Goodspeed cancels Woody's show- Page 2

[haterobics]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 10:26am

bk said: "I know that the man was found INNOCENT by two separate investigative entities - read the article I posted."

No investigations find someone innocent. Even juries don't find people innocent. They determine whether there is enough evidence to bring charges. Even then, it is not up to them whether the charges have merit, just that there is enough to run with...

[TheGingerBreadMan]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 10:35am

Bk - May I ask why you are so militantly invested in insisting on proving the "innocence" of a celebrity? What do you gain from it? I wasn't there, the other posters in this thread weren't there, and you weren't there. None of us know what happened. You can post all the links that you want, and tell us to do our "research" (which, by the way, means nothing, because we can all link articles that will attempt to "prove" one side or the other, and none of them will be conclusive), but in the end, it's all speculation and we don't know what happened.

[Jay Lerner-Z]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 10:55am

It's not good enough to dismiss anybody who finds the accusations credible as pontificating "without any knowledge whatsoever" - if bk would care to click this link, perhaps he might address some of the concerns?

It contends that, in fact, Woody is the brainwasher, and goes into great detail of specific incidents and quotes to back up that assertion. Recommended.

Brainwashing Woody

 

 

[newintown]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 11:05am

I get where bk is coming from. There's a huge part of our society that is violently indulging its collective mob id by embracing every single one of these unproven accusations, and taking it one step further by calling for the blood and the heads of the accused. It's Jackson's The Lottery in a perfect embodiment.

Where is our compassion for the accusers and the accused? Instead of calling for ways of helping both, so many of us immediately scream for vengeance and punishment; neither of these has ever been proven to be a corrective.

We can be (and often are) a truly nasty species.

[Jay Lerner-Z]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 11:16am

I get where bk is coming from too, but when he asks us to "research", that just leads me down a rabbit hole of conflicting opinions. I can read one article and lean toward believing Dylan, and another that will make me doubt her - that's why I am (uncomfortably) reserving judgement. It's such a heinous crime, I would want to be absolutely sure before branding him a monster.

[Kad]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 11:21am

Allen certainly has a rich history of fascination with teenage girls (see: Woody Allen's private notes), which, regardless of the veracity of the charges against him, at the very least makes his a lot of his work solidly out of step with the times and unpalatable today. But taken with his relationship with Soon Yi and Dylan's accusations, it makes it very hard to stand by him. I am skeptical of Dylan's charges, but there are certainly a lot of facts available to the public about other facets of Allen's life to build an opinion around.

Of course there are many, many artists with dark inclinations in their personal lives who are regularly exhibited or produced or read. But while Allen is still alive and prolific, it's hard to distance the art from the artist, particularly when he seems disinterested in confronting what seems to permeate a lot of his work.

[Jay Lerner-Z]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 11:44am

By the way, seeing as bk's Robert Weide link is two years old and focuses so heavily on Mia's defence of Roman Polanksi - Has Mia ever reached out to her over these past forty years to explain her lack of solidarity with the victim? - perhaps it is worth noting that Mia has indeed since apologized to Samantha Geimer, if only in a tweet.

[BWAY Baby2]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 4:07pm

My take is - Leave Woody Allen  Alone- his case was ruled on by the courts- so that is the ultimate arbitrator of innocence or guilt- or should be, anyway. Whether people approve of his lifestyle and choices is ridiculous- and nosy. Does anybody have the right to judge your choices? Live and ket live.

Updated On: 1/26/18 at 04:07 PM

[devonian.t]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 4:28pm

Until someone is found guilty in court, he or she is innocent.  Innocent people should not suffer blacklisting.

Hunt down wrong-doers by every legal means possible, but we are in dangerous waters if we start to find people guilty on the grounds of seeming creepy.

'The Crucible' seems to be the essential play for our times.

[bk]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 7:26pm

newintown said: "I get where bk is coming from. There's a huge part of our society that is violently indulging its collective mob id by embracing every single one of these unproven accusations, and taking it one step further by calling for the blood and the heads of the accused. It's Jackson'sTheLotteryin a perfect embodiment.

Where is our compassion for the accusersandthe accused? Instead of calling for ways of helping both, so many of us immediately scream for vengeance and punishment; neither of these has ever been proven to be a corrective.

We can be (and often are) a truly nasty species."

Yes, we are living The Crucible.  I am not, as a poster above suggests, militantly invested in anything but truth and the fact that these allegations were thoroughly investigated by two separate institutions who found no evidence of any guilt whatsoever would lead me to believe that that is the truth.  I am not interested in mob mentality, assumption of guilt without proof, abandonment of due process, outright lies about someone's private life (Soon-Yi was his daughter, his step-daughter, underage, a teen) - all of which is happening today in every way thanks to the court of Facebook, Twitter, and message boards.   Mr. Allen has, in fact, never been arrested, tried, or charged with any crime.

