Crystal Meth -- Is it really surprising?- Page 3

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 1:33pm

Sure, you see them out having fun, but what you don't see is what happens AFTER the party's over. It's not a pretty picture.

[WithoutATrace]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 1:34pm

yes, the stuff that happens after the party is what i *never* want to experience.

[Plum]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 1:57pm

See, I'm the other way around. After finding that every party at my college was pretty much the same party and pretty damn uninteresting, all I've been seeing is the aftermath. Vomit in random places? Check. Fights? Check. Urine in random places? Yep. Ah, the joys of living by the frat boys.

[DAME]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 1:59pm

Yur partys sound pretty mild.

[Plum]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 2:02pm

It's a quiet college- that's one of the reasons I went there. So having arrests, crap in the showers, and someone who, for no apparent reason, went around peeing on people's doors, was something of a shock at first, and pretty damn annoying for the rest of the year.

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 2:05pm

Sounds like every college I've ever heard of....

[Plum]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 2:06pm

I guess I was spoiled freshman year, then. :)

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 6:14pm

While on an assignment six months ago I had the pleasure of spending a lot of time talking with a researcher from the Harvard School of Medicine. She was just finishing up a two city study of young men who have sex with men and their use of club drugs and how it influenced their sexual behavior. The two cities were NYC and Boston.

She's very clear on a lot of things. And one of them is that it does nobody any good to assume the role of disapproving school marm with arms crossed over ample bosoms and tsk tsk tsking "the young people of today."

She had no patience for people "of a certain age" saying "after all we went through in the AIDS epidemic, how dare these young people take foolish risks?"

She points out again and again that young people's bodies are HARD WIRED to want sex. And lots of it. With lots of partners. And it's young people's JOBS to experiment with drugs and altered states of consciousness. It's what they DO!

No amount of hand-wringing and criticizing the way "these young people" behave will do a thing to change behaviors. No amount of fear-mongering will steer them clear of certain dangerous drugs, thanks to the outlaw mystique that gets created by certain nerdy types from older generations who use fear tactics and simple sloganeering like "Just Say No" to something as exciting as sex and drugs.

People (and it may be linked to genetic origins) tend to want one of two types of altered states. Some want to speed up, to feel confident, and sexual, and electric and alive. Others want to slow down. To quiet the endless monolgue in their heads, to disassociate a bit from the hyper-mediated jump cut world of today, to feel warm, and sleepy and calm. And there is a WHOLE HOST of chemicals that provide those feelings for people.

For the former, you've got caffeine, cocaine, ephedrine, amphetamine.

For the latter, you've got alcohol, benzodiazapines, marijuana, opiate derviatives like heroin.

Obviously, all of these things are not like the others. Heroin and Crystal are the two most extreme variations on the opposite ends of the spectrum and they provide INCREDIBLE pleasure at first, and then quickly have people in their grips before they are able to get out.

The other drugs, without so much of a chemical dependency, are, in general, the drugs that most people leave behind in their 20s and 30s, just because it gets harder get out of bed the morning after and longer to recover from a night of fun and frolic.

But some don't get out because they are caught in addiction. And there isn't actually a lot of support for people to help them get off drugs. And that's because as a culture, we have great difficulty dealing with the idea of pleasure. Or with spending money to HELP people when they need it.

Remember, people do drugs because they feel REALLY good. And anybody who says that isn't true, hasn't done the right drugs for them.

It's pretty hard to tell "young people" that they oughtn't do them at all, when every other ad is telling you to ask your doctor if this pill or that pill is right for you.

Crystal is dangerous as hell because it rewires brain chemistry (as does the whole class of SSRIs that doctors give out like candy, but I digress) and it is very hard for people to feel human again after feeling such intense pleasure. Sex off crystal simply cannot compare to sex on crystal. And it's very hard for people not to slip back into using, because it so messes up the production and release of dopamine, the pleasure chemicals in the brain.

My advice? Do what you want, kids, just not Crystal or Heroin. Those are the BIG baddies. And know about the others. And plan what you are going to do, what's acceptable to you, and be PREPARED. Do whatever it takes to reduce the possibility of harm to yourself or anybody else.

Be real.

Dance Safe

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 6:58pm

I have never really responded to anything that you have posted Namo, but I feel the need now....

YOU SAY, "But some don't get out because they are caught in addiction. And there isn't actually a lot of support for people to help them get off drugs. And that's because as a culture, we have great difficulty dealing with the idea of pleasure. Or with spending money to HELP people when they need it.

