Sunset trivia - Lansbury and MacLaine?

[David10086]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 5:30pm

Does anyone else remember way back when (1990-91) when ALW was first talking about Sunset Boulevard? I remember reading in the 'gossip columns' and even Playbill's "chatter"  (a column which used to be in the front of the book) talking about his next big musical, and that he was hoping to get Angela Lansbury to star in it. Then he said he wanted to have Shirley MacLaine to star in it, marking her big return to Broadway. (There was also talk of him having 2 simultaneous runs with each starring in one - not sure if it was London and B'way, or Los Angeles and London, etc). In the end, allegedly neither one of them was interested in his musical, so they both had refused (again, according to the 'gossip columns'. 

Does anyone else remember this when these two fine musical actresses were floated around? (Maybe he was using their names to woo  inve$tor$ ?) I personally think MacLaine would have made a fantastic 'Norma Desmond'; especially with her facial expressions. 

[castlestreet]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 5:54pm

I do not remember Lansbury being mentioned, but it would t surprise me.  Every actress in New York & LA wanted in on playing Norma Desmond in a brand new Webber musical.  Back then his track record was mostly in tact still and the role was and still is cat nip to any A-List actress.  Among others mentioned at the time were Streep, Minnelli, Cher and the list goes on...

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 6:07pm

It's sound Angela's name came up for a Sondheim adaption that obviously never happened and the Weber version. 

https://forum.broadwayworld.com/readmessage.php?thread=965728&page=1

[David10086]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 9:15pm

Thank You so much for the link. I thought I was the only one remembering Lansbury and MacLaine. 

I do remember a list of actresses named to play Norma Desomond back in 1996, when Buckley was leaving - but I always heard it was ALW going after them, none of them wanting to work with him at the time (the bruises of Lupone and Dunaway still fresh in their memories, I guess?)

 I remember Cher publicly saying "he couldn't afford me" when asked why she turned down his offer. 

Other 'celebrity names' which he was considering at the time (from what I recall) from the obvious to the obscure included Michele Lee, Dixie Carter, Cybil Shepherd, Barbara Eden, Diana Ross, Liza, Jenifer Holliday, Olivia Newton-John (yes, you read correctly) and Kathie Lee Gifford (yes, you read correctly again). 

[Auggie27]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 9:19pm

I heard Cybil Shepard worked hard, did a great audition, and came close.

Wasn't Hal Prince gonna do a version that made the character more aging Doris Day?  We always heard this in the 80s.  I think he felt the silent star part would seem dated or ... something.  I was always intrigued with the image of Day becoming that recluse.    

[David10086]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 9:31pm

I always thought Shepherd would make a great Norma Desmond. She can really sing, and she has the beauty of a silent film star (same with Cher, Lee and Carter). 

SB is definitely a musical which needs a celebrity name to carry it at the box office in America. 

[Scarywarhol]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 10:00pm

Every time I hear about the planned Sondheim/Lansbury version, it makes me so much sadder about what we got. 

[BroadwayNYC2]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 10:07pm

Sunset ain't perfect, but glad Sondheim stayed away.

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 10:37pm

I'm sure Sondheim would've written more than a handful of good songs. Webber's score has so much repetitive filler. 

[Auggie27]

Posted: 8/1/17 at 10:44pm

I actually think it's ALW's best score, the jazzy non-Norma material is era-specific and sharp; but we all have different feelings. 

[Lot666]

Posted: 8/2/17 at 8:08am

Auggie27 said: "I actually think it's ALW's best score, the jazzy non-Norma material is era-specific and sharp; but we all have different feelings."

I don't think it's his best, but I do think it's near the top.

[David10086]

Posted: 8/2/17 at 2:16pm

I, too, don't think it's his best score - but with the stage production it comes out on top (for me). I know in the past it was discussed on other boards that a few of the songs he actually wrote for this musical way back when (story goes he started working on this in the mid-70s when he caught the movie on one of those 'late shows' one night in a hotel room) actually ended up in 'CATS' with some tweaking and alterations.

