CAROLINE, or CHANGE or Caroline OR Change?

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 11:52am

I have a question...

I always assumed Caroline, or Change was just the title of this fantastic musical...but I was thinking about some of these plays with two titles (In the Next Room or the vibrator play, The Goat or Who is Sylvia?).

Does Caroline, or Change have TWO titles? As in "Caroline"... or: "Change"?

Am I making sense?

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 11:54am

I believe that is the correct question to be asking, yes

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:04pm

I don't think "Caroline or Change" has two titles. The whole title refers to what happens in the show.

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:05pm

Can you expound on that? An awful lot happens in the show.

What event do you think the title refers to, specifically?

[BrodyFosse123]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:28pm

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:31pm

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057012

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:34pm

Was that supposed to be some kind of contribution, Brody?

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:37pm

It's still amazing art.

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:37pm

Actually, yeah. He's showing you how the title is officially written. It's not two titles or a subtitle. The title of the show is "Caroline, or Change."

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:39pm

I know what the title is. How is this any different?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Goat,_or_Who_is_Sylvia%3F

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:40pm

But what that comma illustrates or implies, however, is very much open for interpretation.

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:44pm

Oh, absolutely, and that's an interesting discussion for sure. But the question was about what the title actually is.

But when you talk about that play, don't you sometimes hear people just call it "The Goat"? I don't know if that's an appropriated abbreviation or how Albee intended it, though. Of course, people also do just call it "Caroline," but they're abbreviating in that case for sure. I just don't know the specifics behind the title of the Albee play. But now we're talking about when people abbreviate things versus what they were intended to be, and that's a different discussion.

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:46pm

I definitely know what the official title is. :) I was just wondering what you guys thought...if it's all one title, two titles, or both.
Updated On: 11/19/10 at 12:46 PM

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:53pm

The way I interpret the title is if Caroline will continue to be the Caroline she has always been or change with the times. It also refers to the change in the change cup.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 12:55pm

It's both. That's the point.

[Kad]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 1:00pm

I always interpreted it as being a dual title. It could have been called Caroline, it could have been called Change, it's being called both.

The punctuation on titles like that varies. For example, Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb. Also, the aforementioned The Goat, or Who Is Sylvia? and In the Next Room (or the vibrator play).

Posted: 11/19/10 at 1:00pm

How do I know that the color BLUE to you isn't the color red to me?

[CockeyedOptimist2]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 1:18pm

So black to you perhaps. So red to me.

[broadwaybelter]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 2:04pm

In the instance of, as you indicate "The Goat, or Who is Sylvia?". The playwright (Albee, for this particular example) seems to suggest that the play could live with either title, as they both seem to serve the entire story justice. In the instance of "Caroline, or Change", I believe the intent is to suggest a statement.

In this show, this woman, Caroline, is utterly broken and confronted with the choice to choose her well being, or her financial burden. Ultimately, which will she choose to consume her life?

When all is said and done, the short answer is: "It's good Grammar".
Updated On: 11/19/10 at 02:04 PM

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 3:23pm

Tell them that cabbage is good for them. Make them eat what’s good for them. They’ll get use to the smell. I did. Reminds me of home, a Northern smell -- takes me back to Ocean Parkway. They’ll learn to love cabbage. I did. I did. Cabbage, boiled, iron, beets -- it makes them strong. Children should be strong and big.

Big strong children.

[iluvtheatertrash]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 4:09pm

For me?

It's either Caroline or change. It's either The Woman She's Become, or Change. It's either Dying Sad and Angry, or Change. It's either This, or That.

This is also my favorite musical ever. I saw it on a Saturday night and was so overwhelmed I went back the next afternoon to make sure what I was seeing was really happening.

[themysteriousgrowl]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 4:20pm

Ditto. I don't think that I've ever applauded as enthusiastically at a show as I did at CAROLINE, OR CHANGE.

[GlindatheGood22]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 8:30pm

I so regret never seeing this show. I listen to the CD at least once a day. "Underwater" is the most haunting song I've ever heard.

As for the title, Dotty has a verse in the Moon Trio that sums it up perfectly.

"Once you was quick
and one you was bright
now it seems you come to some confusion
you're losing courage
you're losing light
lost your old shine
lost Caroline."

[Kad]

Posted: 11/19/10 at 10:21pm

I'm so happy you brought up that verse. It's one of my favorite parts of the whole show.

[iluvtheatertrash]

Posted: 11/20/10 at 1:58pm

Great thing to bring up, Glinda. Let's also take a look at Dottie's:

"It feel like you gotta break yourself apart.
It feel like you gotta break your own heart.
But folk do it, they do, everyday, all the time,
alone, afraid, folk like you.
You gotta let go of where you've been,
you gotta move on from this place you're in.
Don't drown in that basement.
CHANGE, or SINK.
Let go, forget, move on.
This 'aint time for prayin'.
You gotta think."