Amar Ramasar (Jigger in CAROUSEL) suspended from NYCB over "inappropriate communications"- Page 2

[JSquared2]

Posted: 8/29/18 at 5:19pm

EllieRose2 said: "Innocent until proven guilty does not apply. They screwed up, and one ran away like a child and didn't even say anything, and the other two were suspended this season.This isn't a legal matter or a court of law. Their punishments were already doled out. It's done."

 

That is an idiotic statement.  Please note that I am calling the STATEMENT idiotic, and not saying that you. EllieRose2, personally are an idiot for saying it (since that would be against the rules and I would never do anything like that)!

[Boq101]

Posted: 8/29/18 at 5:43pm

I also don't think it's a care of innocent until proven guilty. Someone clearly was found guilty because they're being punished. I highly doubt a company with a dearth of male dancers and currently trying to distance themselves from scandal would do this on a whim. 

[EllieRose2]

Posted: 8/29/18 at 5:46pm

^ Exactly

Posted: 8/29/18 at 5:47pm

I feel like if they've been suspended... they have already been found guilty. 

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 1:29pm

Here’s some more information about one of the dancers cited in the first article:

Details on the "Inappropriate Communications"

It’s pretty bad and explains the suspension.

"Former student Alexandra Waterbury filed the explosive claims in a Manhattan Supreme Court suit against the ballet company and her ex-boyfriend, principal dancer Chase Finlay, after discovering that he allegedly secretly photographed and video-recorded their sexual encounters, then shared the images with other male dancers, employees, donors and even a pimp."

Updated On: 9/5/18 at 01:29 PM

[Kad]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 1:39pm

Witch hunt! It's just like The Crucible!

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 1:46pm

Kad said: "Witch hunt! It's just like The Crucible!"

I know! "I don’t understand. If they want to send [other principal dancers, donors, and pimps] texts and emails [like “I bet we could tie some of them up and abuse them like farm animals. . . . . or like the [redacted] they are,”] that also contain secret footage of their sexual encounters with said women, what’s the problem?"

Updated On: 9/5/18 at 01:46 PM

[Kad]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 1:59pm

I think one can assume that Ramasar and the other suspended dancer were part of these messages, yes? The article says that Finlay sent messages to other dancers.

I would also like to know what NYCB intends to do about the donor quoted there. Release that name so other arts organizations can know what kind of patron he is.

[Anakela]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 2:22pm

Kad said: "I think one can assume that Ramasar and the other suspended dancer were part of these messages, yes? The article says that Finlay sent messages to other dancers.
"

The Gothamist coverage has more details, and includes alleged Ramasar actions by name, but does not specify Catazaro conduct. Emphasis mine. 

The lawsuit details instances of Finlay's texts. In September 2017, he allegedly sent a naked picture of her to colleagues, writing, "You have any pictures of girls you've f*cked?" which started a group text of them sharing explicit photos. Then, in May, he is accused of sharing another photo, and weeks later, Ramasar texted him, "I love you! Text me those photos/videos!! " Finlay allegedly complied, sending "one 'live' (i.e. short-second video burst)" of him and Waterbury engaged in a sexual act, then demanded that Ramasar send one in exchange. After they shared multiple images of various Ballet members, Finlay allegedly wrote, "Already seen that one. I know you have more."

And:

Finlay also allegedly talked about how he could sell recordings of Waterbury engaged in sexual acts.

[newintown]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 2:47pm

It may be solipsistic, but my initial reaction upon hearing stories like this is an enormous sigh of gratitude that smart phones and the internet didn't exist when I was young.

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 5:13pm

Why?

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 6:33pm

Holy sh*t. I didn't know there were so many straight male ballet dancers! I kid, I kid...seriously, this is terrible and gross. His suspension should be permanent.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 7:31pm

If she was filmed and photographed as it says, “secretly,” and without consent that’s a crime. Non consensual filming of sex partners is a crime and it may also be problematic for the other dancers to possess such a video and share similar ones. It’s disturbing to me that the men who received the videos didn’t immediately contact the police, or at least inquire further to make sure she was okay if it looked like the girl in the video may not have known she was being filmed.

