Is it time for a mass exodus from Broadway World? — Page 3

I have a hunch that some people on here secretly definitely realize there is this forced pressure for this unfair behaviour on casting agencies but it is just fine with them because they want to get even for things from the past. But it is oh so harmful. Equality starts where rising above this (like the agent) begins. The statistics are already level, so what's the next step? Staying in the victim role and maintain separation or rising above it?

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 08:46 PM

Elfuhbuh, about the casting, we already discussed that with true equal casting any scenario is possible and that if 10 actors audition for a role, of which 9 white and 1 black there is a 90% chance that the role does not go to a black person, based purely on neutral statistics. So what does truly "equal" mean for some people? Matching society? Matching the chances of roles percentage wise? Demanding more, to an uneven level, to get "even". What is the goal?

And yes, the discussion is heated both ways.

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 08:52 PM

Georgeand dot, can you please refrain from this attacking behaviour and get to the point?

Can you explain the burning desire for uneven level then? The core of this discussion is exclusion behaviour. People thinking they have earned the right to unfair behaviour. This agent is trying to rise above that. If we want a level playing field, we should also accept the fact that a white cast is a possibility. If 10 actors audition for a role, of which one black, there is a 90% chance the role does not go the black actor, based purely on neutral statistics. The number of contracts in musical theatre is already around 12% for black people. That is level to society, even higher in commercials. Which is extremely high, given the chance theory, because statistically, if there would be a show with a cast of 8, ending up with 2 black actors (such as Grease live, JCS, every lawyer, judge, love interest in tv and film etc), and let's say 60 people audition, of which 10 black and 50 white, it means that 20% of all auditioning black actors was hired versus 8% of all auditioning white actors.

This happens all the time, so you tell me, are black people that ridiculously more talented? Are they so much more superior? Or might there be a bit forced pressure for this unfair behaviour on casting agencies and is it just fine with you because you want to get even?

Well, this is not even. ""Even" would be matching society. Which would mean 1 black actor in a project of 10, roughly. That is exceeded by far. Level is already really special, looking at neutral chance on a role.

To me it is all about talent, my favourite artists of all time are black and asian. So talent is where the focus should lie, according to this agent, me, and other people on this board. With this out of balance facts, being supported by seeing actual inferior quality often, the forced casting breakdowns etc, it shows that it is currently a problem and a 1 way street that prevents equality.

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 08:55 PM

JBroadway said: "BTW, this is an image/metaphor I've always found helpful in explaining why strides need to be taken to give more opportunities to marginalized people. Dave, you seem to bearguing for "equality" - the image on the left, but look how that turns out.

"

That's an interesting theory, but how would that translate to casting in reality in your opinion?

Because I think that "to favour" certain people based on race, or getting a role or not getting a role based on color is bad per definition, also when the intentions are good.

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 08:59 PM

Dave28282 said: "JBroadway said: "BTW, this is an image/metaphor I've always found helpful in explaining why strides need to be taken to give more opportunities to marginalized people. Dave, you seem to bearguing for "equality" - the image on the left, but look how that turns out.

"

That's an interesting theory, but how would that translate to casting in reality in your opinion?"



The idea is that white actors are the tallest guy - they have the privilege of having more roles written for them, and being generally viewed as the "default" by society (i.e, the fence was built for their height, and they don't need a box to stand on). Let's say the shortest person is representative of Asian actors, who are frequently left out of the conversation. The idea is that directors, producers, playwrights, casting people should make an effort to see more POC for roles. And if a white actor and, say, an Asian actor are equally good for a role (i.e they both deserve to watch the baseball game), the director could cast the Asian actor just because they are a Asian. Technically, this isn't FAIR (just like the short person getting 2 boxes while the tall person gets 1 isn't exactly FAIR), but it's necessary to offset the inherent unfairness in our society (i.e the fence being too tall). Yes, the shortest person has more boxes, but that's because they fence wasn't build for their height, so they can't watch the game without both of them. Thus, directors can't just be blindly equal, because not everyone is in equal standing as it is.

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 09:09 PM

Georgeanddot, don't be a poser and get over yourself.

All I say is that poc are equal and that we must fight for that and that I don't like separation behaviour.

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 09:10 PM

Well, it is.

Jbroadway, I see what you mean but I don't think that's fair as like I said, "to favour" certain people based on race, or getting a role or not getting a role based on color is bad per definition, also when the intentions are good.

At the moment, statistics show that the number of contracts matches society in musical theatre. Which is extremely high, given the fact of chance like I described, so that's great and something to be grateful for.

A very correct way would be a rule for writers, where they must write matching percentages of races that matches society. That would mean complete fairness. But at the moment that would mean less roles for black actors, because most projects have more than 12%, especially in commercials, film and tv at the moment. So that would be a shame, because black people are clearly so ridiculously more talented that that naturally translated to the higher percentage right now, that it would be a shame to have a fair level.

Of course that last past was not serious, but we should acknowledge what is fair and what is not, what is a 1 way street in equality and what is not, what prevents equality and what does not.

In the end it should be only about talent, which is exactly what the agent suggested, but that is made very difficult this way.

We should really ask ourselves, what is the goal and how would we measure it?

Updated On: 5/10/18 at 09:27 PM

GeorgeandDot said: "Read Dave's posts in a robot voice and throw in an occasional beep-boop. It's hysterical."

I traditionally read it as a blonde sorority girl who "doesn't see color" but I'll give your idea a try!