Kramer has a racial meltdown- Page 2

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:23pm

"Yes, that was REALLY uncalled for. But, the thing that gets me, is that I have seen MANY, MANY black performers just tear white people apart and calling them all sorts of names, and nothing is done about it. But, the moment a white person does the same thing, it's racist. Granted, what "Kramer" did was cross the line and deserves to be punished. "

That's something different. That is done in the context of a joke. And white comedians do the same thing. Racism can be laughed at.
The difference here is that no joke was being made. This was not part of his routine. This was NOT Chris Rock standing up there and making a joke. This was just Richards spewing hate.
Updated On: 11/20/06 at 01:23 PM

[MatthewAddison]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:25pm

You should know, Goth. You say outrageous and idiotic things on a daily basis and half of the BWW congregation chases after you with torches and pitchforks.

Unless you're a social masochist and love to be hated and mistreated.

[spiderdj82]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:27pm

Well, I wasn't really comparing "Kramers" thing to black comedians saying things about white people. I was just stating an opinion.

But, like Goth said about Ted Danson and the "Black Face" incident which was supposed to be in the name of fun. In the movie White Chicks, the roles are reversed and it was perfectly fine for them to do it. That is what I have a problem with.

[Gothampc]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:33pm

"You should know, Goth. You say outrageous and idiotic things on a daily basis and half of the BWW congregation chases after you with torches and pitchforks."

That's right. Don't bother to discuss ideas, just make personal attacks.

[MatthewAddison]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:36pm

You'll have to forgive me. You upstanding, morally erect, Jesus-enlightened folks are into that nowadays, aren't ya? Forgiving?

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:37pm

I don't know if that's a good example either. There's a history behind the use of blackface that makes it a little bit more extreme than pretending to be a white girl.

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:41pm

What an asshole.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:44pm

"Not committing murder, theft, or anything that would be physically harmful or deceitful."

But racist comments carry connotations of centuries of physical harm, oppression and murder. Which is exactly what makes them so offensive and, when delivered in a particular context, unforiveable to many.

"I am talking about social comments, words, things we say...and then how people become the iron fist of judgement on us when we make a mistake."

Well, that is dependent on so many variables. First, what is the mistake? Is it the same thing or something different? What are the offending comments? In what context were they used? I mean, if Richards now condemns someone for using a racial slur towards another, then I just call it hypocrisy. If someone says "Get out of here you f***ing FAGGOT!", should I not be appalled or offended for fear of being too judgemental? There is a HUGE difference in someone dropping the n-bomb in conversation when speaking about others not present as a result of their social background and environment. It's still wrong, of course, and if it is someone I know I immediately let them know it offends me (if it's not someone I know, I debate whether or not I should say something depending on whether or not I fear for my friggin' life). But the kind of racist remark made by Richards or Gibson that was hurled directly and deliberately at someone as a verbal weapon of bigotry and hate, well, isn't that the sort of thing society as a whole should be judgemental about? (I can honestly say I've never done anything like that) I really doubt if that is the sort of comment to which Whoopi was referring.

[SorryGrateful]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:45pm

I have to admit that I despise hecklers, but there's absolutely no reason for that kind of harrassment coming from Richards. He crossed the line big time.

[MatthewAddison]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 1:57pm

I'll have to get said Book and look, but I do believe she WAS referring to a racist comment made.

I think you're misunderstanding my point. So let me restate it in a different manner:

I am not defending nor condoning racism. I do not think racism should be overlooked or sluffed off.

I am saying that we can all jump on the "He's an a**hole" bandwagon VERY easily because he did something wrong. But I think it takes a bigger person to say "He was wrong, but I shouldn't ostracize him permanently if he can admit he was wrong."

If he remains a racist and continues to make remarks, then we're dealing with a different situation. I don't forgive and forget comments made by Jerry Fallwell, because he continually makes stupid and hateful remarks.

I think we're all allowed to have learning experiences.

Whether or not we choose to learn from them is a consequence we have to face.

So I don't disagree with you, but I think we were crossing each other on two different planes of ideas.

:)

[Isabella2]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 2:06pm

i can't believe michael richards would do that... he's someone i really respected as an actor and now i'm going to have a hard time watching seinfeild despite the fact that he's so gifted. why do people do such stupid things
Updated On: 11/20/06 at 02:06 PM

[lildogs]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 2:35pm

"That's right. Don't bother to discuss ideas, just make personal attacks. "

Like This?:

"3-2-1 and cue Jesse Jackson, professional race baiter. "

Whoa, that's good hypocrisy!

