Flop Musicals Saved by Licensing

[BritCrit]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 10:07am

On the board discussing Paradise Square's mixed-negative reception, I floated the possibility that it might do better in licensing, particularly for schools and drama groups who would claim that its political themes and ideas outweigh its technical flaws. That got me thinking about musicals which underwhelmed on Broadway but had a lucrative second life via licensing. However, the first ones that leap to mind are commercial musicals based on blockbuster brands (The Addams Family, The Little Mermaid). Can you name examples of more independent musicals saved by the licensing route?

[Alex Kulak2]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 10:40am

Legally Blonde kind of set the mold. A quick turnover to licensing, clean and easy to read instrument parts, a slick pro-shot of the Broadway production, which is effectively a blueprint for any high school or community theatre looking to do the show.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 10:44am

If a show recoups 0% on Broadway, it's pretty close to impossible for it to ever get to 100% through licensing. Remember, with licensing, the split is usually 60% to the Authors, 40% to the Broadway Producing Entity, increasing in the author's favor over 20 years until 100% goes to the Authors. But we're talking about licensing fees mostly in the hundreds and low thousands chipping away at multi-million-dollar Broadway investments ($13.5M, in the case of PARADISE SQUARE).

As of a few years ago, shows like FOOTLOOSE and SEUSSICAL still had not recouped 100%, and they've been done by every school and stock company in America. An author can still clean up through licensing, though: Jason Robert Brown did insanely well in the first two years of 13 being available through MTI and produced by every middle school in America. (I bet he still makes more money on 13 than his other shows combined.)

Now, if a show recoups say...30% on Broadway, then has a non-union tour, and maybe an international production or two, and has a robust licensing life? That's a different story. But we should never assume a flop on the level of BE MORE CHILL or TUCK EVERLASTING or DIANA will fully recoup though licensing.

 

https://variety.com/2009/legit/news/life-after-death-on-broadway-1118011669/

https://kendavenport.com/st/

Updated On: 4/4/22 at 10:44 AM

[BritCrit]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 10:51am

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "If a show recoups 0% on Broadway, it's pretty close to impossible for it to ever get to 100% through licensing. Remember, with licensing, the split is usually 60% to the Authors, 40% to the Broadway Producing Entity, increasing in the author's favor over 20 years until 100% goes to the Authors. But we're talking about licensing fees mostly in the hundreds and low thousands chipping away at multi-million-dollar Broadway investments ($13.5M, in the case of PARADISE SQUARE).

As of a few years ago, shows like FOOTLOOSE and SEUSSICAL still had not recouped 100%, and they've been done by every school and stock company in America.An author can still clean up through licensing, though: Jason Robert Brown did insanely well in the first two years of 13 (a big Broadway flop) being available through MTI.

Now, if a show recoups say...30% on Broadway, then has a non-union tour, and maybe an international production or two,andhas a robust licensing life? That's a different story. But we should never assume a flop on the level of BE MORE CHILL or TUCK EVERLASTING or DIANA will fully recoup though licensing.



https://variety.com/2009/legit/news/life-after-death-on-broadway-1118011669/

https://kendavenport.com/st/"

 

Interesting, and the turbulent development of Paradise Square means that the writers will find it much harder to get their money back. I wasn't really thinking in terms of 100% return, more in terms of popularity, but it's fun to find out more about the tough realities behind licensing. 

Be More Chill came to Broadway BECAUSE of its licensing success, and managed to make it to London (Its first run was halted by COVID, but it managed to have a second run in a larger theatre during Summer 2021), so conflating it with Diana feels a bit misleading to me (Although Diana is already enjoying a second life as a camp "classic", it will never make its money back...)

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:07am

BritCrit said: "Be More Chill came to Broadway BECAUSE of its licensing success, and managed to make it to London (Its first run was halted by COVID, but it managed to have a second run in a larger theatre during Summer 2021), so conflating it with Diana feels a bit misleading to me (Although Diana is already enjoying a second life as a camp "classic", it will never make its money back...)"

BE MORE CHILL came to Broadway because of its streaming music success and bullishness of its producers. The licensing had little to do with it, and we know nobody can retire on Spotify money (at least not for cast albums). And again: that money is a slooooow drip to try to fill up a gigantic water jug.

The ideal of course is a show that recoups on Broadway (even if it doesn't make a killing), then has a robust licensing life in equal measures professional theatres (higher fees) and amateur/educational theatres. Urinetown, Matilda, Spring Awakening, Drowsy, etc. But those are rare.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:16am

The Addams Family is consistently the most-licensed musical among school groups.

