Local One union boss blew the deal ..so says The NY POST- Page 4

[localonecrew]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 1:08pm

i dont mean to imply that short had worked out a final contract and claffey rejected it. i meant that short had made some offers to the league that when presented to claffey were rejected.

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 1:11pm

Forget Riedel. Claffey himself said in the NY Times:

"Then, referring to Mr. Short, but not by name, he said: “The international president was more willing to agree to things to end the labor dispute. I need to make sure my people are represented the best way I can do.”


So, Claffey himself said that Short was willing to "agree to things" and make compromises that would have led to an end of the labor dispute. My question was based on that statement. Short isn't some pro-League, pro-theatre owner guy -- he's in charge of 3000 stagehands nationwide and I assume wants what's best for his people.

What was Short willing to agree to that Claffey wasn't that would have led to the strike ending?

[billynj]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 1:21pm

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/20/theater/20claffey.html?em&ex=1195707600&en=00d3819b0d1631c9&ei=5087%0A


November 20, 2007
Man in the News
Speaking Up for the Stagehands
By JAMES BARRON
The man at the center of the breakdown in the talks between the Broadway producers’ league and the striking stagehands’ union had one thing he wanted to say before the first question in an interview yesterday: It is not about him.

“I don’t want this to be about me being a celebrity, about me getting my name in the paper,” said James J. Claffey Jr., the president of the union, Local 1 of the International Alliance of Theatrical Stage Employees. “I just want to get a contract for my folks. That’s why I do not look to the cameras. That’s why I have a publicist to do that. Most of the time, I’m paying my publicist to keep me out of the press.”

The stagehands Mr. Claffey represents went on strike on Nov. 10 over work rules that producers had imposed or had been pushing during months of negotiations. Talks resumed over the weekend, for the first time since Nov. 8, but broke down on Sunday night.

Mr. Claffey was not the only union official at the bargaining table last weekend. Thomas C. Short, the president of the parent union, also attended the sessions. There was talk yesterday from people on both sides of the bargaining that Mr. Short had been willing to settle the strike, but that Mr. Claffey believed he had already made enough concessions.

Asked how he got along with Mr. Short, Mr. Claffey said, “We have a business relationship.”

But the two men are not close beyond that? “That’s a fair statement,” Mr. Claffey said.

Then, referring to Mr. Short, but not by name, he said: “The international president was more willing to agree to things to end the labor dispute. I need to make sure my people are represented the best way I can do.”

Referring to the producers’ league, the League of American Theaters and Producers, he added: “The league kept saying for two days, ‘Keep giving us more, keep giving us more.’ We modified or agreed on 9 or 10 things over two days, and we got nothing.”

No date has been set for resuming the bargaining.

Mr. Claffey, 43, is a tall man with a bearlike handshake. He is one of six brothers, all of whom are stagehands and members of his union; their sister owns a beauty salon in New Jersey.

Mr. Claffey became a stagehand the day after he graduated from high school in 1982. That is typical of many of the 3,000 members of Local 1.

He was following the path his father had followed. That, too, is typical of stagehands: Sons have followed their fathers into the unions for generations— and there are clauses in the stagehands’ contract that are nearly 100 years old.

He began as an apprentice at City Center on West 55th Street. He trained under his father, as did his brothers.

“I learned on the job,” said Mr. Claffey, who became a full-fledged member of Local 1 in 1988.

He has worked on dozens of Broadway productions. A short biography on the Web site of the Mayor’s Office of Film, Theater and Broadcasting, which profiled him as an “Industry Star of the Month” in 2005, said his first production was “Monty Python’s Flying Circus” at City Center.

Mr. Claffey also spent 10 years with “All My Children” on ABC-TV and worked on various television programs at the other networks.

He said yesterday that the time he spent in different parts of the industry proved helpful when he decided to go into union management: He knew a cross-section of his fellow stagehands, and they knew him. He also worked on the Christmas show at Radio City Music Hall.

