"See What I Wanna See" Insight - Discussion

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/19/06 at 11:43pm

Like any good piece of art, See What I Wanna See goes above and beyond the superficial idea of what is presenting. In this case, truth. What is truth? What does truth mean?

Watching the show, it was difficult to pick up on the many different themes and connections throughout the show. No one could possibly pick up on all the nuances, innuendoes, and such. I saw the show late in its run, and even the actors were discovering new things throughout the run.

There are too many ideas to pick up on. Even harder is the direction you see things. The idea of the show is what truth is, and how each individual perceives truth. Depending on how you follow the through-line will change your understanding of the show. What I think when I leave, someone else may not think.

I would like to discuss this. It seems rare, nowadays, that we get such an abstract piece of art – but, also very realistic.

I just want to say I haven’t yet picked up on all the repetition of lines and music…some that is also very important in connecting the three stories – “Kesa & Morito,” “R Shoman,” and “Gloryday.”

First off, we have the idea of truth. Who killed who? Did Kesa kill Morito, or did Morito kill Kesa? Who killed Louie, the husband? Did the Priest lie? We believe who we want. And while there is no answer, we don’t want an answer. It is the way God sees the world. Many people moving about, creating havoc, but the faces aren’t clear.

The Priest, in “Gloryday” realizes that seeing these people gathering to see Christ rise makes him seem like God. This is how God feels – a concept presented very clearly in “Kesa & Morito.” But who is God in “R Shoman?” We could say that each person who sees what they are doing is God. This would make even God subject to lying. We could say that the police play the role of God. Hearing each statement and having to judge in the end. But, truly, the audience plays the role of the police. The actors are telling the audience their point of view.

Then we have the idea of honor. Kesa says that she has confessed he adultery to her husband and wants to kill her lover for her own honor. Then, in R Shoman, Lilly, the wife, wants to kill her husband for – apparently her own honor. Something that was prevalent in Akugawa’s story “In a Grove” was that the wife was ruined when she had sex with the thief. She did not like the way her husband looked at her. He looked at her like she had been ruined. And, unable to cope with that, she knew that either the thief or her husband would have to be killed. I struggled hard, then, with the character of Diyanna, the actress, in “Gloryday.” I came up with the idea that she does want to turn her life around.

Another idea presented by the show is that of curiosity. In “R Shoman” the Janitor states that we have to “smother curiosity.” That we should just turn our backs and leave. In “Gloryday” the Reporter says that he would watch, or step, into the fire. However, the instinct to survive outweighs the instinct to wonder – to be curious. Perhaps the very thing that forced the Janitor to turn away from the “murder” was the instinct to survive. That is exactly why we wouldn’t walk through fire to see what is on the other side. We, as human beings, prefer “to survive” than “to discover.”

The ironic thing is that Aunt Monica, in “Gloryday” states that “the greatest practical joke – played on the common folk – is God.” This follows the idea that “Jesus Christ” is going to rise out of Central Park. This one line sums up exactly what the Priest is doing. This “miracle” he has created is a joke played on everyone. When people expect a miracle, it doesn’t matter who they are – CPAs, movie stars, grocery clerks, good men, bad men. It makes no difference. In the presence of a miracle, we are all of us humbled.

The wonder of it all is that we don’t walk away with an answer, but rather the idea that nothing in life is certain. What is important, however, is each of our individual beliefs. We all need a miracle for different reasons. The play asks, “what’s your reason?”

Anyway, I didn’t even touch the surface on all the ideas presented in this piece. So, let us discuss.

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 12:02am

"Then, in R Shoman, Lilly, the wife, wants to kill her husband for – apparently her own honor."

The impression I got was that she killed him almost spontaneously out of fear. When Louie lifts the knife to indicate he wants them to die "together," you can see in her eyes her conscious telling her not to, but her heart saying that this is what she had to do FOR her husband. At the moment the she is about to stab herself, she turns the knife on him because her conscious takes over for that moment. "There's too much life left in me," she says. So I never got the impression it was about her honor.

[neomystyk29]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 12:17am

Broadwaygirl I totally agree with what you said. She wanted to survive. This ironically brings up the question of survival again. She didn't want to die and survival overcame love in this instance.

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 12:31am

I was drawing more from my conclusions from the source material.

I think we are talking about two different "stories."

I was talking about the storyline following the Husband's statement.

