Either Idina's the most understanding wifey- Page 5

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 8/4/07 at 4:41am

And THAT's why you're being short-sighted. At the risk of sounding like I'm back-peddling (where's orange, she'd point that out!), my sarcastic mumbo-jumbo before was, as I said, pushing your buttons. I don't know you at ALL, and I'm sure the tee-shirt, for you is just a tee-shirt that you wear that's really just something that you find humorous.

But you can't deny the role you play in merely wearing it. The fact that you buy it sends messages to the people who made it about how women see themselves, and it sends messages out to OTHER (less secure, probably younger) women who may have serious body-image issues that men would value them more if they had large breasts than if they were wise, intelligent, and driven. I mean, there's much bigger framework for it. You and your shirt don't exist in a vacuum.
Updated On: 8/4/07 at 04:41 AM

[CJR]

Posted: 8/4/07 at 4:53am

Oh, GOD. You're one of those.

PLEASE don't start with the whole I'm contributing to the sluttification of today's young girls.

I don't wear shirts like that around my munchkins. It's inappropriate. But what I do and wear on a friday night out with my friends is a horse of a different color.

You're right, I don't exist in a vacuum with my shirt. But I bought it somewhere. So what that I wear it finding it amusing? It's out there whether or not I wear it. And it's not to say that I agree with the way young girls are acting and dressing these days, but not for nothing, it's the responsibility of the parent to be looking out for their child. It's THEIR responsibility to guide them into a positive self image.... not mine. I am responsible for the children in my life and I do a stellar job of setting an example for them.

Somebody else needs to police the rest of the children. They ain't my problem. You really wanna break it down? Go blame the media. Go blame the young sluts of Hollywood. But don't sit here and put so much of it on me because I find my tee shirts funny and love my boobs. (and for the record, not all men love big boobs)

And on THAT note, Im really going to bed. Goodnight.

Updated On: 8/4/07 at 04:53 AM

[JerseyGirl2]

Posted: 8/4/07 at 9:37am

It's too bad Idina doesn't read message boards. She would be all, "Damn, people! It was a kinky song lyric. Move on."

[bwayfan3]

Posted: 8/4/07 at 11:59am

When I saw this thread had stretched to 5 pages, I thought for sure there had to be some separation/divorce announcement...but alas no. This thread has taken an unexpected and, dare I say, unnecesary turn.
I don't think that song is a laundry list of the erotica she and Taye conduct in their bedroom. Although many of her lyrics are personal, I get the feeling Idina is a pretty private person and wouldn't exploit that. I think she sought to write a provocative song and those were the things she came up with. Is it possible that something in there actually happened to her or is something she has tried? I guess it's possible but I think it's enough to leave it at that.

[MotorTink]

Posted: 8/4/07 at 1:19pm

Oh dear lord.

BroadwayGirl - I usually ignore your bickering statements, but come on, who are you to preach on what others should be doing? You have your opinions and morals, and that is great. You have strong convictions and that is a good thing, BUT there is a big difference between having convictions and berating someone else for theirs. If someone wants to wear a freakin Hooters t-shirt (I have one myself actually), what is the big freakin deal? It is a very profitable and popular restaurant business in America. It just happens to have several different connotations. If someone wants to wear "Juicy" on their ass, so be it. You don't like it because you think it is bad representation, fine, but don't get on a high horse and tell someone they have self esteem issues, etc. Do you have a degree to be able to make that formative decision? I could be wrong, but I don't think so.

Heated discussion and debate is one of the things I love on here, but all you seem to do on here is either criticize or jump to the defensive of someone who does not agree with you. If you are not willing to discuss and have conversation with a diverse group of people, who most likely not feel 100% about thing the way you do, why do you come here?

[sabrelady]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 2:06pm

Golly I forgot how much I missed this kinda thing on the board!

For my part:Its a (reluctant) open relationship. (Usually on the guys part) IE Ossie DAvis & Ruby Dee, Rip Torn Geraldine Page.
Plus a few more friends and aquaintance i could mention who would mean nothing to y'all.
As one who has worn knee socks and a tunic- whatever it takes to float your boat between consensual adults.