“That was the best time of my rank-and-file period,” he said. “Radio City, you experience a closeness when you do 220 shows a season.”

That, too, is typical of stagehands, he said.

“They spend so much time with each other because their job requires them to be away from home so much,” Mr. Claffey said. “They end up spending time with their brother and sister stagehands more than their family. If we’re making a good living, which we don’t apologize for, it’s because we’re working good hours and we’re not with our families. Holidays, we’re setting up the show while everybody else is at home celebrating so they can come to the show.”

He says the typical stagehand made about $70,000 a year.

Mr. Claffey became the theater business manager of Local 1 in 1998 after two years as chairman of its board of trustees. He became president of the local in May 2004 when he upset the two-term incumbent, Eddie McConway, a former prop master at the Metropolitan Opera.

The strike has been getting most of Mr. Claffey’s attention for the past 10 days, but, as he put it, “I have a whole labor organization to run besides Broadway.

“I have 65 collective bargaining agreements,” he said. “Broadway is just one. There’s Lincoln Center, Radio City, Madison Square Garden and every television channel.”

[bugmenot]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 1:24pm

> i dont mean to imply that short had worked out a final contract
> and claffey rejected it. i meant that short had made some offers
> to the league that when presented to claffey were rejected.

exactly...but I wouldn't paint this as a battle between short vs. claffey. Don't forget that negotiating on the Local's side there are also the business agents, our lawyers, and a negotiating committee made up of people who work in every area backstage who understand all of the implications of what is being passed back and forth across the table. If there was an acceptable deal, it would have been accepted. But it wasn't. It was countered, the league looked at the counter, rejected it, and walked out, rather than countering. And then they canceled the next week of shows.

(and regarding Short and the nationwide representation thing, stagehands are only a small part, probably the smallest, of who he represents...nationally, the majority of the IA members are involved in the film and tv industry...I think there are about 100,000 members in the US and Canada, about 3000 in the NYC stagehands local)

Updated On: 11/20/07 at 01:24 PM

[localonecrew]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 1:26pm

agreed.

[billynj]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 1:28pm

they sound like best friends ...lol
Mr. Claffey was not the only union official at the bargaining table last weekend. Thomas C. Short, the president of the parent union, also attended the sessions. There was talk yesterday from people on both sides of the bargaining that Mr. Short had been willing to settle the strike, but that Mr. Claffey believed he had already made enough concessions.

Asked how he got along with Mr. Short, Mr. Claffey said, “We have a business relationship.”

But the two men are not close beyond that? “That’s a fair statement,” Mr. Claffey said.


Updated On: 11/20/07 at 01:28 PM

[roadguy]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 4:26pm

BK,
I'm not trying to make this a personal attack towards you, but i will use you as an example.. People are giving people crap on here because someone called someone a bully, stupid, an idiot, whatever.. With your remarks to localonecrew, you called him a bullyboy. Your two or three sentences in response to his "name calling" was name calling in return. You just used a couple sentences to make up for one or two words..

I wish people here could stop fighting about all this, stop phrasing their opinions using words that seem to attack the other side. State your comments, state your proof of these comments, state whether you agree or disagree and move on.

Unfortunetly, 90% of the comments made on this board that i have read have no backing what so ever. billynj, paphillyguy among many others post anti-union posts, trash talk what they believe and wait for people they just pissed off to comment, then they turn and attack them for name calling.

Billynj, paphillyguy, you guys have every right to believe what you want and stand behind your beliefs. But when you make a comment, prove it. You guys post like you're sitting at the table and you know exactly what is going on. billynj, there's probably a dozen threads started by you with a link to a newspaper article and you believe that to be gold. Newspaper articles aren't proof. They are twisted up, taken out of context nonsense in favor of the person who called the paper to write the article to begin with.

