The Great "Bright" Way- Page 6

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 7/2/20 at 10:22pm

HogansHero said: "...The problem with "Great White Way" and other similar expressions--e.g., "I'm Dreaming of a White Christmas"--is that they shelter notions of white superiority that are the seeds of systemic racism...."

I ran into the gem above while scrolling to see the latest post below. "Dreaming of a White Christmas" "shelter(s) notions of white superiority that are the seeds of systemic racism"???!!!

I think the kind thing is to assume Hogan was drunk when he typed that sentence.

The African American community (in particular, the Black Panthers at first) chose to embrace the descriptor "black" in the late 1960s. As was absolutely their right to do! The reason for the choice has been well documented as the most obvious example of "negative identity" (the act of embracing the negative characteristics imposed by the dominant culture), a term coined by sociologist Erik Erikson in Identity: Youth and Crisis in 1968. All socially conscious Americans adjusted to the change in nomenclature. I don't believe it was a hardship to anyone under 80.

But, now, a half-century later, Hogan wants us to believe "White Christmas" was some sort of racist subterfuge, even though (a) the song was written about SNOW--which is white even in cultures without a history of slavery--(b) the song was written over two decades before African Americans began commonly calling themselves "black", and (c) the song was written by a Jew ("white" in my view, but not in Hitler's). Hogan offers us wanking of the highest order!

 

[SFFrontRow]

Posted: 7/2/20 at 10:25pm

Trish2 said: "Just now watching "The View" and Whoopi said one of her theater friends called suggesting they change "The Great White Way" to "The Great Bright Way." Here we go!"

I have to admit, I have always thought Times Square was the BRIGHTEST place in NYC (especially after the sun goes down) and now that they have that block-long lighted advertising sign on the front of the Marriott Marquis it is even B R I G H T E R.

Plus I have never referred to it as the Great White Way ever.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 7/2/20 at 10:33pm

Sutton Ross said: "That person is reading all of your posts, just like they read mine. They literally sent me a PM telling me they blocked me and begging me to block them. Their tactic is "Im going to say what I want about you but pretend to not read what you wrote! And TELL you that!"

Because they are 12 years old.

Pay them zero mind, they are not worth your words or thoughts. I enjoy reading them though."

Thanks, Sutton. I appreciate the information and the support. The notion that any post in this or similar threads is so horrifying a poster must shield his eyes is risible. It's another liberal circular firing squad: nobody at BWW is pro-police brutality or anti-civil rights or opposed to authenticity of African American expression. The hard questions are how to achieve the latter in an industry where success is so rare for individuals of ANY background; and how do we achieve authenticity of expression if we have to protect every spectator who might be offended?

Updated On: 7/2/20 at 10:33 PM

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 7/2/20 at 10:36pm

Exactly. You are a valued poster, thank you for your insights. Be well. 

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 7/2/20 at 10:54pm

You, too, Sutton. Thanks.

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 7/2/20 at 11:00pm

CT2NYC said: See how easy that was? As far as I'm concerned, this conversation should be over, but we all know how some people don't know how to shut up."

Great. Now to signify wokeness, everyone is pretending we don't just call it Broadway. Because "bright" rhymes with "white," every time I read the new phrase I can't help but think of the old phrase. So increasing the use of this new phrase just means the old phrase is more prevalent when it was otherwise dying out except in the theater reporting and criticism that most people don't read anyway.

[A Director]

Posted: 7/3/20 at 12:37am

I hope Gaveston, Sutton and others read this and listen to what these artists are saying.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/10/theater/systemic-racism-theater.html

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/3/20 at 12:54am

GavestonPS said: "HogansHero said: "...The problem with "Great White Way" and other similar expressions--e.g., "I'm Dreaming of a White Christmas"--is that they shelter notions of white superiority that are the seeds of systemic racism...."

I ran into the gem above while scrolling to see the latest post below. "Dreaming of a White Christmas" "shelter(s) notions of white superiority that are the seeds of systemic racism"???!!!

I think the kind thing is to assume Hogan was drunk when he typed that sentence.

The African American community (in particular, the Black Panthers at first) chose to embrace the descriptor "black" in the late 1960s. As was absolutely their right to do!The reason for the choice has been well documented as the most obvious example of "negative identity" (the act of embracing the negative characteristics imposed by the dominant culture), a term coined by sociologist Erik Erikson inIdentity: Youth and Crisis in 1968.All socially conscious Americans adjusted to the change in nomenclature. I don't believe it was a hardship to anyone under 80.

But, now, a half-century later, Hogan wants us to believe "White Christmas" was some sort of racist subterfuge, even though (a) the song was written about SNOW--which is white even in cultures without a history of slavery--(b) the song was written over two decades before African Americans began commonly calling themselves "black", and (c) the song was written by a Jew ("white" in my view, but not in Hitler's). Hogan offers uswanking of the highest order!"