[Anakela]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 7:46pm

Thanks, reddit Broadway thread, for the link to the lawsuit filing. 

There are text messages between Mr. Finlay and Ballet Principal. Mr. Ramasar, during which Mr. Finlay acknowledges that these women who were unknowingly and unlawfully photographed "might be a little pissed" because they were "taking it to the level of showing each other pictures of other women." Mr. Finlay then offered to share Ms. Waterbury with Mr. Ramasar and Alexa Maxwell - Ballet corps member. 

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 8:05pm

CATSNYrevival said: "If she was filmed and photographed as it says, “secretly,” and without consent that’s a crime. Non consensual filming of sex partners is a crime and it may also be problematic for the other dancers to possess such a video and share similar ones. It’s disturbing to me that the men who received the videos didn’t immediately contact the police, or at least inquire further to make sure she was okay if it looked like the girl in the video may not have known she was being filmed."

They not only did not contact the police or inquire further about whether she knew she was being filmed and that images and photos of her and other women were being shared, but they encouraged it, enjoyed what they saw, and wanted more. 

How about the allegation that Finlay and other principal dancers were fined about $150,000.00 for damaging a D.C. hotel room at a party where they hosted underaged girls to whom they provided and plied with drugs and alcohol? How about the allegation that the New York City Ballet's response to this was to also advise them that next time they do something like this, make sure it happens in New York so they can control it better.

Of course these are still only allegations. I do think there is probably some evidence backing some of the claims up though.

Updated On: 9/5/18 at 08:05 PM

[disneybroadwayfan22]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 8:39pm

I know this is pathetic and I barely know him, but I'm actually a little heartbroken by Ramasar's actions. He was the sweetest thing at the stage door of Carousel. I hope he and the others get severely punished for this. That poor girl!

[AC126748]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 9:53pm

Has Ramasar been performing since the story broke?

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 10:40pm

If he has been, Jigger’s scene with Carrie has probably lost the comedy.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 10:52pm

I doubt the producers and director of this particular production of Carousel would be able to grasp that.

[teatime2]

Posted: 9/5/18 at 11:37pm

He performed tonight. Certainly some weird reactions in the audience. 

[Dave28282]

Posted: 9/6/18 at 5:32am

I'm getting "Wild Things" and "Cruel Intentions" vibes from this. Strangely sexy power games and hot people doing things that are actually really out of line.

I know it's forbidden to say, but the sexual part of what they have been saying is something half of the population secretly fantasizes about (in either of the roles) but of course when there are lies, secret filmings, secret sharing, reputations, social issues, interests and jobs involved it turns into something bad.

That's the problem here, and probably the reason why many women fall victim to these kind of sociopaths. At first sight these traits seem very attractive and sexy. These boys should learn that there are many women who would agree with filming and sharing and they should find partners that actually have the same mindset. (If one of these boys should go to jail, pay attention to the stack of love and adoration letters they will receive on a daily basis) The key word is "mutual agreement". Which they don't seem to understand.

Edit: The girl in question says she can say "me too" from now on. I think her situation is actually a bit worse. "Me too" is very often used easily whenever someone felt slightly intimidated. Also in many situations when the person actually got the role/benefit they wanted, they keep notably quiet. It's mostly when they actually thought they had a mutual agreement and the, for example, producer or director didn't abide by what she determined was his part of the agreement, that her perception of the situation changes and thus her choice of saying "me too" versus keeping quiet. In this case, the girl had no knowledge at all about the filming and sharing and I believe that when they were together and whenever she spoke to him she was just his girlfriend without other possible intentions or desires, from what I can read in the articles. So that makes this case much worse, as it goes beyond feeling intimidated. This is an invasion of privacy.

Updated On: 9/6/18 at 05:32 AM

[DottieD'Luscia]

Posted: 9/6/18 at 8:47am

I'm so glad she came forward.  Extremely disappointed that Amar had any part in this. I have always liked him since he joined NYCB. Absolutely disgusting behavior.