I'm sorry, i can't remember the actors name, but the lead in Grinch is a good example. He was interviewed on tv as saying he stands behind the stagehands for a fair deal, he wishes everyone could be paid more, etc... etc... he finished by saying he just wishes this could be over because he feels bad for the kids who can't see the show. What did the newspapers take from this interview and print?? "he wishes it could be over and he feels bad for the kids." They didn't even quote him in a direct interview between himself and the paper. They took apart a TV interview and used the parts they wanted.

Let's just change the way we post. Post your comment, show your proof, and state your comment. Don't direct things at specific people. If you have a bashing comment, keep it to yourself. If you have no proof on your statement, keep it to yourself.

paphillyguy, the $20 million warchest comes from the Leagues own statements.(i'm not gonna provide a link to this, because it's all over the internet, look it up, i'm not gonna do this for you because now it's OLD news) how they actually earned this $20 mil in times of "losing money" no one actually knows.

"Localonecrew - any person with a modicum of intelligence will read your last diatribe, filled with the most specious name-calling, and know exactly what kind of person is posting. You gain nothing with the name-calling other than making yourself look like a bullyboy who cannot post without sullying someone else - you've done it to me, and you've done it to others. You make some of the fourteen year olds on this site seem like mature reasoned individuals by comparison. Bravo to you."
Updated On: 11/20/07 at 04:26 PM

[Fosse76]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 4:51pm

"If there was an acceptable deal, it would have been accepted. But it wasn't. It was countered, the league looked at the counter, rejected it, and walked out, rather than countering. And then they canceled the next week of shows."

Also, keep in mind, this how the League has been "negotiating" since July. EVERY SINGLE negotiation had ended this way (with the exception of the Thursday before the strike when Short himself stormed out). And everytime the Union got them back to the table, they would return with the ORGINAL rejected offer.

[bk]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:01pm

Sorry, no matter how you'd like to use me as an example, I was not name-calling in the way he was - I used no words like moron or the other two lovely examples of mud-slinging names. I simply pointed out he was making himself look like a bully and he was. A simple reading of his post and then my post tells all that need be told, so there really is no further need to comment.

[roadguy]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:17pm

And what's makes you so special to point out that his comments make him look like a bully??? If his comments already make that statement, let his comments do the talking.. STOP CALLING HIM A BULLY IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE BEING CALLED NAMES IN RETURN!!!!

"Sorry, no matter how you'd like to use me as an example, I was not name-calling in the way he was - I used no words like moron or the other two lovely examples of mud-slinging names. I simply pointed out he was making himself look like a bully and he was. A simple reading of his post and then my post tells all that need be told, so there really is no further need to comment."

[Taka]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:25pm

Ok, both sides are at fault here. bk, you shouldn't call localoneguy a bully. On the otherhand, the claims that bk made against you calling him a moron are justified. I quote:

i share it here though so that *clueless dolts like you* , who seem interested, might have some idea of whats going on. . . .

did i share it to help inform *an ignoramus like you*? yes.

*if you want to be a part of the discussion and post something of relevance, then make the smallest attempt at not being a moron.*


This. is. getting. RIDONCULOUS!!! Either debate maturely, or don't debate at all.

That being said, the only way we can find out who was fair is to find out what the agreement that Short agreed to and Claffey disagreed to said. That's not gonna happen anytime soon. So let's just chill, have a martini, and agree to disagree.

[roadguy]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:42pm

It's never going to happen because it's none of your business. I mean that in the most polite way possible.. Everyone here is trying to get "in the heads" of those involved. You never will. I agree that this should be a mature debate. I also admit I've lost the maturity at times because it's very difficult debating with people who are ignorant. BK IGNORANT IS NOT NAME CALLING. It's plain and simple, most people arguing with the Local One guys here are IGNORANT!!! THey have no clue what is taking place other than it's a strike. THey hate unions so LOcal One is a big bully. They complain that Local One is greedy, yet their own comments about how they can't see a show because of a strike is just as greedy. Go stand on the lines, go to the negotiations then come back and report something. OTherwise stop posting stupid comments that are of no value to a civilized debate on the situation. It's getting stupid. One person talks about how the League/Local One negotiations is just an adult pissing match.. HEY TAKE A LOOK AT THIS BOARD!!!!! At least the League and Local One has proffesionals trained in "Adult Pissing Matches"....All you anti-union people, believe what you will, but remember, when you see a Broadway show you support the unions. Take care.

