How long before you aren't a flop?

How long does a show need to run before it can be considered a flop? For instance, obviously Lennon would be considered a flop, as they have been playing either less than or a little more than a month, and we are all pretty sure it's going to close soon. But would All Shook Up be considered a flop? I opened in March, 6 months ago. I, personally, don't think ASU should be considered a flop, but that's just me...

What do you guys think?

Brandon

ASU will be considered a flop..

because it hasn't made back it's original investment, and hasn't made profit.

There are "flops" and "hits" and there are "successes" and "failures."

"Flops" and "Hits" are purely objective financial terms having to do with a show paying back its original investment. If a show fails to recoup, it is a "flop" no matter how great it is or how long it runs (some flops have run 4 to 5 years and never managed to turn a profit). "Hits" return their investments. Period.

"Successes" and "Failures" are purely subjective assessments of a show's value critically and artistically. There are plenty of hits that I would consider artistic failures and plenty of flops that were artistically successful. Most of Sondheim shows come to mind as examples of the latter -- I actually got this distinction between "flop" and "success" etc.... from 20 time Tony winner Hal Prince. He called most of the Sondheim shows he produced and directed "successes" -- they were what he and Sondheim wanted them to be -- but, he was also clear that most of them were flops (Company and Little Night Music turned a profit; Sweeney closed as a flop, but over a decade later, according to Prince, it FINALLY paid back its original investment so it can now be termed a "hit)."

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Does anyone have a guess (or know) what the longest Broadway run would be that didn't recoup? I know that Millie ran for over 2 years and didn't recoup, and I believe that Jekyll & Hyde's run for 3 and a half years (and over 1500 performances!) also closed at a loss.

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Yeah, Prince said in an interview that Sweeney FINALLY broke even just a couple of years ago. I can't remind the exact timing of his comments, but I think we're talking just a couple of years ago, so, if that's true it took 20+ years to recoup. Wow.

The recently closed 42nd Street revival ran 1524 performances (over three and a half years) and never recouped (weekly running costs for that enormous cast were just too high).

Jekyll & Hyde ran 1543 performances and lost millions -- that might be the record.

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