/31/10 at 11:49am

Really, none of the Doctors have been "nice." William Hartnel was a crotchety grandfather....Pewtree called people "imbeciles" all the time....Baker rubbed it in people's faces that he was superior....etc. That's what makes this character so iconic. He's not Superman, flying around time being noble. He is a flawed character who just happens to get himself in bad situations. If you ask people who they remember in a movie, or tv show, it is usually ALWAYS the villain. The Doctor is a hero but he has the mindset of a villain, and, as we have seen before, it presents itself from time to time. That is why he needs a companion - to make him remember who he is and what he can achieve.

Updated On: 5/31/10 at 11:49 AM

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 5/31/10 at 12:11pm

I love those bits of the show, where it becomes evident that the Doctor needs his companion so far. It was most obvious with Donna and in the Specials, which is why I like Series 4 and beyond. If any of the Doctors had actually been really nice I probably wouldn't have watched the show. That struggle with his power/more villainous aspects actually makes it better when the Doctor makes a sacrifice.

[kec]

Posted: 6/1/10 at 10:54pm

Found this bit of fan fiction online; it takes place in the TARDIS just after what happened to Rory:
Another Lingering Battle

[Eastwickian]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 11:16am

Remember the bit in Flesh and Stone where Amy was blind in the forest and the Doctor came back to her to say something along the lines of "You must remember me, Amy, you mustn't forget"? He said more or less exactly the same after Rory was wiped out by the light - I'm thinking there is much 'Moffaty-wibbley-wobbley' stuff going on! I'm sure Rory will be back, but I'm not sure what kind of happy ending (if any) him and Amy will get...

Wasn't that fussed by the actual two-parter itself, it was a passable mid-season filler I suppose. Beyond rehashing their first appearance, there isn't that much more it did with the Silurians.


The Doctor is a hero but he has the mindset of a villain, and, as we have seen before, it presents itself from time to time. That is why he needs a companion - to make him remember who he is and what he can achieve.

I agree; I'm not sure he's a got a villain’s mindset so much as he sometimes has a very different way of getting from A to B and, despite his best efforts, he still needs someone to provide that link - humanize him if you like. Right from the very first story, where Ian stops the Doctor killing the wounded savage they're carrying, he's been morally ambiguous and increasingly it is the companion who provides an emotional solution to a problem which the Doctor would never have reached (the release of the star whale and the battle for control of Bracewell being two very recent examples).

[Weez]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 1:24pm

Oh, WHAT?! I have just watched this recent episode and am DEEPLY unimpressed! That had better NOT be it for Rory! *is grumpy*

Updated On: 6/2/10 at 01:24 PM

[JbaraFan1]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 1:35pm

Rumor has it Rory's in the two-part finale

[kec]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 3:39pm

I have seen a photo from the two-part finale, and in this photo is a man with his back to the camera. The hairstyle is very familiar...

[ghostlight2]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 5:01pm

"Remember the bit in Flesh and Stone where Amy was blind in the forest and the Doctor came back to her to say something along the lines of 'You must remember me, Amy, you mustn't forget?' "

I think he said something a little closer to her that it was very important that she remembers what he told her as a child, but I think you're onto something, Eastwickian. If you watch that episode again, the Doctor is only gone for a moment before he returns to Amy, but if you're watching very closely, the Doctor is wearing his jacket when he returns to her - but he lost his jacket when he'd had to shrug out of it when the angels grabbed it. He's not wearing the jacket in the Tardis later, either.

Coud be a continuity error, but I think the Doctor who returned to Amy in the woods was not the Doctor who had just left her, but rather one from the future< and that scene was a foreshadowing of some sort.

If that makes any sense.

[kec]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 7:35pm

It does make sense ghostlight... in fact, a lot of people have shared the theory that the Doctor who told her she had to remember what he told her when she was 7 was not the same Doctor who had walked away a few moments before.

[ghostlight2]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 7:53pm

So I'm not completely insane? Thanks for letting me know I'm not alone in that theory, kec. I'm a comparative newcomer to Doctor Who, but I'm completely hooked since Eleven's arrival.

I've seen that episode twice, and the first thing that struck me in that scene was a complete change in the Doctor's attitude upon his return. There just didn't seem that enough time had elapsed for such a drastic change in his mood. I didn't notice the jacket until the second viewing.

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 8:41pm

Eastwickian, that's a good theory. Perhaps the Doctor telling Amy to remember what he told her has to do with Rory's being forgotten. Or even worse, he's worried that Amy herself is starting to cease to exist (which would be why she loses memory of what he told her). He stresses that memory can keep Rory 'alive' in their minds. So maybe it's the same with Amy's own existence?

There's a lot of stress on the crack being able to wipe Amy from existence. What I want to know is why she's so special?

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 10:29pm

I am reading this now:




TRIVIA: Did you know that Davies did not originally want Donna to be the companion in season 4? He wanted to create a brand new character named Penny.

I haven't gotten far enough to find out why he changed his mind (which I am SO glad he did).

[kec]

Posted: 6/2/10 at 11:23pm

I'm about 3/4 of the way through the book (just read the part about how David made the announcement of his departure from Who). This is a really interesting read. It's made me laugh a LOT and even cry.

That revelation was a surprise... and it's interesting to read how it all worked out.

Edited to add I was referring to the revelation about a new character for series four instead of Donna. Although the story about how David's announcement came about was pretty interesting as well.
Updated On: 6/3/10 at 11:23 PM

[Eastwickian]

Posted: 6/3/10 at 5:02am

I've read the original edition and it's a really great book - I caved in and bought the revised version as well but not got around to flicking through it yet.

the first thing that struck me in that scene was a complete change in the Doctor's attitude upon his return. There just didn't seem that enough time had elapsed for such a drastic change in his mood. I didn't notice the jacket until the second viewing.

I didn't notice the jacket until I read about it on the internet, it was the complete change of mood that alerted me too!

[GuitarGirl]

Posted: 6/3/10 at 7:36am

I just finished reading it. It's interesting to see the writing process and what Davies thinks of everything, as well as all the work that goes into an episode of Doctor Who. Sounds exhausting! And I love the bits of script that pop up now and again.

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 6/5/10 at 8:31pm

"Vincent and the Doctor" was SUCH a disappointing/throw-a-way episode. Except for the last 10 minutes (which was beautifully done), I really didn't like it. Blah!

Updated On: 6/5/10 at 08:31 PM