"That being said, the only way we can find out who was fair is to find out what the agreement that Short agreed to and Claffey disagreed to said. That's not gonna happen anytime soon. So let's just chill, have a martini, and agree to disagree."

[billynj]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:44pm

glad to hear that the Local one guys are not out of work for the full week and are able to pick up shifts at other venues like Radio City, MSG ,Lincoln Center.

its a shame the other unions don't pamper their members the way Local One does..

[Taka]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:50pm

roadguy, calling someone ignorant isn't name calling. You're right about that. But localone didn't call bk ignorant, he called him an "ignoramus", a "dolt", and a "moron".


I sympathise with the union, don't get me wrong, but I don't know who in the union to support, Short or Claffey. I must say however that all of this name calling on BOTH SIDES are making me wonder.

[roadguy]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 5:57pm

taka,

don't support Short or Claffey, support the union. It's not your business or support for Short or Claffey that will get a deal done. Your support for the union will.

My point about stupid posts was just made clear by our buddy billynj.. "It's a shame the other unions don't pamper their members the way Local One does.." Because they have work to supply to their members that's pampering?? It's not my fault nor local ones fault that the other unions have more members than they can supply work for... Again, useless post... thanks BillyNJ for providing us with such useless information...
Updated On: 11/20/07 at 05:57 PM

[Taka]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 6:05pm

Thanks roadguy.

I actually agree that there are way too many people who side with the producers who are uninformed, but there are several, like bk, who don't side with anyone and are simply asking questions based on their observations. THAT'S the difference between billy and bk.

I used to think that billy had every right to go around making threads, but now I'm beginning to see why other people find him annoying.

[Taka]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 6:05pm

Crap. Double post. Updated On: 11/20/07 at 06:05 PM

[dented146]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 7:27pm

May I ask what may seem like a stupid question at this point? Who hires the workers from the union? It it the show's producers or the management of the teatre?

[bk]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 7:57pm

"BK IGNORANT IS NOT NAME CALLING. It's plain and simple, most people arguing with the Local One guys here are IGNORANT!!! THey have no clue what is taking place other than it's a strike. THey hate unions so LOcal One is a big bully. They complain that Local One is greedy, yet their own comments about how they can't see a show because of a strike is just as greedy. Go stand on the lines, go to the negotiations then come back and report something. OTherwise stop posting stupid comments that are of no value to a civilized debate on the situation."

What are you, twelve? Go back and read all my posts and point out to me in ONE of them where I say I hate unions. Oops, you can't. I have also not called the union a bully, I have called one name-calling member of the union a bully, which he most certainly has been, to me and to others. So, why can't you point to those posts? Well, either it's because you don't read my posts or, if you do, you don't read their content, you just see what you want to see. I am a member of three major show business unions, and have been for longer than you've probably been alive. I have served on the strike committee for the DGA (the Director's Guild of America, just in case those initials are beyond your comprehension). I have posted my thoughts and I have stated repeatedly that I am not taking sides. I have posted repeatedly that I have friends who are local one members. And I've posted that my local one friends are appalled by what you're posting here and the name-calling. One of them went so far as to say that if he could find out who you boys were he would kick the living crap out of you (his words - verbatim).

Everyone who may not agree with everything you have to say is IGNORANT. That must be because in your world there is only one side to every story - YOUR side. I live here on a little planet I like to call Earth, and here on Earth there are two sides to every story.