 

[BWAY Baby2]

Posted: 1/26/18 at 8:19pm

And I have lost respect for Colin Firth- etc.- any any actor/actress who states publicly they will not work for Woody again- and regret they did in the first place- regardless- Woody is now poison in Hollywood and is another victim of a very much needed movement to expose sexual harassment and abuse- but these unfortunate victims who get included- well, I guess that is the way these things go- but Woody is now persona non grata- unfortunately for such a creative genius.

[Speed]

Posted: 1/27/18 at 12:22am

Love is love is love is love. Woody and Soon Yi have had a lasting marriage and have two adopted children. What's "disgusting" about that? Sounds like the real thing to me. Good for them. We should all find a true love like that.  I have. 24 years and counting.  I was 19 when I met my husband and he was 40.

Updated On: 1/27/18 at 12:22 AM

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 1/27/18 at 8:34pm

Jay Lerner-Z said: "It's not good enough to dismiss anybody who finds the accusations credible as pontificating "without any knowledge whatsoever" - if bk would care to click thislink, perhaps he might address some of the concerns?

It contends that, in fact, Woody is the brainwasher, and goes into great detail of specific incidents and quotes to back up that assertion. Recommended.

Brainwashing Woody



"

Fascinating discussion at the
link. Thank you.

BK, if you read that link,
you'll find that while the
judge found insufficient
evidence to establish Allen's
guilt; he most certainly
did not find Allen "innocent"
of all misconduct.

Confidential to BK: you might
want to look up the meaning
of "de facto". My own step-
children were not legally re-
lated to me until I was fi-
nally able to marry their
father ten years ago. That
made me no less a step-
father, as they will be happy
to tell you.

Yes, I realize Mrs. Allen
denies that she thought of
Allen as a father figure. But,
really, what else can she
say in defense of her hus-
band? The fact remains,
she was 9 when she first
met him. I would consider
any 9-year-old I met as an
adult strictly off limits, ro-
mantically. It's called being
a grown-up. But carrying
on a sexual affair with a
20-year-old while still
involved with her mother
is just despicable! Whether
Allen's work should be
boycotted is a different
issue and not one I care
to explore here.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 1/27/18 at 8:37pm

BWAY Baby2 said: "My take is - Leave Woody AllenAlone- his case was ruled onby the courts- so that is the ultimate arbitrator of innocence or guilt- or should be, anyway. Whether people approve of his lifestyle and choices is ridiculous- and nosy. Does anybody have the right to judge your choices? Live and ket live."

If you mean don't shoot him
or don't egg his house, I
agree with you. But surely
I have the right to opine
on people who have chosen
to become public figures.
And, just as surely, I have
the right to decide whether
I will spend my $12 on a
Woody Allen or Mel Gibson
movie.

[bk]

Posted: 1/27/18 at 9:11pm

GavestonPS said: "Jay Lerner-Z said: "It's not good enough to dismiss anybody who finds the accusations credible as pontificating "without any knowledge whatsoever" - if bk would care to click thislink, perhaps he might address some of the concerns?

It contends that, in fact, Woody is the brainwasher, and goes into great detail of specific incidents and quotes to back up that assertion. Recommended.

Brainwashing Woody



"

Fascinating discussion at the
link. Thank you.

BK, if youread that link,
you'll find that while the
judge found insufficient
evidence toestablish Allen's
guilt; he most certainly
did not find Allen "innocent"
of all misconduct.

Confidential to BK: you might
want to look up the meaning
of "de facto". My own step-
children were not legally re-
lated to me until I was fi-
nally able to marry their
father ten years ago. That
made me no less a step-
father, as they will be happy
to tell you.

Yes, I realize Mrs. Allen
denies that she thought of
Allen as a father figure. But,
really, what else can she
say in defense of her hus-
band? The fact remains,
she was 9 when she first
met him. I would consider
any 9-year-old I met as an
adult strictly off limits, ro-
mantically. It's called being
a grown-up. But carrying
on a sexual affair with a
20-year-old while still
involved with her mother
is just despicable! Whether
Allen's work should be
boycotted is a different
issue and not one I care
to explore here."

Read up on the judge - read the article I posted rather than the one that supports what you already believe.  He was NOT involved with her mother when they began their affair.  His involvement with her mother romantically was done.  And has been stated by Soon-Yi many times, he was NEVER around her, NEVER was a father figure.  Sorry, you think what you want and I'll think what I want.  More importantly why do your posts look like this?  Like they're poetry or something?  

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 1/28/18 at 9:10pm

bk, we can certainly agree
to disagree. As Kad pointed
out above, part of the
problem with Allen is the
way his work at least used
to intersect with the charges
against him. That being said,
I still watch Allen's films from
time to time when they show
up on TV. It wasn't I who
proposed a boycott nor did
I applaud the cancellation
of BULLETS OVER
BROADWAY.