[robskynyc]

Posted: 9/6/18 at 9:30am

Princeton2 said: "seems to be dangerous territory that you can be suspended for private messages"

100% agree. that is bull! private messages are private. I'm sure i share things in private texts with friends that I would never share via social media. If they were tweeting the stuff publicly, I can see the problem. Or if they communications were made on a NYCB owned device. But private communications should be just that, PRIVATE. Whether we agree with their opinions or not. I know I wouldn't want my employer reading all my texts... or grindr messages for that reason :-p

 

and before any one gets too riled up, yes i know we dont know what the texts say. but that is irrelevant- unless they were making some sort of credible threat against someone in the ballet, i dont see how private texts/emails have any bearing on their job?

[AC126748]

Posted: 9/6/18 at 9:42am

LOL, yeah, you should totally be allowed to fantasize about raping your colleagues with impunity, so long as you do it through technology.

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 9/6/18 at 9:47am

robskynyc said: "Princeton2 said: "seems to be dangerous territory that you can be suspended for private messages"

100% agree. that is bull! private messages are private. I'm sure i share things in private texts with friends that I would never share via social media. If they were tweeting the stuff publicly, I can see the problem. Or if they communications were made on a NYCB owned device.But private communications should be just that, PRIVATE. Whether we agree with their opinions or not. I know I wouldn't want my employer reading all my texts... or grindr messages for that reason :-p



and before any one gets too riled up, yes i know we dont know what the texts say. but that is irrelevant- unless they were making some sort of credible threat against someone in the ballet, i dont see how private texts/emails have any bearing on their job?"

I'm going to take your post as an opportunity to maybe guide people on how to properly act as a working, functioning adult for a company where there are other employees who are subject to the laws of New York or any other state. This is just a general message and is not entirely comprehensive about all legal issues that may arise.

First off, just because something is in a private message DOES NOT mean it automatically protects you from facing the consequences when people on the outside get a hold of the content of your messages, including employers. It's not the same issue of your employer monitoring messages on your private devices because they did not do that. However, if someone brought it to their attention that you are engaging in activities that are detrimental to the environment of the company that puts them in a position of liability, such as creating a toxic, predatory environment where other employees feel unsafe and have had their privacy violated, then employers have every right and SHOULD terminate you. In the end this is a lesson about how your actions have consequences.

It's not the fact that they were sending private messages in of itself that got them in trouble but the environment in which they created that made other employees feel unsafe. There's also a question of the legality of the actions that they were engaging in and how they put the NYCB in harm's way now that there is a PR fall out AND a question of whether NYCB is liable to pay for damages to the victim in this case. Plus, considering how big that private chat has gotten and what they were encouraging other people to do, I bet more victims may come out and other members of NYCB (like other employees) and persons outside NYCB will be implicated. It sounds like something that started small and private, though no less wrong, became much bigger and less private.

Let's remember that the reason these dancers have been suspended and are in trouble was the fact that a person who was secretly filmed while performing sexual activities got a hold of the messages and found out that the videos and images of such secret filming were being shared among the members of the NYCB. Those messages also revealed that members of the NYCB were encouraging other members of filming other women and sharing those images/footage with or without their knowledge and to share it with many other people such as a donor and even a pimp, according to the allegations. Those messages were then brought to the attention of the NYCB. The NYCB did NOT monitor private messages on the dancer's private devices, but again, if someone brings it to their attention and if the messages are showing the dancers are engaging in activities that may be illegal and/or detrimental to the environment of the company, then the suspension/firing may be warranted.

And before you say we do no know the content of the messages ourselves, that is correct. All we have to go on is the complaint that was filed in court. What I do know is that the NYCB most likely did receive copies of these texts, investigated, interviewed the parties involved, and decided to suspend two of the dancers while Finlay resigned probably because he had no real defense or could not show that he did not commit the actions that would have gotten him suspended/fired.

Updated On: 9/6/18 at 09:47 AM