Each person who confesses wants to come off looking best. The Janitor ends up catching himself in a lie and then finally says that he doesn't want to get involved.

I believe you are talking about "Louie" - which I completely agree.

But that theory, of course, doesn't hold in the husband's statement (and vice versa for mine).

Before "No More" she says "This man thinks I'm his property" and the Wife goes completely insane. I always saw her as trying to protect her honor - of course I am biased to the source material. The question is - what is honor?

It was either wearing a scarlet A and live with her husband, or be free with the Thief. "No More" was an outburst, but then she asks him to save her when the Thief "turns." It's hard to decipher whether she loves him through the whole scene, or not.

I believe she DID love him, but cared more for how she comes out of the situation.

[neomystyk29]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 12:38am

Ah yes, now I see what you are saying. I don't think she loved him. I took the situation to make her out as extremely selfish. In my opinion, the wife was simply a gold digger in that story. However, in her search for her own well being her overworked, overbearing husband made her more his property then his wife, and thus she turns.

This is just the logical backstory I put in.

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 12:46am

I saw the show, uh...several times, and every time "No More" seemed to hold a very different meaning depending on how Idina played it that night. So while one night, it may have seemed like a woman trying to save her honor; another night, it appeared to be a selfish, heartless woman; the final time I saw it, it was a tortured, repressed woman breaking free from the prison of her husband. It's very difficult to discuss Lily in the husbands' statement without knowing what happened at the performance you saw, quite honestly. It read so differently from night to night, and changed the dynamic of that whole segment every time.


Updated On: 2/20/06 at 12:46 AM

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 2:35pm

I think my favorite part of the show is Aunt Monica.

I love her line, "I love you - where does that come from?"

IT sort of adds to the mysticism of a miracle. She doesn't believe in God - but she DOES believe in some higher power.

[ashley0139]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 3:41pm

I find this discussion completely intriguing. I saw the show in November and have not stopped thinking about it since. Out of the four shows I saw, this little off-Broadway show left the greatest impact of me. I don't really have a ton to add to the discussion because I only saw it once and can't remember every little detail. I will just continue to read what everyone else has to say.

I will say, however, that the "Glorydays" scene left me thinking about the most. Did the miracle really occur? and such. I change my mind about it about twice a week. I do think, though, that the show is summed up in one quote that I happened to memorize because I loved it so much:

"I think if you have faith, anything that seems impossible is possible." --the Priest

Updated On: 2/20/06 at 03:41 PM

[neomystyk29]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 3:50pm

I love that quote Ashley. :)

[kidmanboy]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 4:03pm

I've listened to the CD once a day since receiving it Friday and find something new with each listen.

Regarding the miracle and whether or not it happened, to me it seems something happened and the question is whether or not it's a miracle. Here the priest chose this given time and place for a miracle to occur, expecting nothing, and at that very moment, an act of God does take place, a tornado, a storm. What other people see as a reason to flee for cover, he sees as his miracle. One of my favorite lines in the show which I will attempt to paraphrase is: "I created a lie which became the truth. The lie was for everyone, but the truth was only for myself." It seems that truth, and in this case faith, is personal and only comes from their one perspective.
In R Shomon, all of their stories, to a point, did actually happen. The janitor probably didn't know that pulling the stilletto out was what killed the husband. Yes the wife's story seems like a stretch, but can one's perspective create another truth from that perspective. Kesa and Morito each know their truth of the situation, and both are correct, but don't see the other's truth. And personal truth, as Kesa and Morito, and the priest seem to suggests, equals faith.
An amazing piece of theater with all of these stories playing off of each other so well.
Wow, that made my brain hurt.

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 4:25pm

"I love her line, "I love you - where does that come from?"

IT sort of adds to the mysticism of a miracle. She doesn't believe in God - but she DOES believe in some higher power."

I love that line too. The first time I saw the show, two atheist friends of mine talked of how they hated the line afterwards, but the very reason I loved it is BECAUSE it's asking us if we can REALLY answer the question as to whether or not God exists. The atheist was admitting that maybe she was even lying to herself in saying that God doesn't exist.

[Marlene]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 6:22pm

I saw SWIWS during previews, and am aware that there were changes to blocking and dialogue.

