Follies questions- Page 2

[joevitus]

Posted: 10/3/25 at 12:37pm

Jarethan said: "I do not believe that Sally has early dementia. I also have to admit that I never thought that she was an alchoholic, although I guess that it is possible..

I have always felt that she was a not very smart, not very sophisticated young woman who was enamored by Ben's intelligence, sophistication, and probably looks. He was exciting, whereas Buddy was at best dependable.When she was young, she was either prettier than Phyllis or so visibly idolized Ben that he was attracted to her for one of those reasons. Hewas never serious for her for one minute. When the time came for himto rise up in his career (self-confidence was never a problem), he knew that Phyllis could be the great man's wife, whereas Sally's lack of sophistication would become an embarrassment over time.Over the years, Sallybecame more and more obsessed by the idea of Ben -- after all, she would read about himand Phyllis occasionally in Life or People Magazines -- and that obsession peaked when she received the invitation to the reunion.

When Ben came to the reunion, he was seriously unhappy with his life and with his relationship with Phyllis. When he saw Sally and saw that she was still obsessed with him, his narcissism took over. Live, Laugh, Love forced him to recognize that, despite the career success and fame, he was miserably unhappy. and his life was a lie He recognized that Phyllis was his ballast, calling out for her.

Phyllis loved Ben when they married and, has clearly become supremely jaded about their marriage, but she is not ready to live without him (I admit this is a stretch). Possible reasons: she hopes that he will change? she loves the person he was enough to stay the course; she doesn't (despite Could I Leave You) see herself alone. I do not think they eventually get divorced; I have always assumed their relationship improved somewhat specifically because Ben realiized that he needed her more than he would ever admit.

I just assumed that 'I wore green the last time' simply referred to the last time Sallyremembers their being happy together, but I can certainly see the argument that it represents the last time they made love. Much better assumption.

I always thought Tim and Tom was an easy way to demonstrate her lack of sophistication.

At the end, I thought that Phyllis and Ben had an (however slight) opportunity to improve their relationship. I felt that Buddy was going to be a martyr for the rest of his lie, that he was always going to stay with Sally (even if he would continue to cheat). I felt that Sally was going to get worse...she would have no hope in her life and she would essentially wilt away. I assumed, ironically, that she would probably become an alchoholic. Since she barely mentioned Tim and Tom, I did not think she would settle into being grandma.

They simply needed the Roscoe character to sing Beautiful Girls. There was no need to dwell on his story."

This is the interpretation that most jibes with mine. I do think "I wore green the last time" refers to the last time she and Ben went on a date/had sex (probably Sally would describe it as the former, Ben as the latter).

But Follies is so rich that, like a great work of literature, different people can read the relationships differently and there is validity in that. It's an unusually rich character piece. It's a classic (but now I'm stating the obvious). 

[tomorrowBIGLITES]

Posted: 10/3/25 at 2:45pm

I think there’s no reason to cut the pastiche numbers cause you can either pinspot them or re utilize them.

What if you’re hearing “One Last Kiss” and it’s cutting to Sally gearing up to run away with Ben and fixing her face and smiling and crying?

Film you can do a lot with diegetic music.

 

Wheras something like “The Right Girl” it moves the plot but it’s TOO broadway to work on film.

[Georgeanddot2]

Posted: 10/3/25 at 4:39pm

I wouldn't cut any songs for a film adaptation, but I would cut almost all of the dialogue. I think an Altman + Antonioni approach would work best. Floating through a smoke filled party, picking up little pieces of conversation that provide some context. Any attempt at realism would be creatively stifling. Follies is a ghost story and it would be best to approach it as such. The dilapidated theatre is a haunted space and these people are under it's spell.

I actually find The Right Girl to strangely be the most cinematic of all the songs in Follies.

[ChairinMain]

Posted: 10/3/25 at 4:57pm

I feel like the best film version of follies that ever could have been made would have been in the early nineties, and If I recall correctly it got pitched but never made. The idea would have been to make it about a movie studio being torn down, not a theatre, and actual musical stars from the golden age of Hollywood would have been cast to play versions of themselves as the supporting roles, interacting with footage from their glory days. God, that would have been brilliant. 

[joevitus]

Posted: 10/3/25 at 6:05pm

ChairinMain said: "I feel like the best film version of follies that ever could have been made would have been in the early nineties, and If I recall correctlyit got pitched but never made. The idea would have been to make it about a movie studio being torn down, not a theatre, and actual musical stars from the golden age of Hollywood would have been cast to play versions of themselves as the supporting roles, interactingwith footage from their glory days. God, that would have been brilliant."

Pretty sure that version was pitched by Prince and Sondheim to MGM in the early 70's, and everyone noticed when the collapse of that plan led to That's Entertainment!, which interspersed classic clips with old stars in the present time on half-ruined backlot structures. The album art even had included Follies girls with ornate headdresses at the top of the image.

[joevitus]

Posted: 10/3/25 at 6:08pm

Georgeanddot2 said: "I wouldn't cut any songs for a film adaptation, but I would cut almost all of the dialogue. I think an Altman + Antonioni approach would work best. Floating through a smoke filled party, picking up little pieces of conversation that provide some context. Any attempt at realism would be creatively stifling. Follies is a ghost story and it would be best to approach it as such. The dilapidated theatre is a haunted space and these people are under it's spell.

I actually find The Right Girl to strangely be the most cinematic of all the songs in Follies."

I think a Felliniesque approach rather than Altman/Antonioni (both who work in environments too naturalistic for this surreal work), and neither dialogue nor song cuts, please.