Posted: 8/1/19 at 12:37am
Well that would certainly be one fair take on it.
And their distain for the RSC’s behaviour many years later when Matilda was nominated wouldn’t exactly disprove your theory either..
Posted: 8/1/19 at 12:47am
TY.
I also dug this out of Making It On Broadway Hunter Foster is quoting some unidentified individual who explained how Voting goes.
"There are four unspoken criteria for Tony voters.
Number one is voting your Best Interest -I'll scratch your back if you'll scratch mine.
Number two is Vote against your enemies. Vote against shows you don't want to succeed.
Number 3 is vote for your friends .
The last criterion is vote for the best show."
Posted: 8/1/19 at 9:15am
Sabrelady wrote:
“Back to original question why ALW didn't win for Best Score- Politics”
Absolutely.
The bottom line is this: There is no way on Earth that Tony voters would give a Tony award to ALW over Sondheim.
Just no way.
Posted: 8/1/19 at 9:32am
Elfuhbuh said: "Into the Woods is overrated, but speaking as someone who loves Phantom, I'll say I can see why it didn't win Best Score, given that it IS basically the same six tunes repeated over and over again."
This claim, or something like it, has been made several times on this thread, but it's demonstrably false.
Here are ten full-length, individual songs from the show:
"Think of Me"
"Angel of Music"
"The Phantom of the Opera"
"The Music of the Night"
"Notes"
"Prima Donna"
"All I Ask Of You"
"Masquerade"
"Wishing You Were Somehow Here Again"
"The Point of No Return"
You can add to that the opera pastiches and a number of musical passages that can't quite be called songs. Because it's essentially sung-through, there is a great deal of repetition, but there are certainly as many individual melodies as in a typical musical.
Posted: 8/1/19 at 10:14am
UncleCharlie said: "I did my doctoral dissertation on this very topic and uncovered a key fact that may explain this. Phantom received less votes than the show that won for Best Score."
I read your excellent dissertation and I heartily endorse it.
Posted: 8/1/19 at 10:26am
kdogg36 said: "Elfuhbuh said: "Into the Woods is overrated, but speaking as someone who loves Phantom, I'll say I can see why it didn't win Best Score, given that it IS basically the same six tunes repeated over and over again."
This claim, or something like it, has been made several times on this thread, but it's demonstrably false.
Here are ten full-length, individual songs from the show:
"Think of Me"
"Angel of Music"
"The Phantom of the Opera"
"The Music of the Night"
"Notes"
"Prima Donna"
"All I Ask Of You"
"Masquerade"
"Wishing You Were Somehow Here Again"
"The Point of No Return"
You can add to that the opera pastichesand a number of musical passages that can't quite be called songs. Because it's essentially sung-through, thereisa great deal of repetition, but there are certainly as many individual melodies as in a typical musical."
Which is around the number that most shows had in the ‘Golden Age’ of. BRoadway.
Posted: 8/1/19 at 1:33pm
Mister Matt said: "yyys said: Sondheim is a genius, ALW isn't. Simple as that.
ALW is most definitely a genius. Simple as that."
Mister Matt, thank you for posting the response that I was tempted to post. Unless we're talking about IQ scores or something similar, all of this is subjective, yet people continue to present their personal opinions as facts.
kdogg36 said: "Here are ten full-length, individual songs from the show:
"Think of Me"
"Angel of Music"
"The Phantom of the Opera"
"The Music of the Night"
"Notes"
"Prima Donna"
"All I Ask Of You"
"Masquerade"
"Wishing You Were Somehow Here Again"
"The Point of No Return"
You can add to that the opera pastiches and a number of musical passages that can't quite be called songs. Because it's essentially sung-through, there is a great deal of repetition, but there are certainly as many individual melodies as in a typical musical."
kdogg36, thank you for taking the time to articulate the facts. As I said above, there are too many people posting their opinions as facts. #FakeNews is rampant in this thread.
Posted: 8/1/19 at 3:56pm
Well, if you look at both Sondheim's musical training and the complexity of his compositions and compare them to Lloyd Webber, it's clear that "genius" is a label best bestowed on Sondheim, if it must be bestowed on only one of the two. Lloyd Webber can't even develop a song very well. Once he gets past that A verse, he can only repeat it, and his B verses usually destroy the melody while developing the musical theme awkwardly and unimaginatively.
Both these men have contributed to our musical theater canon, but I don't think you will find many students of music championing Lloyd Webber's gifts. The same does not hold true for Sondheim.
