Trayvon Martin- Page 3

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/26/12 at 3:12pm

He commented on it because he was asked about it.

And the president agreed with you about not expressing an opinion on any legal aspect of the case itself when he added: The attorney general reports to me so Ive got to be careful about my statements to make sure that were not impairing any investigation."

[henrikegerman]

Posted: 3/26/12 at 4:30pm

"He needs to watch himself because he could end up saying something that will prejudice a jury and not get someone a fair trial."

Gotham, we may not agree on many things, but we do agree very much on that point.

[SNAFU]

Posted: 3/26/12 at 4:41pm

Wasn't that a major point during Charlie Manson's trial? Nixon declared him guilty on National TV.

[madbrian]

Posted: 3/26/12 at 4:51pm

It's not just the point that he could influence a jury, though that matters. This could result in a federal hate trial, and the DOJ reports to him. That's where his influence is more real and more suspect to citicism.

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/26/12 at 10:08pm

with all the junk that's out there about this case, good luck seating a jury

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 2:19pm

Speaking of all the junk that's out there . . .

[Gothampc]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 5:49pm

Speaking of all the junk that's out there . . .

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 5:51pm

Nice double standard there by ThingProgress - Zimmerman doesn't get to tell his side until he's arrested and charged while family and friends of Trayvon get to blast whatever they want internationally? Uh, no, that's not how it works.

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 6:41pm

I don't know any more about this than you do, but it sounds to me as though Zimmerman's side is being told plenty, and Martin's family is responding. When a picture is posted of some kid flipping off the camera, and it's not their son, don't you think the family should set the record straight? I'm not sure where you got blasting.

Also, you realize that, whether guilty of a crime or not, Zimmerman's actions mean that Martin will never be able to tell his side, right?

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 9:19pm

It was the Martin family, their attorney, and friends that threw all this into the spotlight. Slamming of the police department and Zimmerman was the first thing to hit the press. Only in these last two or so days has there been any pushback in Zimmerman's defense.

Evidence needs to tell Martin's side, not a media onslaught stirring up old racial **** and stereotypes.

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 9:22pm

Uh, WRONG! It lunatic vigilante wannabe Cop who threw this into the spotlight.

Updated On: 3/27/12 at 09:22 PM

[Kad]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 9:26pm

And, as that article shows, a lot of what is "in Zimmerman's defense" is inaccurate and racist... probably moreso than the initial incident itself.

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 9:41pm

Yawper, as I said, I don't pretend to know any more than anyone else following this in the media from a distance. My impression is that the first comments from Martin's family and friends were in response to info coming from the Zimmerman side.

Can you link us to some of their "blasting" statements attacking Zimmerman that preceded comments from his side?

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:01pm

ok, "spinning".

The first things out about this case were the claims that the police department did not do their job (no basis revealed yet for this claim), that Trayvon was an innocent angel (recent information reveals otherwise) and that Zimmerman was a nothing more than a cold-blooded, racist vigilante who "stalked" (skewing word) and shot Trayvon without cause. There was no mention of Zimmerman's injuries, of Trayvon's tangles with authority, of the witness who saw Trayvon on top of Zimmerman, of Zimmerman's claim that Trayvon jumped him, and, if that's not enough, the bs claims that Zimmerman was not detained by police, that his weapon was not confiscated, and that he has a rap sheet (he has been arrested but has never been convicted).

As far as the claim of a racial slur on the 911 tapes it's just like playing LPs backward - no one ever hears anything, or the same thing, until they're told what they're supposed to hear.

My biggest gripe in the impugning of the police and judicial system. My second biggest gripe is the utterly irresponsible media behavior.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:09pm

There was no mention of Zimmerman's injuries

Which the police later said did not warrant treatment, and for which Zimmerman did not seek medical help until the next day.

My biggest gripe in the impugning of the police and judicial system. My second biggest gripe is the utterly irresponsible media behavior.

Your third biggest gripe oughta be your own creepy parroting of utterly irresponsible unfounded smear attacks.

Updated On: 3/27/12 at 10:09 PM

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:12pm

So if I'm hearing you correctly, Yawper, Zimmerman did not pursue Martin, against the directions of the authorities; Zimmerman's arrests without convictions are not pertinent but Martin's "tangles with authority" are; the witness that saw Martin on top of Zimmerman is valid but the one who saw Zimmerman standing over Martin and saw no sign of a prior struggle is not.