[MatthewAddison]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 2:36pm

At least we know Goth can count backwards.

[JohnBoy2]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 2:40pm

So, what career is it, that Richards is no longer going to have?

[mejusthavingfun]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 2:43pm

it's not even that funny... if you're gonna do it, do it right.

[JohnBoy2]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 2:51pm

Has anyone ever seen Michael Richards? He isn't funny. Although, I find it strange that the guy felt it was okay to go into the club and heckle him, then was so victimized by being called a n*. Richards appears to be mentally ill. However, I think that if people are supposed to think that n* is the worst word in the history of language, then it would be really helpful to the cause if black people would stop using it. I don't buy the "I'm black, so I can use it", bit; because, what's really being said is "I'm a n*, so I can use it." How much sense does that make?

[Kringas]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:04pm

Minority groups often reclaim words that have been used against them. And there are plenty of African-Americans who don't approve of using that word, even when it's used by African-Americans.

[mejusthavingfun]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:13pm

Well John people get offended by tons of things an still use the words themselves. Bitches, ho’s, faggots, queer, dykes, Jews, JAPS, Immigrants, Fat, nerd, gay, chink, WASP, Guido, Mick, Meatball, puta, Spic, are just a few that come to mind. We all know it’s hate speech, sometimes people adopt the words to “own” them.

Don't assume that Heckler or (all blacks) use the term "n*" cause he is black. That IS racist. Even if he does use it, he can decide for himself he wants to be called one by someone. Why is it ok to constantly assume people need to provide an explanation when they are offended? Sometime people say hateful things that are obvious hate speech.

It's also the use of the word. My friends use "n*" in a different than way white people do. They use it for hate speech like in this case. Words are not just words, they have connotations and context. Our language is not black and white, words have many meanings. White Americans in general should not use the word “n*,” our recent history is littered with a word they created to degrade other human beings. It is not acceptable. Maybe in time it will be, but not now. Kramer obviously knows this and used it to spew hate.

Kramer obviously is a nut job like Gibson. We love his work, but won’t defend his actions. I dont take offense to stuff like this because he is just a loser celebrity. I do get offended when people like George Bush leave an entire population of people trapped in cesspool without clean drinking water or a bed to sleep on for days. All the while pretending everything is under control. Or how white schools have air conditioning and gourmet lunches, while inner-city school kids have to beg for a crappy education.


I can’t wait to see Apocolyto.

[JohnBoy2]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:23pm

I don't assume anything. I don't agree that whites shouldn't use the word; but, it's okay for someone else to use it. That's preposterous! And, I know there are blacks who hate when other blacks use it; but we never read or hear about that. Of course, people are allowed to be outraged at whatever they want; I'm just of the belief that if a word is hurtful, it should be unacceptable regardless of who uses it; and, I completely reject the I can use it and you can't argument. Regardless of the word, there should be no restrictions on who can or cannot use it! I'm looking forward to APOCALYTO, as well.

[Kringas]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:26pm

So what you're saying is that you really want to use the word?

[lildogs]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:26pm

"Or how white schools have air conditioning and gourmet lunches, while inner-city school kids have to beg for a crappy education. "

You obviously didn't go to ANY of the schools I attended. I never went to a school that had air conditioning or gourmet lunches. RICH schools got that. Yes, the rich schools are predominantly white, but that's not YOUR point.

I know you have alot of passion when it comes to race topics, but be careful not to over-prove your point. It's not just "white people" who shouldn't use "n*," it's anyone who isn't black and it's all in how it's used. I don't mind "fag" if there's no malice behind it...but I doubt that "n*" would be taken with the same good humor even with the best of intentions. People who aren't black are the ones who have to watch themselves with THAT WORD, not the black community.

Many people who aren't black see this as hypocrisy. I see both sides: yes, it IS hypocritical, but haven't they suffered enough? Is it so much to ask that we lay off "n*" and let black people use it as they see fit? Of course not. Is it okay for black people to use it as they see fit? Sure. Rules of the game, folks.

It's also racist FOR YOU to say that white kids have it better than black kids--yes some do, but more often than not, they don't. That's a "white" stereotype.

Be careful not to sink your ship in order to save it.

[JohnBoy2]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:27pm

No, that's not what I'm saying. Didn't you read my post?

[lildogs]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:29pm

I wasn't responding to you, Frances!

[JohnBoy2]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:31pm

I wasn't responding to you, bow wow!

[Kringas]

Posted: 11/20/06 at 3:31pm

I don't agree that whites shouldn't use the word; but, it's okay for someone else to use it.

That sentence actually says that you agree that non-whites should be allowed to use the word.