Calling someone a moron, a dolt, and an ignoramus is not name-calling? And all in one post? I think that it's name-calling and I think that the person doing the name-calling was, in fact, a bully for doing so. You don't think so? Bully for you.

[Taka]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 8:03pm

bk, I'm pretty sure that roadguy was unaware of localone's posts and was talking mostly about billy. You have every right to be angry, but I'm pretty sure roadguy is sorry and just wants to move on.


I have to say that alot of the people who are posting against the unions tend to not know what they're saying. At the same time, those who do know what they're saying have not been treated pleasantly.


Everyone just needs to calm the hell down, sit back, and drink some tea. Get happy.

[bk]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 8:11pm

"bk, I'm pretty sure that roadguy was unaware of localone's posts and was talking mostly about billy. You have every right to be angry, but I'm pretty sure roadguy is sorry and just wants to move on."

I'm not angry. There's no mistaking when I'm angry :)

roadguy agreed with localonecrew's assertion of my supposed ignorance. If he's sorry he can apologize like a person. I suspect he's not. And while we're at it, how about localonecrew or roadguy or any of the other multitude of local oners around here responding to:

http://www.livebroadway.com/editor_files/Open_letter_employees_11-20.pdf

It may just be a load of hooey from the League, but it's very specific. I, for one, would love to have these points addressed.

[Taka]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 8:20pm

You're raising some very valid points. I just wish that they wouldn't be treated with hostility.

[fakemyway2thetop]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 8:30pm

Oh my how this thread has strayed!

[localonecrew]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 8:41pm

i responded passionately because i feel passionate about the subject. did i name call? yes. did i feel that way abot bk's post? yes. do i regret it? only in the sense that i should be a better person than to allow someones anonymous postings about a subject with which they have little knowledge to push me to lower my natural civility.

[roadguy]

Posted: 11/20/07 at 8:56pm

BK,

First off, I know what the DGA is, don't call me stupid. ("just in case those initials are beyond your comprehension.)

If YOU would read my posts, you wouldn't have wasted your time responding the way you did. I never said YOU hated unions, I never said YOU did anything. I just added you to my post saying ignorance isn't name calling, because you're the one who gets so upset over it. I'm not backing the comments being made on this board. I'm just saying step back, not YOU PERSONALLY, and read what people say and then look at responses. One person says stop being greedy, then in their own response give greedy reasons for someone else to not be greedy.

BK have fun with your buddy who wants to kick my a&&, i'm not a local one member. PS tell your buddy not to be a bully!!! I'm also gonna say I bet that buddy of yours isn't walking a picket line anywhere... Correct??

I NEVER EVER said i disagree with someone for being ignorant. I NEVER EVER said because they disagree with me they are ignorant. I DID SAY that people who make comments here, most of them tend to be union bashing, are ignorant because they have no basis or backing for their comments. I don't call someone you dislikes unions to be ignorant if they have half a clue about what they are talking about. DOES THIS MAKE SENSE YET???? MR. I HAVE 3 UNION CARDS BUT STILL DON'T SHOW SUPPORT TO LOCAL ONE, SHOW ME A POST THAT I MADE SAYING YOU WERE A UNION HATER, SHOW ME A POST THAT SHOWS MY LACK OF RESPECT TO PEOPLE THAT HAVE VALID COMMENTS TO MAKE WITH SOME INTELLIGENCE. DON'T TELL ME YOU'VE BEEN IN THE UNIONS LONGER THAN I'VE BEEN ALIVE. YOU DONT KNOW ME.

I don't care how many union cards you have. Your lack of support shows just how much of a "union" guy you are.

If you wanna continue to make this personal bring it on. In the mean time, while i wait for you and your local one buddy who wants to kick my a&& I'll be supporting my fellow UNION brothers and sisters. You continue to sit back and do nothing.("I have stated repeatedly that I am not taking sides") MR UNION BOY