I wonder what HD has to say about this- Page 2

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:06pm

MM, I wasn't too sure if I typed it all out if the thread would be deleted

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:12pm

Oh Lord, it's the same thing over and over. And Clinton was impeached for perjury, which actually is a crime, not a blowjob. Impeaching really is just something that happens when Congress doesn't like you, anyway; it doesn't necessarily reflect on a president. Bush was just saying the same thing that Congress and Clinton had been saying for years: if you impeach him for that, you have to impeach the former, as well.

Credibility? I lost my credibility now just because I disagree with you? Fascinating. We can't go into Darfur because the lovely UN won't declare it a genocide; why is that when we actually do obey the UN, people complain? Believe me, I'd love to go into Darfur. Iraq's WMD programs were still active: Iraq was still acquiring dual-use items, was still seeking experts to assist in the programs, were still maintaining facilities known to be involved in WMD research and production, and still had the ability to weaponize WMDs. Every prominent intelligence agency stated that Iraq had WMDs (CIA, MI6, Mossad, SISMI, etc.) And as for the mass graves, those actually existed, soo not quite seeing how that was "trumped up"...

I'm on these boards because I love Broadway, believe it or not and in this particular thread because I believe that I have the right to express my opinion when I disagree with someone's assertion. Wow, and I'm compared to HD because I dare to disagree with mindless rhetoric that I've heard spouted for years now. Just yesterday people were praising me for not acting like HD because I actually back up my opinions. My, how things change...

[pab]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:16pm

Poor thing.

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:21pm

Has anyone died because of Clinton's perjury?
Because of the lies Bush and Cheney have told (and still believe) too many brave young men and women did not make it home alive.

So now I ask do you have anyone serving in the war? My son is in the USAF, and has just found out that he'll be heading over within the year.
I for one have been against this war from the start. It can not end soon enough for me.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:24pm

Well, no one died except for those folks in Kosovo, and the janitor in that Sudanese aspirin factory, yeah...

Sorry, but your son wasn't drafted: he signed on the dotted line. And not that personal pathos should matter in analyzing a situation, but yes, my brother-in-law will likely be heading over in a few years.

[romantico]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:27pm

SporkGoddess, what do you think of George W.Bush? Do you feel he represents your party well? What are your thoughts of this administration? Just curious.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:29pm

I like his foreign policy for the most part (though I disagree with certain ways it is being handled,) but generally I detest his domestic policy. He is not a true conservative, in my eyes.

Edit: No, it actually will be a few years. He has an educational deferment. But I admire anyone who serves in the military, and wish them luck, your son included.

Updated On: 7/18/07 at 06:29 PM

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:30pm

"Sorry, but your son wasn't drafted: he signed on the dotted line. And not that personal pathos should matter in analyzing a situation, but yes, my brother-in-law will likely be heading over in a few years."

You are RIGHT he wasn't drafted. He signed on to AFROTC, and is now an officer. Thank you for your concern. I pray that your BIL will relly have a "few years" before he has to go over. But given the lengths of the tours I would imagine it may only be 18 months before he has to go. Your tune may change some by then.
Mine won't, bring them home now!

[pab]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:33pm

"I like his foreign policy for the most part"

Oh my God, what foreign policy?

Updated On: 7/18/07 at 06:33 PM

[romantico]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:37pm

First of all, I am surprised with some of the comments. I do not agree with Sporkgoddess but she should be allowed to speak her mind with out harrassment. She has proven she is NO HD! She sounds rather intelligent and makes a good argument (even if I don't agree with it)Just my 2 cents.

I am really surprised to hear you say Bush is not a real conservative. Have you always felt this way or are you just seeing it now? I am also curious as to how conservative you are. Your say your a conservative catholic. I assume your against abortion. What are your thoughts on gay marriage/homosexuality? Reason I ask I know some who consider themsleves pretty conseravtive but sound borderline liberal to me.

Updated On: 7/18/07 at 06:37 PM

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:39pm

Lessee... actually caring about what goes on in other countries, not just ignoring problems until they bite us in the ass... you know, that foreign policy.

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:45pm

AHHH the old "educational deferment" Just like Cheney?
My son also had that chance if he had stayed went on to grad school, So more likely than not your brother-in-law will never see action.
" Lessee... actually caring about what goes on in other countries, not just ignoring problems until they bite us in the ass... you know, that foreign policy."

Gee I have cared about Ethiopia and Kosovo long before in became fashionable.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 6:52pm

He got the deferment because the army needs doctors. He'll be doing his residency in the army, but probably in the States. Then it's off to Iraq, unless we're out by then. I know other people who are currently over there, anyway: my friend's brother is in the Marines, for instance.

Not quite sure what you mean by that, but I wasn't commenting on your own preferences towards foreign policy.

romantico: Wow, thanks--I appreciate your standing up for me. I actually didn't become a conservative until Bush was reelected; before then, I was a Marxist (how I switched is a long story; I like to joke that I went so far left, I looped back over to right.) So I didn't really pay attention to how conservative he was until then, but, looking back, it's hard to deny that he's spent a looot of money and created a ton of new government agencies. It was a lot of things, really. In all fairness though, Bush never campaigned as one (you just sort of associate Republicans with small gov't, is all.)