I recall reading 'Memory' was one of the songs - originally written for Norma's return to Paramount Studios in Act 2 - that ended up in CATS. (Of course, Norma got "As If We Never Said Goodbye".  

[castlestreet]

Posted: 8/2/17 at 2:32pm

That song had such an interesting journey... Originally the bridge leading up to "I've come home at last!" was used in Jeeves in "Half A Moment".  While I'm sure Memory's tune could have worked for that moment, the song "As If We Never Said Goodbye" is one of the few times I feel Webber perfectly matched a soaring moment with the correct musical structure -something he was very good with earlier in his career.  

[David10086]

Posted: 8/2/17 at 10:06pm

WOW - I now see the similarities between 'Half a Moment' and "As If We Never Said Goodbye'. 

IIRC, I had read that "The Ad-Dressing of Cats" was a song for Max, which became "She Is The Greatest Star of All", Both have similarities. Overall, there's no denying Grizabella and Norma Desmond have similar characters.

[chernjam]

Posted: 8/3/17 at 1:11am

Yes Memory was originally going to be in Sunset as a song for Max to the title "One Star"  I'l have to look for the lyrics to them 

 

As for lansbury/maclaine - Im sure their names surfaced.  Between Playbill and (the now defunct) Theatre Week - there was non-stop speculation with names being bandied about regularly

 

[Willy Loman2]

Posted: 8/5/17 at 4:48pm

Yes I remember Lansbury being mentioned.  I think that was about the time she got Murder She Wrote and so was unavailable.   If memory serves, Sondheim was originally talked about as the composer.

[David10086]

Posted: 8/5/17 at 10:34pm

I would rather have seen MacLaine over Lansbury in the role. I think MacLaine would have carried off the 'crazy' of Norma Desmond. 

[NoName3]

Posted: 8/6/17 at 1:42am

And then there is the original musical adaption of Sunset Boulevard commissioned in the mid-1950s by Gloria Swanson.  She wanted to play Norma on Broadway and worked with actor Richard Stapley and cabaret performer and composer Dickson Hughes to write the show.  This version had a happier ending, with Norma losing Joe to Betty but giving her blessing to their romance.  Paramount had initially given Swanson verbal permission to proceed but at the last minute refused to grant her the rights and the work was abandoned.

A complete demo recording was made and was finally released to the public, on CD, just a few years ago.  There is also this from The Steve Allen Show in 1957:  Gloria Swanson singing, fully staged, "Those Wonderful People."

 

Updated On: 8/6/17 at 01:42 AM

[NoName3]

Posted: 8/6/17 at 2:09am

BTW, according to Wikipedia, Sondheim, working with Burt Shevelove, composed the first scene of his adaptation before his chance meeting with Billy Wilder that caused him to rethink the project.

[NoName3]

Posted: 8/6/17 at 2:43am

Track list for Swanson's Boulevard! recording:

ACT 1 - DISC 1
01. MAPS! MAPS! - The Map Sellers
02. SHELDRAKE'S OFFICE
03. THE DOORS ARE CLOSED - Joe
04. MAPS! MAPS! (Reprise)
05. NORMA DESMOND'S LIVING ROOM
06. THOSE WONDERFUL PEOPLE - Norma and Max
07. NORMA DESMOND'S LIVING ROOM
08. THERE'S AN ANGLE HERE - Joe
09. WHAT'S THE ANSWER - Norma
10. NORMA DESMOND'S LIVING ROOM
11. NORMA DESMOND'S MAIN HALL
12. TALK! TALK! TALK! - Norma and Joe
13. I'M A NATIVE - Betty
14. I'M A NATIVE (Reprise) - Joe
15. STAY CLOSE - Joe and Norma
16. HAND IT TO THE GLANDS - The Waxworks
17. NEW YEARS EVE: NORMA'S HOUSE
18. HOLLYWOOD BOULEVARD
19. OFF WITH THE OLD - Betty
20. STAY CLOSE / YOU MUST HAVE LOVE / OFF WITH THE OLD - Joe and Norma
21. NORMA'S BEDROOM
22. WHAT'S THE ANSWER (Reprise) - Norma

