More trouble for Cheney?- Page 7

[wonderwaiter]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 3:55pm

Haha - a second (communist vegan homosexual) gunman on the grassy knoll!

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:27pm

If he dies, and this was anyone other than the Veep, the I would guess there might be a trial.

I think whether a true accident rises to the level of a crime varies in many states. But, most would not treat an unintentional homicide as rising to the level of a crime.

But, you can bet if this was anyone other than the Veep, there would be a trial to determine this fact.


Updated On: 2/14/06 at 04:27 PM

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:39pm

Latest rumor:

=====

"This guy has been dead for days-- they are trying to figure out a way to tell the public so Cheney won't be brought up on Involuntary Manslaughter charges."

Updated On: 2/14/06 at 04:39 PM

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:39pm

LOL! Now that's a funny rumor.
Scary thing? Probably true.

[ZONEACE]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:46pm

Wow, Mcclellan can't answer a single question straight. It's pathetic (i'm watching the youtube video of the press conference.)

[Jilani]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:50pm

Texas law provides for the crime of manslaughter if the death was caused recklessly, or negligent homicide if the death was caused due to criminal negligence. Thus, a person can be guilty of homicide even if the death was unintentional. Recklessness and criminal negligence have specific definitions under the law, so as YWIW points out, there would normally be a trial to determine whether the person's actions met one of those definitions.

[mominator]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:51pm

Wow this is surreal!

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:52pm

Thank you, Jilani!

Very impressive legal knowledge...or just as impressive Googling skills!

[DottieD'Luscia]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:53pm

Either way, he'd be pardoned by Bush.

[mominator]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:56pm

Oh so true Dottie. He might even get that $7 fine back as well.

[Jilani]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 4:58pm

Thanks PalJoey! It's a little of both. I don't practice law in Texas or in the field of criminal law (thankfully on both counts), but I do remember learning about the different culpability standards in law school.

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 6:26pm

Randi Rhodes is having a field day with this now!

Bringing up the Levee story and the delay and inaccurate information presented associated with that story.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/14/06 at 11:59pm

NY TIMES:

Carlos Valdez, the district attorney in Kleberg County, said a fatality would require a new report from the local sheriff and, most likely, a grand jury investigation.

===

Did I call this?
Hunter Shot by Cheney Suffers Mild Heart Attack

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 12:06am

While I would love an investigation, I am really hoping this man recovers.

I am partisan, but not that partisan.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 12:08am

We all want him to live, but birdshot is a serious injury for ANYONE, let alone a 78-year-old, and Cheney has treated it with callous disregard. There should be an investigation even if he survives.

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 12:23am

Well, I agree with you there.

I still don't understand why they don't have licenses for guns like cars.

Cheney's office was just going to make this story one big good, until his conditioned worsened.

They are trying to ingore the story. And now, finally, after all of the crap that they have either ignored or overlooked, the white house press corps is finally getting some balls.

The fact that Karl Rove told the president well after the fact speaks for himself. Or, howabout, this just happens the week after the white house has revealed it destroyed emails (contrary to the direction of the prosecutor) that could help Libby demonstrate that he was following commands.

This is a mess. And I don't think it is going away anytime soon.

So, how long have Dickie's hunting privileges over defenseless and flightless birds been suspended this time - one or two weeks.

Too bad it wasn't the other way around!

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 12:23am

Double Post.

Blame the Buckshot.
Updated On: 2/15/06 at 12:23 AM

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 12:26am

From Talking Points Memo, these are the kind of questions a prosecutor would examine:

===

* Why weren't they hunting in a line?

* Who was responsible for doing the guiding -- normally with these big money hunts, they pay a professional guide to take them out -- unless the Armstrong's have a gamekeeper on the property and/or didn't bother having a guide with this party, since they had hunted on the property before.

* Who taught Cheney he could shoot blind into the sun, especially at sunset? (My dad then gave me the same lecture about gun safety I've heard a billion times -- muzzle pointed away from anyone that could get hurt, no taking off the safety unless you are aware of every member of your party AND dogs, never, EVER shoot unless you are certain what is in front of you and that you have a specific target...)

