Riedel: "Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early"
Riedel: "Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early"
#1Riedel: "Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early"
Posted: 3/5/08 at 9:36amhttp://www.nypost.com/seven/03052008/entertainment/theater/he_said__i_said__period__100500.htm
-Nellie McKay on the 2006 Broadway production of The Threepenny Opera, in which she played Polly Peachum
#2re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 10:29amUh he's right. Shrek is not about the art, it's about the money!
Flash-In-The-Pan
Chorus Member Joined: 3/5/06
#2re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 11:46am
And you know that, HOW exactly?
broadwayjim42
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/19/03
#3re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 11:56amHe makes valid points, but why does he always have to be such a turd about it. He's like Ann Coulter, deliberately saying stuff to tick people off and then giggling like a maniac when they do.
#4re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:03pm
And you know that, HOW exactly?
It's based of an animated movie, is being produced by Dreamworks to compete with Disney Theatricals, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that it's about the money. DARRRRRRR!
#5re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:04pm
"He makes valid points, but why does he always have to be such a turd about it. He's like Ann Coulter, deliberately saying stuff to tick people off and then giggling like a maniac when they do."
Because he works for The Post. Owned by Rupert Murdock, part of his Faux News Network. Intelligence, Talent, Wit, Compassion, need not apply. The ability to attack required.
#6re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:19pm
I hate when people use deliberately cherry-picked facts and figures to make a point:
"...and with prices at $200 to $450..."
That's a silly aside from Reidel. I'd guess that maybe 2-5% of tickets are actually sold at that price-- max. Most seats cap out at $120, correct? And generally people pay less than that.
Cholly
Swing Joined: 3/26/06
#7re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:23pm
"It's based of an animated movie, is being produced by Dreamworks to compete with Disney Theatricals, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that it's about the money. DARRRRRRR!"
Uh, it's also based on the gorgeous William Steig book (my daughter's favorite) and features a score by the composer of Caroline or Change and the Pulitzer Prize winning author of Rabbit Hole. Might it POSSIBLY be artful AND lucrative? I'm just asking. Is it POSSIBLE?
#8re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:29pm
Of course it's POSSIBLE Cholly, it just doesn't portend well.
Restaurant reviewers generally have three meals before writing a review--I don't know a compelling reason why the same standard shouldn't be held to a show or a movie.
Seeing something a few times over a period of time could actually help the show--an initial bad review might get better if the show improves or after the reviewer has had a chance to "think it over."
Many critics regret reviews--like John Simon with FOLLIES...just sayin'.
East Village
Leading Actor Joined: 9/23/07
#9re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:43pmI don't think Riedel is posting in anything along the lines of a review. And he's far for the first to report on out of town difficulties, creative squabbles or even flat impressions of a show's music. Updated On: 3/5/08 at 12:43 PM
#10re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 12:48pm
It's more based on the movie. Sorry.
Broadway is less about art, if you want art, go Off-Broadway. It's too expensive to produce art on a Broadway stage. Sad, but true. And if the score were anything like Caroline or Change, little kids would be so confused that the would flee from the theaters. So you know, Marketing 101 people!
Cholly
Swing Joined: 3/26/06
#11re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 1:07pm
Well of COURSE it's not going to sound like Caroline or Change. But the creator of that show has a fairly smart and sophisticated ear AND she wrote the very hummable score to Thoroughly Modern Millie. She can write different kinds of scores. Maybe this one will be kid-friendly AND artful. Since none of us have SEEN anything, we don't know what it is! Just because you ASSUME it's exactly like the movie, and not like the original book, and artless money-grubbing, doesn't mean it's TRUE. You don't KNOW anything acrocksyo, you're just assuming based on your own preconceived ideas of the show.
Updated On: 3/5/08 at 01:07 PM
#12re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 1:15pm
You're right I know nothing about the marketing of a Broadway show, I have never seen a Broadway show fail because of bad marketing, I have never seen a show that is terrible but has a terrific marketing campaign succeed. You're right Cholly, I know nothing about Broadway or anything. You know all!
So just for the heck of it, please name for me a score that was artful and kid-friendly, and managed not to isolate it's audience. Oh and The Lion King doesn't count because that was a pop score, wah wah.
#13re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 1:24pm
The Secret Garden? 
And acrocksyo: Ya' think Cholly needs some chill rx?