Does that pretty much sum up what you accept and what you object to?

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:21pm

"utterly irresponsible media behavior"

You mean things like posting a picture of a black kid flipping off the camera and labeling it Trayvon Martin when it wasn't, right?

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:27pm

Police observed Zimmerman's injuries at the scene and he received initial treatment from the EMS crew that responded - that is in the police report. Reportedly he went to the hospital the next day for further treatment - the hospital cannot comment but I'm sure there's no reason that documentation can't be demanded by the grand jury when hearings start. I expect there will be a lot more info that comes out when the grand jury gets underway.

The witness who saw Zimmerman standing over Martin saw that AFTER the shooting. That is the only VISUAL thing she witnessed because she did not have them in sight until then. She's also the kind of witness legal professionals on all sides shy away from because she's attention seeking and media attention seekers in cases tend to be unreliable.

There's also the fact that so many are still accrediting the screams for help on the tape as Martin when Zimmerman claims it's him AND Martin's father said it wasn't Trayvon.

Martin's tangles with authorities weren't even acknowledged until yesterday, well after Zimmerman's were getting kicked around. The Martin side was less than forthcoming about that, which pretty much goes hand-in-hand with the attempt to paint the "innocent child" portrait in the media.

Updated On: 3/27/12 at 10:27 PM

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:35pm

So, Yawper, do you think there's reason to bring Zimmerman to trial or no?

And if the races were reversed, would you feel differently?

I ask because I've asked myself the same question. Whenever race enters any situation like this, I think any sentient American has to stop and self-examine. And the answer for me is an unequivocal yes. If a black man followed an unarmed white man, after being told by authorities to "stand down," just because he found his behavior suspicious (which seemsed to consist of being the wrong color and wearing the wrong clothes), and subsequently shot him, I would definitely think that black man should be brought to trial. I think that situation would warrant more than just accepting the word of the black shooter that it was self defense.

What are your thoughts?

[thetinymagic2]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:41pm

Last night on Larry O Donnell. Ok, it's hlarious on some level, interviewing the empty chair, but, hey, the content is pretty damn compelling. When Larry gets going, he's like the old Keith Olberman, all in your face! It's almost better w/o the lawyer there....
(VID)
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/lawrence-odonnell-interviews-empty-chair-george-zimmerman-lawyer-304676

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 10:54pm

The only reason to bring Zimmerman to trial is if there is sufficient evidence that refutes his self-defense claim. The original prosecutor didn't think there was, thus no arrest, no charges.

If, upon investigation by the State of Florida and/or the Feds they feel they can build a case, so be it. It hasn't been said who all is looking at what aspects or if everybody is doing independent investigations of both - police department conduct and the incident itself.

No, I wouldn't feel differently if the races were reversed. This crap goes in all directions, that's why it's so important that police and judicial authority be kept as solid and uncorrupted as possible. The judicial system is really the basis for a civil society.

Btw there was a ruling just today involving the stand your ground law in which a black man was acquitted for killing a guy who stole his car radio -
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/27/2717572/miami-dade-issues-ruling-in-stand.html

Updated On: 3/27/12 at 10:54 PM

[thetinymagic2]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 11:05pm

"that's why it's so important that police and judicial authority be kept as solid and uncorrupted as possible. The judicial system is really the basis for a civil society".

What universe are you living in? Yeah, they're soooo solid and uncorrupted

[Reginald Tresilian]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 11:09pm

I don't know that I'll ever see this Stand Your Ground law as anything other than a license for vigilante justice, but even I can see a difference between pursuing a thief who tries to assault you with your own property and chasing a kid who's only apparent crime is being the wrong color and wearing a hoodie.

In both cases, though, I think it's best left to the cops.

[Yawper]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 11:12pm

I didn't say they were, tiny. Some are good and some are not, but actively undercutting any without hard evidence that allows for the corruption to be identified and rooted out is damaging to our entire system.

Updated On: 3/27/12 at 11:12 PM

[PalJoey]

Posted: 3/27/12 at 11:30pm

Zimmerman was arrested and released three times: once for domestic violence, once for "resisting an officer without violence" once for "resisting an officer with violence." Resisting an officer with violence is a felony charge.

All three of those arrests were dismissed with no charges--and with no explanation.

Perhaps the damage to the system happened because George Zimmerman's father is a retired judge.

Perhaps the corruption to be identified starts with the unexplained dismissals of those three arrests.