Remember, people do drugs because they feel REALLY good. And anybody who says that isn't true, hasn't done the right drugs for them."

Sorry, but there is tons of help for people, they just need to ask for it if they need it.

And as for the quote, "For the former, you've got caffeine, cocaine, ephedrine, amphetamine.

For the latter, you've got alcohol, benzodiazapines, marijuana, opiate derviatives like heroin."

Congratulations on giving them a map.

No one on this thread is speaking down to anyone. There is no "Hand Wringing" or "School Marming" going on. We are just sharing our stories with the warning, "Yes, this happens to almost anyone. Just be careful."

Why is it you must twist EVERYTHING?

Oh, and as for passing yourself off as Bruce Vilanch (Or at least, not being FULLY honest about it)... I know Bruce Vilanch, and you, sir, are NO Bruce Vilanch.

[ikmbway]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 7:26pm

Im a young one reading this. Just like My Fair Lady, although i think im younger then him/her but my school is just like that. I have a friend who smokes (she isn't in my school though) and I have friends in my school that drink and have sex/kiss a lot. (I'm not telling my age but just telling you it's too young some of the kids arent even 13 yet). But once I go to another school next year more people are going to get into drinking, smoking, and sex. There are like 15 year olds in my town that are pregnant, others that do whatever they want, and others like me who have protective parents and don't do bad stuff. Well except for sometimes, I've gotten in trouble but nothing major and because I hang out with people who get in trouble I'm usually a witness or have there backs.
Updated On: 6/21/05 at 07:26 PM

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 7:27pm

You can rise above them!

[ikmbway]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 7:31pm

"You can rise above them!"
are you saying that to me?
Oh and also kids I know get suspended/expelled from school too for beating people up or doing pot and stuff. And my camp counselor who is 20 now had her first french kiss at 11!!!

[My Fair Lady]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 7:46pm

My neighborhoos is worse. In one of the publci schools, a girl got pregnant when she was 12.

Posted: 6/21/05 at 7:53pm

". . . it's young people's JOBS to experiment with drugs and altered states of consciousness. It's what they DO!"

It may be what they allow themselves to do, but I can't quite go along with some notion that it's what they HAVE to do.

And I must agree somewhat with Diva that there seems to be quite a bit of information floating around out there. As the old saying goes, "You can lead a horse to water . . ."

And I personally have a bit of trouble chalking things up to the notion of 'that's what they do.' Again, they don't HAVE to - and you know what? Many don't.

[ikmbway]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 8:15pm

A 13 year old in my twon got pregnant. But then again some girls have gotten pregnant at like 10 or 11!

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 8:24pm

"And it's young people's JOBS to experiment with drugs and altered states of consciousness. It's what they DO!"

Really? I, and most people I know, missed that memo.

[Elphaba]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 8:37pm

Yikes Namo....what a crock.

you said:

"Remember, people do drugs because they feel REALLY good. And anybody who says that isn't true, hasn't done the right drugs for them."

No, people do drugs to escape their current life. And it's right back there when they come down.

Telling kids to do drugs Namo, is just plain ole disgusting......and this "fuddy-duddy" thinks you are full of ca-ca.

I've enjoyed other of your posts, but this crosses the line...and is so totally inappropriate that it's insulting to anyone here.

Updated On: 6/21/05 at 08:37 PM

[Plum]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 9:06pm

Maybe some kids feel compelled to do drugs- heaven knows there have been a few times when I wondered how much pot or alcohol it would take to get me to forget my troubles- but seriously, don't encourage it. Psychological addiction isn't a pretty thing, either.

As awkward as it is, the "what's your anti-drug" campaign has an grain of truth to it. There are ways to make yourself happy- even things to get addicted to- that won't affect your body and mind the way drugs do. Hobbies, friendships, whatever. Pharmaceuticals are a hollow and temporary solution to your problems, and expensive and illegal to boot. And if you think I'm a schoolmarm, I really don't give a crap. Better a bit prudish than hospitalized or arrested.

[Adoannie925]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 9:09pm

I have a good friend who was consumed by cocaine and meth. My friend and I have known each other since the 8th grade, when she began dabbling in cocaine, and we recently graduated high school together. Basically, cocaine was her drug of choice, but financially, when she couldn't afford it she'd turn to meth since it has similar effects. She'd show up to class high everyday and then try to quit, but just couldn't. It took numerous overdoses, and finally, she overdosed at home and her father put her in a program. This was just last year...meth took away four years of her life, and today, she's going on one year sober and I've never seen her so happy. She wants to get her drug counseling certificate and become a drug counselor for a rehab program. She and I used to dabble in things together, but meth was something I'd never, and still will never touch.
Updated On: 6/21/05 at 09:09 PM

[robbiej]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 9:44pm

'No, people do drugs to escape their current life.'