***

My posts look the way they
do because BWW's soft-
ware displays ads over the
righthand side of my post
and reply box. So I can't
see and proofread my posts
unless I insert a hard return
everywhere I "guess" a line
will break when the post
is added to the thread.

If you have a solution, I
will be grateful to hear it.

[bk]

Posted: 1/28/18 at 11:17pm

GavestonPS said: "bk, we can certainly agree
to disagree. As Kadpointed
out above, part of the
problem with Allen is the
way his work at least used
to intersect with the charges
against him. That being said,
I stillwatch Allen's films from
time to timewhen theyshow
up on TV. It wasn'tI who
proposed a boycottnor did
I applaud the cancellation
of BULLETSOVER
BROADWAY.

***

My posts look the way they
do because BWW's soft-
ware displays ads over the
righthand side of my post
and reply box. So I can't
see and proofread my posts
unless I insert a hard return
everywhere I "guess" a line
willbreak when the post
is added to the thread.

If you have a solution, I
will be grateful to hear it."

 

I hit quote message and I don't get anything but this message box to type in.  I'm on a desktop iMac.  

 

[BWAY Baby2]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 8:07am

Yes- we all have the right to support- or not support- any artist or performer we choose to support- it all becomes problematic if someone is unfairly targeted and their career ruined over allegations that are not  substantiated- or that are false. Can we all agree with that? For instance, it was not okay for certain screenwriters to be banned from Hollywood during the McCarty era because they were communist- when they really were not. That is where it gets dicey. It is good and righteous to del with harassment and abuse- assault- when it is an issue and clearly occurred- it is not okay to punish and ruin someone who is unfairly accused and did not actually commit the act. Agreed? I hope so. This is the crux of the Woody Allen case- and unfortunately- in this he said/ she said- it is very unclear who is the liar.

[rjm516]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 8:23am

Really can't believe there are people here who think Woody is innocent. Literally everyone else in the world knows he is guilty. 

[BWAY Baby2]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 10:24am

Guilty? Of what- taking a seven year old girl to the attic and sexually abusing her- one time- never to do it again? Yeah, right.

Updated On: 1/29/18 at 10:24 AM

[mamaleh]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 6:29pm

I think Moses Farrow's statements and the finding of two investigations say it all.  I have long believed that Mia Farrow--who at 25 broke up the Dory Previn-Andre Previn marriage--was so incensed by the breakup with longtime lover Allen that she poured lies into their innocent young daughter, denying her a father. That is what's despicable here.  Allen's judgments may not always have been the best, but he is no Weinstein monster. 

The only reason to change the program should have been quality of the show.  While I mildly liked Bullets Over Broadway, The Drowsy Chaperone is a much better show. 



 

 

Updated On: 1/29/18 at 06:29 PM

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 8:30pm

bk said: "...I hit quote message and I don't get anything but this message box to type in. I'm on a desktop iMac.

"

Thanks. I'm using a MacBook Pro with the latest operating system.

But I still get ads over half the screen (ads without a cancel button).

Updated On: 1/29/18 at 08:30 PM

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 8:37pm

BWAY Baby2 said: "Yes- we all have the right to support- or not support- any artist or performer we choose to support- it all becomes problematic if someone is unfairly targeted and their career ruined over allegations that are not substantiated- or that are false. Can we all agree with that? For instance, it was not okay for certain screenwriters to be banned from Hollywood during the McCarty era because they were communist- when they really were not. That is where it gets dicey. It is good and righteous to del with harassment and abuse- assault- when it is an issue and clearly occurred- it is not okay to punish and ruin someone who is unfairly accused and did not actually commit the act. Agreed? I hope so. This is the crux of the Woody Allen case- and unfortunately- in this he said/ she said- it is very unclear who is the liar."

Woody Allen ruined? He's made a
movie every year since the scandal
broke. We should all be punished
so unfairly!

As for McCarthyism, nobody should
have been blacklisted even IF they
were Communists. This is a demo-
cracy and anyone has a right to 
subscribe to Communist ideals if
he or she chooses. Blacklisting
should require evidence of actual
treason, not just attendance at a
meeting.

[BWAY Baby2]

Posted: 1/29/18 at 11:48pm

Gaveston- I agree with what you said- except- Allen is now ruined- a casualty of the Time's Up movement- which of course is very important- and I totally support it- except there will be innocent casualties- there always are- and Woody is one- his movie career I bet is now halted- he is now poison- Chalamet giving back his salary- Oscar winners saying they will never work with him again- and regret ever working with him- there is now a tsunami of negativity aimed at him- now- and though he has been making movies one a year- this will end, I predict- to me- a shame- to many others- obviously- justice.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 1/30/18 at 5:03pm

^^^ I didn't know all that, BWAY.
Thanks for the info.

Let's see where we--and Allen--
are in a year or two.