And yes CJR ya has a great set of jugernauts ( oops ARES!) My 38 DD's hold no such respect for me and I am trying the removal route as soon as I can.

Now that's me 2 cents- Round 23 (rings bell)

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 2:26pm

Thanks for pointing out the "deep-seated" mistake. It was getting on my nerves.

[CJR]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 2:35pm

deep seated, deep seeded, you knew what I meant. it's like when I get tired, dont think and spell emphatic, 'infactic' LOL (even though I know it's wrong, I usually don't realize I've done it till much later)

[ShbrtAlley44]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 2:42pm

I know, but it wasn't only you I was talking about. Don't worry. It reminded me of an old teacher I had who would talk about how she would collect the "sleepy seeds" from the corners of her eyes in the morning and I got skeeved. In fact, every time I see the word "seed" I get skeeved. Updated On: 8/5/07 at 02:42 PM

[kellybean2]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 3:03pm

Obviously I'm new here, but from this thread alone, I don't see why people are upset with Broadwaygirl107. CJR seems to be entirely too full of herself, and extremely defensive besides.

[CJR]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 4:43pm

CJR seems to be entirely too full of herself, and extremely defensive besides.

Yes, you obviously ARE new here.

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 7:11pm

Best thing I've heard so far. kellybean, please re-read the thread or something. CJR hardly came across as full of herself, and she is certainly not the one here who is extremely defensive. But I am glad you have decided to form character judgements this early on.

[Craww]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 10:55pm

I think they both come across as full of themselves and defensive. It doesn't matter whether you side with Tupac or Biggie, folks. No matter where you turn, we all lose.

Speaking of Taye Diggs, his best role was in Malibu's Most Wanted. Y/N/M?

[misschung]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 10:57pm

lol! east side west side..

[CJR]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 10:57pm

Not for nothing, anyone can come across as anything other than they mean to at 4am.

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:19pm

Oh, of course both of us come across as full of ourselves. CJR has the best breasts on the planet, and clearly I'm on the cutting edge of psychology, right?

No, really; I've been around these boards for a WHILE, and I think generally all I DO is play devil's advocate. In this particular situation the "That's nasty. Just sayin'" and "...Ew" sort of mentalities struck me as very middle school. There are people who say that about role playing in general, there are people who say that about homosexuality, there are people who say that about interracial relationships, there are people who say that about any behavior deviating from norms (especially sexually), and you know what? They all think they are the most open-minded people on the planet. It's just human nature to try to see oneself as that, but the person who really is that open-minded won't have to proclaim it to justify her stance on something. And it is SO easy to dismiss and then justify something that's a little out there. I was just trying to raise the question about why the particular concept that started the discussion was necessarily any crazier than any other kind of role-playing. Just tryin' to ask--is it REALLY that big of a deal? And if you DO think so, say WHY, not just "well, I'm open to role playing but this...COME ON." THAT is getting on one's high horse. No point in going back THERE again, now, but you see what I'm saying here?

Then, I admittedly got way too personal with playing devil's advocate, but I think the reaction was interesting. It was okay when CJR said that the particular kind of role-playing could be due to "deep-seeded issues," but when I said that wearing Hooters shirts, Naughty shirts, and having your breasts as your avatar could ALSO come from some sort of psychological issues, suddenly I was out of line. Personally, as I alluded to, I think it has to do with social norms.

And yes, I do think there's a reason for young women to be upset by women who represent themselves like that. That's not devil's advocate, that's how I feel. I think when women fish for that kind of attention and objectify themselves, it's a step back for all of us. And the whole "it's their problem" mentality, frankly, sickens me a little, because it's a bigger issue than just tee-shirts. I think it's just a piece of evidence of a common mentality across the board in America today. But I digress.

Anyway, while I think that kind of representation of oneself is harmful, I have friends who do it (on less extreme levels). I still like them. They're good people at heart. But I don't agree with everything they do, and I'm sure I do plenty to aggravate them. Obviously one part we see of people that comes out on the internet is NOT the whole picture.