ACT 2 - DISC 2
01. SUPERMARKET ON SUNSET BOULEVARD
02. SUPER, SUPER - The Waxworks
03. TAKE A CRACK AT THE ZODIAC - Norma
04. THE PARAMOUNT LOT
05. FOR REAL - Joe & Betty
06. TAKE FIVE - The Paramount Players
07. LAMONT'S OFFICE
08. THOSE WONDERFUL PEOPLE (Reprise) - Norma
09. BETTY'S OFFICE
10. STAY CLOSE / THERE'S AN ANGLE HERE (Reprise) - Joe & Betty
11. NORMA DESMOND'S HOUSE
12. UNTITLED LOVE STORY - Norma
13. NORMA DESMOND'S HOUSE
14. DAWN BREAK ON SUNSET BOULEVARD
15. FINALE - Norma

 

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 8/7/17 at 12:50am

Auggie27 said: "I actually think it's ALW's best score, the jazzy non-Norma material is era-specific and sharp; but we all have different feelings. 

 

"

I agree, but there's the whole "damning with faint praise" thing.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 8/7/17 at 1:00am

Willy Loman2 said: "Yes I remember Lansbury being mentioned.  I think that was about the time she got Murder She Wrote and so was unavailable.   If memory serves, Sondheim was originally talked about as the composer.

 

"

Yes, as discussed above, Lansbury was widely mentioned when Sondheim was working on the project. In one of his books of lyrics, Sondheim talks about mentioning his adaptation to Billy Wilder and the latter convincing the composer an adaptation would have to be an "opera". Since Sondheim hates opera, he dropped the project. But that was all back in the mid-1970s; I heard about it long before Sondheim or Lansbury did SWEENEY TODD.

A couple of decades went by before ALW picked up the property. By which time Angela had been starring in MURDER, SHE WROTE for many years and still had years to go in her long run. I doubt she was ever available for ALW's SB.

[chernjam]

Posted: 8/7/17 at 1:34am

As great an actress as Angela Lansbury is, I cannot even remotely imagine her in ALW's Sunset Blvd.

[nasty_khakis]

Posted: 8/7/17 at 6:57am

The problem with these kinds of stories over time is the difference in "was considered" and "was in serious talks." I've been in casting sessions where they'll throw out tons of names who in no way would considering the role or were appropriate, things like "Jason Alexander would be a great Judas in Superstar!" So a press agent saying "Meryl (or whomever) really wants the role" could just mean they reached out to her agent and it wasn't an immediate hard pass. Lansbury was of course busy filming her hit tv series, but I totally buy Webber thinking she could/should/might do it.

[David10086]

Posted: 8/7/17 at 9:02am

nasty_khakis said: "The problem with these kinds of stories over time is the difference in "was considered" and "was in serious talks." I've been in casting sessions where they'll throw out tons of names who in no way would considering the role or were appropriate, things like "Jason Alexander would be a great Judas in Superstar!" So a press agent saying "Meryl (or whomever) really wants the role" could just mean they reached out to her agent and it wasn't an immediate hard pass. Lansbury was of course busy filming her hit tv series, but I totally buy Webber thinking she could/should/might do it."

This is very true, and it's probably worse now than ever before with social media and the internet. There's no telling what is true and what is - dare I say it? - 'fake news'. However, back in the early 1990s, when this was batted around and Lansbury and MacLaine were exclusively mentioned in every press release, I think the news and possibilities carried more weight.

I recall hearing that he was after Cher to take the Broadway role in 1996 after Buckley's run - knowing he needed a star name to keep it afloat. For a long time it was just a rumor, until Cher was questioned years later in an interview and she acknowledged that she was very interested, but they couldn't agree on money. "He couldn't afford me" was her response on why it never happened.