* Why wasn't Cheney treated like any other American would have been -- why keep the police away from him after the incident until the next morning?

* Once a pellet gets into the cardio-vascular system, because they are tiny and lightweight, they can travel. Mr. Whittington was hit in the face, neck and chest -- a region that is fairly dense in terms of the number of arteries, veins and capillaries, many of which are close to the surface, especially in the neck.

* You have a 78 year old man, with a region that is full of blood vessels, riddled with little pieces of shot. And clearly at least one of them has gotten to his heart. Which can cause death of muscle tissue and all sorts of enzyme problems. When you have at least one shot in a multiple-pellet incident, how likely is it that this is the last time there will be a problem?

* Hunters usually wear camo jackets or other long-sleeved shirts that blend into the surrounding background. Over that, you'd wear a blaze orange vest, usually made of some medium-weight material, mainly because the lightweight ones tend to flutter in the wind. When you are hunting birds, especially quail which spook, you don't want some fluttering piece of fabric flowing out behind you.

* It seems unlikely that a shot from a 28-gauge at 30 yards when the Veep is said to have been using 7 1/2 shot would make it all the way through two layers of clothes at the end of its effective target range. So either:

(a) they were much, much closer together or

(b) the pellets are travelling, and given the estimates of pellets with which Whittington may have been hit that I've seen, that's bad news.

Updated On: 2/15/06 at 12:26 AM

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 12:41am

Corpus Christi Caller-Times photographer (and avid quail hunter) George Gongora simulates the impact of Cheney’s shotgun on Mr. Harry Whittington. Here is an image of how much lead would have struck Mr. Whittington:


Corpus Christi Caller-Times

[wonderwaiter]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 1:07am

Holy sh*t.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 9:55am

According to the CONSERVATIVE Washington Times, experienced hunters ALL agree:

CHENEY'S TO BLAME.

snippet:
=====

Experienced hunters put Cheney at fault in shooting

By Joseph Curl
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
February 15, 2006

Mr. Bealle said that although hunting methods are different across the country, it is common practice for three hunters, for instance, to walk abreast as they move forward flushing out quail. The left hunter can shoot left or center, the middle one straight only, and the right one center or right only -- "never, ever to the left."
"And they shouldn't have left a hunter straggling back behind them. They should have got dogs over there, or they should have gone over there to help find the bird. I don't care if you're the vice president; go help," he said. "And then they should have all regrouped; they should have stayed abreast."
Mr. Cheney's spokeswoman, Lea Anne McBride, dodged questions about the hunters' comments.
"The vice president has made his comments on what happened," she said.
Mr. Cheney has not spoken publicly about the incident since it occurred, except in statements issued by his office.
Of the hunters' comments, Miss McBride said: "If you've got other sources saying other things even though they weren't present, that's, you, you certainly ..." She left the sentence unfinished.
The Times interviewed five hunters, and all said their opinions on blame would be held by any experienced hunter and had been shared among shooters in recent days.

Experienced hunters put Cheney at fault in shooting

[YouWantitWhen????]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 9:58am

Some how it will be Bill Clinton's Penis fault. You know it was. He is the cause of everything wrong in this country. Somehow it snuck up on the hunting party, scared Cheney, and startled him into shooting.

It is what they have always done before: In trouble, blame it on the Penis.

[iflitifloat]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 10:43am

If Whittington should die, you can be sure the official cause of death will be a pre-existing conditition that had absolutely nothing to do with the "peppering". Or the subsequent heart attack.

And should he do well, which is my wish, just imagine the visuals when he "meets the press" Just geussing that he doesn't look real pretty, what with all those pellets in his face and all.

[DG]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 10:44am

The birds that interest me the most in this whole scenario are the vultures.

[DottieD'Luscia]

Posted: 2/15/06 at 10:45am

I'm surprised the administration hasn't issued a fake "terrorist" warning to take attention away from the present situation.