Lastly, usually when one is playing devil's advocate, she's trying to make HERSELF think as well, or have other people throw ideas out there that do that. It's not some sort of course I'm trying to teach people. God knows my perspective shifts constantly.



Updated On: 8/5/07 at 11:19 PM

[Craww]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:32pm

"I'm totally open minded!" = "But I have friends who are black!"

[Raviolisun]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:34pm

I love me some Idina, but her solo stuff creeps me out.

[misschung]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:35pm

I have a feeling this thread is going to end very soon, so I don't want to dig up an old argument - but it is a very interesting discussion that you all have had here, and a great issue has been raised. I was just talking to a very good friend of mine about her personal life, because she faces a situation which is similar to what's been discussed here.

Women very often get angry when their boyfriends/spouses treat them like objects even though present themselves, perhaps unconsciously, in a way that more or less invites that type of behavior. I'm not saying that women want to be objectified, or that they somehow deserve it when they are, but actions lead to consequences, however small they may seem.

[CJR]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:47pm

"I'm totally open minded!" = "But I have friends who are black!"

Craww, give me a little more credit than THAT.

When I said "well, I'm open to role playing but this...COME ON." I wasn't getting on my high horse. That was my reaction/opinion on the topic.

BroadwayGirl, I DO have the best rack on the planet. Didn't you get the memo?

(ps that was sarcasm.... you know, before you go jumping down my throat about how I'm full of myself and objectifying myself thanks to my deep psychological issues)

I believe the reason you were jumped on for the tee shirt thing is because it's HARDLY on the same level as parent/child role play during sex. If I had said I enjoy getting handcuffed and whipped during sex and you said that stemmed from psychological issues, I think we all might have been a little less apt to jumping on you about it. But the people here who know me and the people here who are friends with me know that to me, a tee shirt is just a tee shirt and you were reading far too much into it..... especially considering *I* was the one wearing it. (but really, the Hooters shirt? doesn't EVERY woman in america own one? I have the shorts too. they say Hooters NYC on the ass. Clearly, that speaks for how little I think of myself lol)

And as for the women objectifying themselves.... this might sound horrible coming FROM a woman, but if being sexy works in my favor, so be it. Obviously, I have lines. I would never sleep my way to the top, whore around or anything like that. But if a little cleavage, or a smile or a wink can help me out in a situation, I have no problem using my 'assets' to my advantage. (and please don't take that as I would flash a cop to get out of a ticket. being downright slutty and having no self respect is not at ALL what I mean)

Updated On: 8/5/07 at 11:47 PM

[BroadwayGirl107]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:49pm

"I'm totally open minded!" = "But I have friends who are black!"
Or. My personal favorite: "But my boyfriend is black!"

Ravioli, I hope you're talking "Larissa's Lagoon" or the way "Straw Into Gold" sounds and not "Heart on My Sleeve" or "So Beautiful."

misschung, even worse, some tend to take the objectification as actual love. I see this happen way too often, and I think it's certainly not something where any young woman should be saying "it's their problem," because objectification and keeping a relationship at your standards seems to be an issue for almost any woman.
Updated On: 8/6/07 at 11:49 PM

[Craww]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:51pm

I was just being hyperbolic, CJR. Don't sweat it.

[CJR]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:53pm

Oh I know. I didn't necessarily think it was directed at me. I should have added after the statement. My bad.

[Raviolisun]

Posted: 8/5/07 at 11:56pm

Ravioli, I hope you're talking "Larissa's Lagoon" or the way "Straw Into Gold" sounds and not "Heart of My Sleeve" or "So Beautiful."

Haha, yeah. Some of the stuff is good. But Larissa's Lagoon...eek.

[misschung]

Posted: 8/6/07 at 12:00am

I mean, I understand that we can't live in this euphoric, imaginary planet where all the women of the world are united and have a uniform perspective on all things. I get that. I think there have always been different types of girls, and different types of women.

I wasn't saying that it's not fun to be sexy, or flirt, or take pride in the fact that you're beautiful. I think that confusing real affection or love with attention based only on looks can be damaging though. But then again, some people know how to deal with that better than others.