So...are people still COMPLAINING about Esparza losing?- Page 2

[humbugfoto]

Posted: 11/12/07 at 11:09pm

And yes, Bernadette’s “oy” was only in response to her struggles with the envelope, she was not making a comment. However, if you listen carefully, you’ll hear Harvey Firestein utter a gasp of shock =after= the envelope was opened and he saw the name inside.

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 11/12/07 at 11:16pm

Well, it's just hard to say that he's the "frontrunner," as that implies his being judged in comparison to his competition. But I do think it's fair to speculate that his performance will be nomination-worthy at the very least, and that if his role is kept in the featured category, he has a decent shot. But trust me, you're preaching to the choir. I've defininitely given thought to the things you've pointed out, which is why I think it could happen.

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 5:36am

And why would they, there aren't any hunks in the cast or tween idols.

Hunks or tween idols? And you're comparing it with Company's cast? Did YOU see the show? If there are any tweens that found the late middle-aged men in Company attractive, I'd suggest they seek help.

Suggesting that Raul Esparza is the Tony frontrunner "now" is the same as people announcing last spring that James Carpinello was the Tony frontrunner. You haven't even bought the horse and you're setting up the cart to go first.

[Smaxie]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 7:31am

>Raul Esparza is a seasoned Broadway performer with many successful shows (and non-successful) under his belt. He will go on in the future to many greater shows and greater performances. His future in this industry is still bright and he'll have his day. He still has many chances to win a Tony for Best Actor in a Musical.

David Hyde Pierce though...do you really see him going as many places in the future? He is a very talented man, but not a seasoned Broadway performer.<


Before going off to television success, David Hyde Pierce also was in Christopher Durang's Beyond Therapy and Wendy Wasserstein's The Heidi Chronicles on Broadway (four Broadway shows, to Raul's six), was Bill Irwin's understudy in the Mike Nichols production of Waiting for Godot at Lincoln Center, did Much Ado About Nothing, Hamlet and Zero Positive at the Public, Peter Brooks' The Cherry Orchard at BAM, and other roles at Manhattan Theatre Club, the Goodman, the Guthrie, Long Wharf, Center Theatre Group and Reprise in LA.

>Raul Esparza is a seasoned Broadway performer with many successful shows (and non-successful) under his belt.<

In Raul's massive seven year Broadway career, the only successful show he has been in was as a replacement in Cabaret. Rocky Horror, Taboo, Chitty Chitty Bang Bang and Company were all money losers.

[ken8631]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 7:43am

I also saw both performances and strongly felt that Raul deserved it over Mr Pierce.

Ken

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 7:55am

Smaxie, if you're going to claim that all of DHP's off-Broadway and regional performances "count", Raul deserves the same courtesy.

[StageFan2]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 8:28am

Smaxie was just responding to a post skittles (may I call you skittles? ) I'm sure there was no discourtesy meant to Raul. The point is DHP, like Raul or most theatre performers, has had a good deal of regional training and is not just a TV Star (although talented) who lucked into a couple of good shows.


Updated On: 11/13/07 at 08:28 AM

[Smaxie]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 8:59am

It has been suggested earlier in this thread that David Hyde Pierce is somehow not a "seasoned Broadway performer" compared to the illustrious Raul Esparza. So, my response was to cite Hyde Pierce's four Broadway credits and his other prominent theatre credits in New York, Los Angeles and some of the major regionals to dispute that specific claim. Raul Esparza's own Off-Broadway and regional credits really aren't a factor in trying to substantiate Hyde Pierce's theatrical career.

[RockabyeHamlet]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:04am

I was hoping for Cerveris to pull a win. I know I am in the very small percentage for that.

[Smaxie]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:09am

Actually, when David Hyde Pierce's name was called, no one looked happier than Michael Cerveris.

[robbiej]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:13am

In what alternate universe am I residing where Raul Esparza is a bigger star and more seasoned performer than David Hyde Pierce?

[tazber]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:16am

The same universe that's still talking about it 5 months later.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:18am

Only on Broadwayworld, Robbie, where the fan(atic)s know more than the industry professionals.

[Yankeefan007]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:28am

Funny, I was wondering that same thing.

The very same thing.

And count me in on the David Hyde Pierce bandwagon...there's a reason why he won. He won for the same reason why Norbert Leo Butz, Nathan Lane, and Harvey Fierstein won in recent years. An utterly joyful performance that makes being a triple (or in Fierstein's case, quadruple) threat look incredibly effortless.

Esparza, for me, anyway, is an extremely cold performer, and Company substantiates that. Bobby is anything but a cold person. Introverted, yes. Cold? No. Bobby is a charmer. Someone who "takes the kids to the zoo." I wouldn't let Esparza's Bobby take my kids to the zoo...I'd be afraid he'd steal their ice cream and laugh.