Umm, well, I'm for small government. Socially I'm more libertarian, minus drug policy and abortion--you were right about that one, haha. I'm for gay marriage; actually, I know a lot of conservatives who are. They don't want the government to interfere in marriage, period.

[romantico]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 7:02pm

Wow. I didn't know that. Alot of the conservatives I have talked with think gays should keep quiet and stay in the closet. What are your views towards stem cel research? Hmmm, so did you vote for Gore in 2000? I don't see the Republicans for small government. It seems they if anything they want Government bigger and corporate. Who are you looking at for 2008 as a candidate? Do you plan on campaigning? What exactly about the Republicans do you favor more than the Democrats (besides the smaller government that is)You sound more like an independant to me, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions.

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 7:08pm

SporkGoddess strikes as a young woman still figuring out what political party she is. As a Catholic she is pro life, but is for gay marriage. The Pope will not allow to happen.
She is just swaying in the breeze.

"Umm, well, I'm for small government. Socially I'm more libertarian, minus drug policy and abortion--you were right about that one, haha. I'm for gay marriage; actually, I know a lot of conservatives who are. They don't want the government to interfere in marriage, period."

[pab]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 7:19pm

"actually caring about what goes on in other countries"

Like the Sudan or just white countries?

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 7:21pm

Nah, I'm just a real conservative. We're hard to find, especially on musical theatre message boards, yet we do exist.

I wasn't of voting age in 2000, but I hated both candidates, so I dunno for whom I would have voted. I am against embryonic stem cell research and think that it's criminal how people are politicizing it by placing all of these hopes on it that may never come to fruition. Well, I confused Republican with conservative up there (sorry, I'm sick, so I'm not in the best frame of mind); it's hard to find a real conservative. Republican's just the party name, heh. As for the 2008 election, I have no idea... I guess Mitt Romney, even if he is a Mormon. Namely, I identify more with the Republicans because I'm pro-war and I'm completely, 100% against socialist programs, don't want to raise minimum wage and think that unions are unnecessary and corrupt, am anti-gun control, pro-life (as established,) etc.

mominator: You can disagree with the Catholic Church on some issues and still be considered a Catholic. Abortion's the one social issue from which you can't defer. And while I tried to be against gay marriage at first due to my religion, I could not find a good non-religious reason for it to be illegal. As I've said, I value facts, rather than rhetoric.

Edit: pab: As I said above, we can't interfere in the Sudan because the UN won't declare it a genocide. Blame them, not the USA. When we actually do obey the UN, people still complain... just can't win, I guess.

Updated On: 7/18/07 at 07:21 PM

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 7:34pm

SG, I have been an ex-Catholic longer than you HAVE been alive!
No you can not be a "good Catholic" and dis agree with Catholic Doctrine! That means no birth control and no gay marriage. Or so says a very close friend (who was an usher at my wedding 24 years ago) who is now a Catholic priest educated at the Vatican and made a Deacon of the Roman Catholic Church by Pope John Paul II.

"mominator: You can disagree with the Catholic Church on some issues and still be considered a Catholic. Abortion's the one social issue from which you can't defer. And while I tried to be against gay marriage at first due to my religion, I could not find a good non-religious reason for it to be illegal. As I've said, I value facts, rather than rhetoric. "

Sorry It is all or nothing when you are a Catholic. (Just like the Jets!) Ask your priest this comung Sunday!

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 8:16pm

Odd, I learned that you could disagree with certain things in one of my religion classes back in high school. Eh, well, as long as I don't advertise, it's all good. I know Catholics who are for abortion, birth control, and euthanasia, and those are considered very heavy issues. Guess we can't all be perfect.

Thanks for enlightening me on that particular topic. I'll have to ask people about it further.

[mominator]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 8:28pm

A rather progressive "Catholic" school My teachers were The Sisters of Charity of Nazareth, Sisters of St. Joseph, The Jesuits and one amazing Benidectine.
Sorry Goddess it the Pope's way or the highway.

[artscallion]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 8:42pm

And the big question is: when these 'pick and choose' catholics put their money in the collection basket, do they get to designate which beliefs the money supports? I dodn't think so. Cause that would mean owning up to your beliefs, contradicting the pope and facing excommunication. And Mom's right; it's the pope's way or the highway.

So, if you're paying their bills, you're supporting everything they support, including active oppression of homosexuals. Even if you don't believe in it, you support it. How terrible is that? (you knew I was gonna drop in on this one sooner or later, didn't you Spork)

[pab]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 8:46pm

"So, if you're paying their bills, you're supporting everything they support"

Like the 600 million they just paid out for those sex cases.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 8:50pm

I believe that the Catholic Church has a right to be against homosexuality, just like people have rights to be for it. Sorry, guys, you're not gonna convince me to convert from my religion, just like I'll never convince you that Bush isn't the root of all evil. But it's been a fun discussion, at least for me.

Updated On: 7/18/07 at 08:50 PM

[pab]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 8:58pm

"I believe that the Catholic Church has a right to be against homosexuality"

Oh, but we know that there are quite a number of Priests who are not against it. I mean how can you be against something if you practice it? Oh wait, that's what a lot of Republicans have done in recent scandals as well. So, never mind.

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 7/18/07 at 9:00pm

You do realize that the religious right hates us as well, don't you?