That is CERTAINLY not always the case. That's a major generalization. Many people who develop serious addictions more than likely are trying to escape emotional problems. But not every person who takes a drug is doing that. And let's not forget the millions that are under doctors' care (sometimes the wrong doctor) who take drugs daily because they want to escape their current mind set.

My niece is 18 and smokes pot occasionally. What am I going to say to her? I mean...I've been known to take a toke once in a while. So do I just say, 'Do as I say, not as I do?' No. I tell her if she's going to do so, do it only with people she trusts, who will take care of her (not take advantage of her). I tell her to make smart, resonsible choices to keep her out of trouble.

My younger nieces and nephews I encourage strongly not to do drugs. But if my 16-year-old nephew asks me about it, I tell him it's an adult decision that he needs to make when he's an adult.

Posted: 6/21/05 at 10:09pm

"It's pretty hard to tell "young people" that they oughtn't do them at all, when every other ad is telling you to ask your doctor if this pill or that pill is right for you."

This is certainly the truth - and doesn't even address all the alcohol ads people are bombarded with. And my current awareness of the educational system, at least in California, lets me know that even they have been infected with this phenomenon. 'ADHD' and similar terms - and the drugs used to 'contol' them - are part of the everyday lexicon in schools now.

Pardon me, I have to go refill my scotch now.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 10:41pm

hello, if you're arguing with namo's "drug feel goood" message, you didn't read the following part that stated very clearly that if you're arguing with that you haven't done the right drug for you. the right drug for you. that's right, it's out there. you just have never found it or tried it. drugs do feel really good, duh. do you think people do them because they just try them once and regardless of how it feels there's an automatic addiction? j*sus chr*st, how dumb are ya?

people do it to escape? oh yeah, when everyone's doing it and you're the only one who's not that's sheer escapism ain't it? what the f*ck? people who have no understanding of adolescence should not post in threads like this because their stupidity is worse than all the sanctimonious crap we have to wade through on a daily basis. p-e-e-r p-r-e-s-s-u-r-e. ever heard of it? no? home schooling? jaysus.

ans as far as giving kids a map, the maps are already out there. they're called friends. i taught 7th grade. these kids knew almost as much as i did and i'm a freaking recreational pharmacist. for those who don't, they're probably as interested in a long namo post as they are in having their eyelids removed using a rusty buck knife.

the fact is that drugs are there, they will always be there and to pretend that kids just shouldn't do them is ridiculous becuase they will find a way to do so. anyone who pretends that a message of abstinence when it comes to recreational drugs is anything more than masturbation for the sender needs to spend more time with kids and less time with their head up their a**. kids need to be educated in a realistic sense as to what these drugs are, what their effects are and given examples of the consequences. even that may be pointless, but at least they'd be going into it with their eyes a bit kmore open.

the fact is that kids today are able to deal with more abstract ideas than we were at that age because the world itself has become more abstract and as a result they do it everyday for a million other things. it's time to pull our heads out fo the collective sand and stop treating the kids like they're too stupid to understand what we're talking about before they've tuned us out completely.

[jacobtsf]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 10:42pm

As a yung'un I feel I have to reply to Namo's post.

In part he is correct: Teenagers ARE going to experiment, it is part of rebellion. How much experimenting is what can be changed by parents/friends/counselors/etc.

Also-MANY of the anti-drug/anti-smoking/anti-drinking PSA's are turning teens onto these things. If you tell a teenager that they ARE NOT ALLOWED to do something, and don't dive into detail on WHY they SHOULDN'T do it, then there is a good chance that the teen will at the least THINK about it, and at the most DO it.

I am not saying it is a good idea for teens to go out and take meth or other drugs, however. These things RUIN lives. What I am saying is that in today's world parents and other adults are just saying to their kids that they CAN'T do things. Parents and others need to explain why. The picture that midtown posted is a perfect example: any teen who sees that picture is going to think twice about taking meth.

[Plum]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 10:45pm

Thanks, guys, for educating me on the adolescent psyche.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 6/21/05 at 10:46pm

c'mon, plum, just take one hit. you can be cool like us.