Tony award for choreography 2007 — Page 2

It is in no way a "little engine". It has millions and millions of dollars behind it and was designed to make money. Disney had intended it to be licensed and rake in the dough for them. The only reason it exists was because there was demand for it.

This isn't some labor of love by up and coming writers who have suddenly found themselves awash in critical and audience love after playing an off-Broadway venue, suddenly thrust against some big mega-musicals. That would be a "little engine that could".

This is a large musical based on a popular movie, backed by Disney and written by two very prolific people.

Newsies has all the advantages over Once, in terms of business. And it always has.

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Questions of quality aside, it also was (I believe) the first Broadway show choreographed by Bill T Jones who is a (deservedly) beloved name among critics.

It's absurd to think that Newsies isn't the underdog here. It's equally absurd to claim that it is the little engine that could, for the simple reason that it couldn't, can't and never could.

Its competition is a well-oiled monster diesel whose every move was calculated to get just what it wanted, aided and abetted by a fawning media who pushed it and pushed for it at every turn. Nothing could ever have stopped this juggernaut. I don't see how anyone could have thought otherwise.

And you can't really blame Disney here. They could have spent a thousand times as much as they did to promote the show, and the result would been no different.

Updated On: 5/30/12 at 08:17 PM

Once.

Updated On: 5/30/12 at 08:27 PM

Bdn,

Obviously, we are on the same page here. Of course Newsies is the underdog, and it has been from the beginning. And don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Too bad it really never had a chance against the juggernaut.

Just like nothing else had a chance against Spring Awakening, the critics' darling of that day.

That engine business, however, has outlived its usefulness.

I'm sorry, how exactly can a show produced by Disney, one of the largest corporations in the world, be considered an underdog? Newsies has huge money behind it, and After Eight, if you're going to say that Once has the "NY media" behind it, bear in mind that Disney owns ABC News, which has featured Newsies on several on its programs, including Good Morning America, Nightline, and The View, which featured the show before it even was announced for Broadway. Maybe Once is the critics darling (we get it- you hate the damn show), but it is absolutely ridiculous to assert that Newsies is some sort of underdog because critics didn't fall all over it.

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Wizard,

How, say you?

Simple. Broadway hates Disney. (It likes Disney's money though) That plain enough for you?

How did a dog like Passion win over Beauty and the Beast?

ABC means nothing to the people who count: award voters.

Have you been following the theatre for any length of time?

So you see, Wizard, we agree.

Disney's might and money mean nothing when it comes to winning awards.

Okay, wait a minute.

I rarely post, but this argument has gotten out of control and honestly, it doesn't make sense.

Of course money and might mean nothing when it comes to garnering awards. It never has, in any art form. And while we both know that Broadway is both a business and an art, the Tony Awards (In an ideal world) reward the artistic merit of the piece. Best Choreography and Best Musical. Not 'Musical with the most Financial Security'. So in terms of artistic merit, Once and Newsies originated at zero. Yes, Once has gotten the positive opinions of critiques, but Newsies has gotten the positive opinions of ticket buyers. Both have. Critics are just people paid to offer their opinions. Just like us, but paid.

On the business side. Of course Once was the underdog. Where would the funding come from? The Producers clearly worked hard to pay for everything and organize it and such, and it comes off as a 'well oiled-machine', looking anything else is poor publicity. Ex. Spiderman. The producers of Newsies knew that if the show was popular enough, Disney would continue to support it. Plain and simple. It's just as mechanic as Once.

There. Now stop getting petty.

Those two shows may not have been big fat hits, but they still managed to make a respectable run- shows with much better reviews and word of mouth have closed much faster than either Tarzan or The Little Mermaid. And as I said, Newsies is helped not only by Disney's money but also by the fact that it wasn't completely savaged by critics and actually has a lot of positive qualities. I'm not trying to say that Disney is infallible, but I just don't see how anyone could argue that their productions don't open with a significant advantage.

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After Eight, where the hell did I ever describe Once as a "little engine that could"?

And when did I suggest that my hypothetical "underdog" musical was, in fact, Once?

Answer to both: Never.

I'm aware Once, with its Oscar-winning composer and big producers behind it, is no "little engine". I was debunking the absurd notion that Newsies is somehow an underdog show, miraculously come to Broadway against all odds.

Stop projecting your ceaseless hatred for Once. It's infused so many of your already condescending and miserable posts. One has to wonder if the only reason you wake up in the morning is so you can hate the rest of the day.

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It's going to come down to how they think the two will do on tour. Which awards would be the most advantageous for both? Just like in the past. Like, when Wicked was doing wonders at the Box Office, so they knew they had to give it some awards, but Avenue Q would need more help to sell with all the mature content, so it needed Best Musical. I think Once will win Best Musical, but Newsies will probably win Choreography, so that Once gets publicity outside of theatre-goers, and Newsies can still claim to be 'Tony Award Winning".

I don't think Once would have made it to Broadway without aggressive producers. It's a tough sell. You know what's not as tough a sell? Cute young chorus boys dancing and singing up a storm with an attractive leading man at the head. Beloved music by a beloved composer. A cult following and school groups coming to the theatre. Disney may have been cautious about Newsies, but once it got to Broadway, it kind of sold itself. So really, I can't blame the producers of Once for working the media, the circuits, etc. Otherwise, no one would know what the show is (for people who know the song "Falling Slowly" sometimes forget it's from a movie), and then posters on this board would have been saying, "Wow, that was a great show, but the marketing sucked and no one knew about it."