R Shomon was truly a dynamic act in itself. Depending on whose story you choose to follow, a completely different truths would unfold. (The symbolism of the letter 'A' did not even hit me before it was brought up on BWW, which just added another element in all the facets one could take in from the show.) It just laid down the whole framework of perception, which was definitely a conscious beat that was going on in my head as the performance progressed. I do know when I was sitting in the theater I was lured into thinking one way (which I was aware could be validly wrong as presented by the other statements). But when I had a little post discussion with a friend over coffee, we, both were made aware of peculiarities that we somehow missed while possessed in making what we wanted most to believe evident in our own minds. All in all, you just can’t wholly believe anyone character, because of hearsay, perception, and human nature.

As for Gloryday, I just had a ball with it. The fact that Aunt Monica’s views (which parallel my own in many respects) were transcend before me, along with the ridiculous element of each character that was trying to find that truth, in ways that a grotesque would—just screamed modern satire to me. Hypocrisy. Deception. It made me laugh. Loved it.

I must concur that what you get out of "No More," beyond what you chose to believe, is really is different based on what occurred when you saw the performance. I get a pretty different sense from the cast recording, from other sources and from what I recall from the live performance. The wife’s character, I feel is really dependant on what happened on stage that given. It can really prove to be an argument in favor of the wife or against her.

Kesa and Morito are such beautiful pieces. There is just something uplifting and indescribable about the melody of those two songs. And frankly I did not appreciate them as much until post performance, given the fact that my semi-adolescent mind was just going, "wtf the is happening on the thrust stage in front of me."

Just barely skimming the surface...
Updated On: 2/20/06 at 06:22 PM

[neomystyk29]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 7:43pm

How much dialogue is on the recording?

[Chip1012]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 10:27pm

Updated On: 4/25/06 at 10:27 PM

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 10:35pm

Not a lot - it's mostly music.

But it's pretty much ALL the music.

[JackiesBroJoe]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 10:52pm

I agree Chip. Here we don't have the old bitchy queens going at each other for hours (as much). If you dig beyond the Wicked threads and annoying questions, there are some smart discussions.
Updated On: 2/20/06 at 10:52 PM

[Marlene]

Posted: 2/20/06 at 11:26pm

Personally I totally miss the Thief's lead in before the title song. I really can't think of places where the songs were cut. The recording has all the music. Trying to jog back 4 months...hrm...what's missing BSo?

[itsmeeeee]

Posted: 2/21/06 at 10:32pm

maybe i'm overlooking a thread or a part of a thread... but exactly what is the symbol of the missing a?

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/21/06 at 10:49pm

Personally, I think there are many things. The imperfections of life. But I also think it has to do with the A for adultry.

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 2/21/06 at 10:58pm

Marlene, there is a TINY bit of music missing after the First Message. Other than that, there's nothing that's coming to mind.
Updated On: 2/21/06 at 10:58 PM

[itsmeeeee]

Posted: 2/21/06 at 11:13pm

There is a part between the first and second verses of See What I Wanna See, when the theif says something along the lines of "'never seen a baby like that, shakin her ass like that, they don't make tits like that... who is she? "my wife'" that's missing as well

[bwayfan3]

Posted: 2/21/06 at 11:52pm

This already may be obvious to many,
SO of course there is Lily's song NO MORE, but she also says "we are no more" during LOUIE.
It got me thinking even more about the overlapping of all of the stories in R Shomon and how I take it like they're all a little bit true, it just depends on one's perspective. Lily recalls lovingly telling her husband they are "no more" while her husband recalls it as a seething, attack.

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/22/06 at 12:04am

bwayfan3 - Yes!

There is overlapping because SOMETHING happened.

Yes, they saw the movie Rashomon.
Yes, the thief lured them into Central Park for some hidden treasure.
Yes, the thief and the wife had some sort of sexual intercourse.

But the question is - how did this all happen.

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 2/22/06 at 12:10am

Right, but bwayfan3 is picking up on some of the smaller details of it. To the wife, her saying they "no more" was sympathetic ("We are no more, both of us through/Louie guide my hand, I will honor you"), while to the husband it was a heartless cry to spitefully end the relationship (well...you know the song).

Just shows that what one person intends to say may not be what the other person hears. Or is one of them just flat out lying?

[BSoBW3]

Posted: 2/22/06 at 12:13am

I know what bwayfan meant.

I was saying that there are small similarities because the general setting is the same.

It only takes one small twist to completely botch the story. Imagine what a big lie could do...

Updated On: 2/22/06 at 12:13 AM