No doubt in my mind that he's a talented performer, he does switch from musical comedy, to rock musical, to drama very well. But the Tony people just chose to honor the performance they enjoyed the most.

[Craww]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:44am

Funny, I was wondering that same thing.

The very same thing.

Why.

Why, though?

Why were you and one other person wondering that very same thing? The only complaining I've seen is complaining about non-existent complaining. Of course, now there are people who are complaining about the complaining about non-existent complaining and the entire argument has become even more silly than ever.

[Yankeefan007]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:51am

I was wondering why people thought Raul Esparza was a more seasoned performer than David Hyde Pierce? I was also wondering how someone could think he's "bigger" in terms of recognition.

[Craww]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 11:56am

Sorry. You did not make it at all clear which question you were referring to, because the post immediately preceding yours did not explicitly state it.

You are correct, that specific facet of the discussion was absurd. Of course, the entire thread is absurd, and continuing to offer up our balanced opinions as if the Tonys were yesterday is also silly.

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 12:30pm

In what alternate universe am I residing where Raul Esparza is a bigger star and more seasoned performer than David Hyde Pierce?

Must be a pretty scary one, because even I would not say such a thing. I mean, yes, his career is much more exclusively theater than is DHP's, but where that makes him a bigger star... well, that logic loses me.

In Raul's massive seven year Broadway career, the only successful show he has been in was as a replacement in Cabaret. Rocky Horror, Taboo, Chitty Chitty Bang Bang and Company were all money losers.

I was going to point that out, too, because I think it's an exaggeration to say he's been in "many" shows that have done well, but I didn't because think it's only fair to count some of the other major milestones in his career, such as tick, tick...BOOM!; I don't know how it did financially, but I think you can certainly argue that it was a success -- for him and otherwise. Look at the following it has, and I think it was the beginning of Raul's getting on the map. The Normal Heart was a flop in financial terms, but if I remember correctly, it was a critical success. The Kennedy Center Sondheim shows are sort of in a category of their own, but it's not fair to discount them.

Esparza, for me, anyway, is an extremely cold performer

You obviously haven't seen him in much.

Updated On: 11/13/07 at 12:30 PM

[iluvcioffiiluvtea]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 12:37pm

I love tick tick...BOOM!! I like some of the songs.

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 12:41pm

Emcee,

This was not aimed at you. I'm sorry if you feel that way. I was just reading some other threads from Esparza fans, and this came to my mind. I adore Esparza, but to be honest, after finally seeing his performance, I was not impressed. I like him, as you know, but I did not like his Bobby. This is not to say that you, or anyone else, cannot see it. I'm just tired of people bashing Pierce, as if he had anything to do with the win.

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 1:01pm

I didn't think it was aimed at me specifically, but I am part of the group of people you were targeting. And regardless, there STILL hadn't been anybody complaining about or bashing David Hyde Pierce because of the Tony for quite a period of time before you brought it up.

[humbugfoto]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 1:04pm

BobbyBubby, if you were reading threads, they had to have been old ones, because there’s nothing current talking about the Tonys. So why does your subject header make it sound like it IS a current topic? That’s misleading, to be polite, and a lot worse things I won’t mention on a public board.

If you felt so compelled as to resurrect this long-dead issue and dredge up this muck all over again, common courtesy indicates you should have referred to it that way – that you were reading OLD threads and wanted to discuss an OLD issue.

And what could you have possibly hoped to accomplish? No one has changed their opinions from five months ago, no new information has been presented to shed any new light on the awards process, so why do it? It’s a static issue – it’s over and done with, every angle has been discussed and examined and dissected under an electron microscope here and elsewhere.

What SHOULD have happened is the first reply to your initial post should have been “No, no one is still complaining”. End of thread. Give it a rest!

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 1:54pm

I wanted to have a discussion. Geez. Why do we always read into these things...

[Al Dente]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 2:21pm

Why is everyone getting so up in arms about Bobby ( a much longer time member than most who responded) for bringing up a topic he felt like bringing up? Do we need yet another strike thread or Wicked thread, or, well the list of hackneyed threads is endless. And of course I'm going to say, ORFEH WAS ROBBED! So flame away oh indignant newbies.

[Craig]

Posted: 11/13/07 at 2:33pm

Al- I know it's just a word and semantics be damned. But no one in this thread or any other was "ROBBED" of a Tony. Not awarded, yes. But unless someone won a Tony and had to hand it over to someone unwillingly - no one was robbed. They clearly didn't win. Regardless of the politics involved.