Borstalboy
Broadway Legend Joined: 2/9/04
#14re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 1:41pmLook, when it comes to the beyond-crass commercialization of Broadway musicals, I'm at the front of the line to denounce the crap....but I found Reidel's article and accusations to be incredibly snide. I mean, I know that's his whole shtick and no one would read him if he wasn't that way and blah blah blah, but still.
teddyp2
Chorus Member Joined: 6/19/05
#15re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 1:52pm
You guys you are fighting over the comments of a bitter queen who sole purpose is to gossip, you can't treat this guy as a journalist, he is the furthest thing from it.
Whether the show is art or commercial is irrelevant. If it were in any different field his actions would be inexcusable. Would it be okay for him to to judge a restaurant before it officially opens but is in the process of fine tuning with its trial period or a fashion runway show, while the designer is still in his or her studio trying to get it together.
Weidman is right...makes no difference that there are charging a hefty ticket price...the fact remains he is casting judgement in an effort to do harm.
keen on kean
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/1/06
#16re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 1:55pmReidel is wrong, as usual. The whole point of the rehearsal and preview period is to allow the company and its creative people to find mistakes and fix them. If a columnist like Reidel poisons the box office well early and often, a lot of work that might survive may not. I hate giving critics that much power, but with ticket prices feeling like real estate investments, he shouldn't be making the creative process into target practice. Even with a commercial piece of dreck, the producers should be allowed time to get it right.
#17re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:13pm
Ah jpbran(dig your icon btw), good one! But it is a tad dark and creepy no? The Broadway version anyway.
But yeah chill rx would be a good thing.
And opinions are opinions, and even though most of the time Riedel is a bitter old queen, his article did make some good points. But yeah I usually disregard whatever he says.
East Village
Leading Actor Joined: 9/23/07
#18re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:17pmThe internet has changed all the rules...journalists can't cling to old standards and practices and still remain relevant.
#19re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:21pmWhat good points did his article make? He reviewed on the press (not on some message board that 1% of ticket-buyers visit) a score that is admittedly not ready to be presented to the public, hence why they aren't charging people to listen to it or just letting everyone near it. He also called Jeanine Tesori a liar in public which really isn't his job. I cannot stand this man for anything in the world and I don't see how people can support his thoughts in this column.
#20re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:25pmYou've never seen a show fail because of bad marketing??? Really?? Happens all the time, on and off-Broadway. The Great American Trailer Park Musical is a great example. Hilarious show, great score, great cast. AWFUL marketing, closed after a few months, far too soon. High Fidelity, say what you will about it, was not the worst thing ever to come down the pike, and could have certainly found it's audience (if Spamalot is still running...), but due to the awful marketing, never got the chance. Those are just the first two things that come into my head, but there are many, many more.
#21re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:27pmIs SHREK Riedel's next TABOO?
#22re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:29pmWow Kelly2 it's a little thing called sarcasim! As I was told I knew nothing by my good friend Cholly. Just you know being a sarcastic guy.
#23re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 2:38pm
"Would it be okay for him to to judge a restaurant before it officially opens but is in the process of fine tuning with its trial period or a fashion runway show, while the designer is still in his or her studio trying to get it together."
I'm not sure if that's a statement or a question, but designers don't workshop runway shows. As for food, it's a rule (at least for the NYTimes) that the critic make several trips, preferably incognito so that he or she experiences a meal like a regular customer.
Had Riedel said laudatory things, I have a feeling Mr. Weidman wouldn't have objected to the "review."
Kelly--Trailer Park did well enough to warrant a tour...not to shabby considering the title didn't exactly draw NYers like flies to grits.
#24re: Riedel: 'Timing is Critical if Comment Hits Early'
Posted: 3/5/08 at 4:04pm
"Reidel is wrong, as usual. The whole point of the rehearsal and preview period is to allow the company and its creative people to find mistakes and fix them. If a columnist like Reidel poisons the box office well early and often, a lot of work that might survive may not. I hate giving critics that much power, but with ticket prices feeling like real estate investments, he shouldn't be making the creative process into target practice. Even with a commercial piece of dreck, the producers should be allowed time to get it right."
Keen, my feeling on this is previews are no longer sold cheap ( if you know about discounts thats one thing ) so the moment producers took cheaper tickets away and most punters started paying full price. Shows should be able to be reviewed from that moment on. The producers can not have it both ways.
Videos