[BritCrit]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:18am

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "BritCrit said: "Be More Chill came to Broadway BECAUSE of its licensing success, and managed to make it to London (Its first run was halted by COVID, but it managed to have a second run in a larger theatre during Summer 2021), so conflating it with Diana feels a bit misleading to me (Although Diana is already enjoying a second life as a camp "classic", it will never make its money back...)"

BE MORE CHILL came to Broadway because of its streaming music success and bullishness of its producers. The licensing had little to do with it, and we know nobody can retire on Spotify money (at least not for cast albums). And again: that money is a slooooow drip to try to fill up a gigantic water jug.

The ideal of course is a show that recoups on Broadway (even if it doesn't make a killing), then has a robust licensing life in equal measures professional theatres (higher fees) and amateur/educational theatres. Urinetown, Matilda, Spring Awakening, Drowsy, etc. But those are rare."

Wasn't Be More Chill a regional/licensing musical before it transferred to Broadway? It still represented a pretty powerful Broadway cautionary tale. Just because the cast album is a hit, it doesn't mean the musical itself will stay afloat very long in the world of Broadway...

Again, I'm not really interested in the less glamourous financial reality - my focus is on what licensing does for the fanbase...

[QueenAlice]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:20am

"Paradise Square "is a huge show requiring major, specific dance styles (Irish clogging)  and a large, diverse cast.  I'm not sure sure it will do that well in the regional market. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:29am

QueenAlice said: ""Paradise Square "is a huge show requiring major, specific dance styles (Irish clogging) and a large, diverse cast. I'm not sure sure it will do that well in the regional market."

This is a really good point. It's also one of the reasons why producers sometimes advocate for nonspecific races/abilities in the writing & development of shows.

I would love to see the licensing numbers breakdown of where titles like HAIRSPRAY and RAGTIME and IN THE HEIGHTS rank amongst the most-produced shows, because there are a lot of communities that just aren't capable of producing them. (Not to mention more conservative communities that don't want to produce anything that deals with racism in America...) 

Updated On: 4/4/22 at 11:29 AM

[Alex Kulak2]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:33am

BritCrit said: "Wasn't Be More Chill a regional/licensing musical before it transferred to Broadway? It still represented a pretty powerful Broadway cautionary tale. Just because the cast album is a hit, it doesn't mean the musical itself will stay afloat very long in the world of Broadway...

Again, I'm not really interested in the less glamourous financial reality - my focus is on what licensing does for the fanbase..."

It's licensing rights became available before the off-Broadway production and it's transfer, but about a year before. That was preceded by about an extra year of buzz online around it's New Jersey cast album.

It's not impossible for a cast album to spur a Broadway success (Camelot did it in the 60s). The big hurdle was that the biggest demographic for Be More Chill was teenagers, and teenagers usually don't have the money or means to see a Broadway show on their own. Shows like Spring Awakening or Six that have large teenage fan bases succeed because they had adult fan bases first.

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 12:23pm

Jekyll and Hyde, easily. It had a following from the concept album with Anthony Warlow, and the pre-Broadway tour -- and, once it hit Midtown, loads of stunt casting -- helped that grow enough to push the Broadway run way past its sell-by date (and even allow for more tours to follow), but the fact that it was the only thing available for the stock and amateur market, at a time when Phantom licensing was decades away, stuff like Les Mis and Miss Saigon was technically available but flat-out restricted, and few schools (even the performing arts ones) were capable of pulling off a credible Sweeney, really helped it grow.

Updated On: 4/4/22 at 12:23 PM

[jkcohen626]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 3:05pm

Paradise Square seems like it would be very very difficult for anyone to do at community theatres or schools because it required a cast that is as close as possible to 50% Black and 50% White and requires a choreographer who knows the dance styles required and a cast that either already knows the dance styles or is talented enough to learn them over the course of the show.

It sucks because the simple and traditional score, story, and messaging and the possibility for a big cast make it seem like a good candidate for those types of productions.

I could see it working for regional theatres that are able to cast how they want to and not based on a limited pool (schools) or whoever sings up (community).  

[RippedMan]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 7:14pm

Big Fish and Shrek come to mind. 

[DiscoCrows]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 10:54pm

I think Head Over Heels is poised to do quite well, it’s already been picked up a lot of places.

[James885]

Posted: 4/4/22 at 11:11pm

Carrie comes to mind. Since the 2012 Off-Broadway production, it's been popular with high schools and colleges. It has also had a couple major regional productions (Seattle in 2013, Los Angeles in 2015, Off West-End  in 2015) and was even featured in an episode of Riverdale in 2018 - along with an accompanying new cast recording.

Considering how spectacularly the show crashed and burned in 1988, it certainly seems to have a new lease on life.