You still don't understand. You still don't try to understand. You still dissemble. You are still the poster child of systemic racism. Message me again if and when you wish to embrace humanity. I won't hold my breath.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 7/3/20 at 11:19pm

HogansHero said: "...You still dissemble. You are still the poster child of systemic racism...."

And you, sir, are the Grand Poobah of Balderdash and Nitwittery! Along with the High Priest of Poppycock--A Director--you two are doing great work: alienating allies one post at a time!

Hogan, if you had a point here, if you were able to articulate, explain and defend it, you have had ample opportunity to do so by now. Instead, you prefer to perch on Social Justice Warrior Mountain and sneer at those who pass by below. I've heard this SJW stuff described as insane before, but I had no idea they meant literally delusional.

I don't for a moment deny the existence of systematic racism, nor do I doubt that I myself have been the beneficiary of white privilege, whether I always know it at the time or not. I take both claims as articles of faith. But that doesn't mean that every claim of racist treatment is accurate, nor every claim of white privilege ipso facto fair. If such claims can't be examined critically, then any attempt to rectify racial inequality in the theater is just another form of tyranny, with cast substitutions on both sides. This discussion reminds me of those in Bolshevik Russia, when one's class identity was the only qualifier as to the truth of one's complaints.

But, Hogan, calling me a liar--"You still dissemble."--really does end the discussion. You simply haven't the manners necessary to make a discussion, even a heated one, worth the effort.

Updated On: 7/4/20 at 11:19 PM

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 7/3/20 at 11:59pm

A Director said: "I hope Gaveston, Sutton and others read this and listen to what these artists are saying.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/10/theater/systemic-racism-theater.html"

I have read all four message several times and now I am going to run right out and... oh, wait, that's right: what am I supposed to do about any of it? The essay that seems purposeful is that by the theater owner from St. Paul; she invokes the August Wilson model of writing specifically about and for the black community. Of course, the irony is that in doing so, Wilson became the most commercially and critically successful playwright (of any color) of my adult lifetime--and rightfully so.

I'm not suggesting that African Americans need confine themselves to so-called "black theater"; I'm merely saying that Wilson's example at least points to a way forward. (Prime Brechtian point: making people feel sorrow or guilt without offering a solution only breeds helplessness and inaction.)

The essays by the black actress and director could have used a rewrite by Brecht (or Wilson). So the director was asked what his vision for his theater was after he programmed 3 AA plays out of 11. Horrors! How DARE a donor ask how his/her money would be spent?! (Don't get me wrong: I don't think 3 plays by black writers is an unreasonable number; I don't care if ALL the plays were written by writers of color. But I don't see the outrage in a donor or board member asking what the AD intended for the future programming and branding.)

The black actress declines to share specific examples of the racism she struggles against. Okay, but what am I to do about it then? Maybe I would agree with every example she cites; maybe not. I can certainly understand that after a lifetime of confronting racial inequality, every disappointment and challenge comes to seem like a racial affront. But that doesn't mean each roadblock is in fact racially based. If we accept that white people have trouble reaching a perfect understanding of black subjectivity, why would we assume that black people somehow have a perfect understanding of white motivations?

More importantly, the theater is a difficult slog for almost everyone! Yet in most of these essays and manifestos there is a covert suggestion that white artists somehow have it easy. But that is NOT how any but a tiny if privileged few whites report their experience of the theater. A friend of mine came home in the late 1980s spitting nails: after waiting for half a day, she had been "typed out" of an audition for pit singers for CATS because she was blonde! It wasn't racism, just quick and careless shorthand for dealing with an overly large number of auditioners--and it wasn't atypical of her experience in the theater. (She is enormously talented and is still working today. I invoke this as an example of the absurdity of the industry, not because a single anecdote is proof that hardship is distributed equally.)

The point is theater is bloody awful for almost everyone; naturally, people of color will see their difficulties as stemming from racism, but that doesn't always make it so. Nor does it reveal a solution that any of us can pursue. At the very least we need critical dialogues between practitioners to sort out the cause-and-effect of such problems.

And then there is Mr. Alladdin, a talented young man who at 27 has had lead roles on and off-Broadway. I'm sure his success is due to talent and hard work, but 99% of the white members of AEA envy him, nonetheless! Alladdin wants more "care", he doesn't want to be given notes that refer to other black shows (when his real complaint should have been that the note was given after half-hour, something his union forbids), and he wants somebody to say "good morning" to him every time he comes to the rehearsal space or theater. Not unreasonable requests, but ones that have been made by every actor since Thespis. Comparing himself to the slaves of the 19th century seems a tad overwrought.

Oops! I did it again! Treated a writer in the NY TIMES the same way I would treat any writer in the NY TIMES!

 

Updated On: 7/4/20 at 11:59 PM