dreamgirls the big screen adaption- Page 5

[GhettoBway]

Posted: 1/12/05 at 11:58pm

Truth - this was a while back with the Beyonce & Matt saying she wouldnt play Deena.

I know Gab cant sing but she said it.

bwaybum: you say black faces on the big screen draws crowds?
"Ray" didnt do as well as the studios expected They are going to use the name "Dreamgirls" to draw people in and as for what you said about black broadway stars doing well on bway. Please tell me what shows are on bway today that star black leads????

[Thetruth]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 12:37am

I think Ray did well as far as all-black dramas go.

I can see now that no matter what happens people will not be happy about the choices made (director, actors, etc) For those people, there's always the OBC and the Concert Recording.

[GhettoBway]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 1:05am

WHY do you all want to see Beyonce play Deena??
Cause she IS the roll????
This is saying she is a clone of Diana and its what people would expect of her...

Why would anyone want to play a role that could damn well be urself?

[silent]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 2:22am

Truth - You need to "free yourself" because Macy Gray's little sister (otherwise known as Fantasia) has shown that she doesn't have what it takes to even BE a superstar. She and Ruben have alot in common. They won "American Idol" but yet they are still a tad bit behind Clay and Kelly Clarkson.

As long as Miss Knowles is not in the movie, everything should be fine.

[Thetruth]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 12:36pm

Silent, I suggested Fantasia for Lorell. That character doesn't need to be a big star becuast Lorell isn't the star of The Dreams, so your argument against Fantasia makes no sense. There is no way in H that Deborah would play Deena unless 10 other people turned it down first. I know she's on people's mind because she closed Aida. I'm a fan of hers, but she is not on most folks radar. Also, Silent, what made you want to bring Ruben into the discussion? And why are you grouping Ruben and Fantasia together? Don't make me have to read you on this board. And just so you know, Ruben's CD is one of the top selling Gospel CD's in quite a lont time.

Either way...here's a short list of Tasia's accomplishments.


Fantasia is the first artist in the history of the Hot 100 Single Sales to debut at No. 1 with her first chart entry.

AUG 2004 - Fantasia became the 1st spokesmodel for American Rag Cie Clothing

SEP 2004 - "I Believe" with 11 consecutive weeks at #1 on Billboard's Hot 100 Singles Sales chart is longest consecutive running No. 1 hit by artists from the "American Idol" franchise.

NOV 2004 - M.A.C'S Cosmetics Fantasia featured Lip Gloss "Fantaboulous" hits the stores

DEC 2004 - 2 Billboard Awards For "I Believe"

That's a lot considering around this time last year she was an unknown! Her CD has already gone Gold and her CD dropped during a very competitive quarter (Eminem, Destiny's CHild, U2) plus all the other idols released CDz (Kelly, Ruben, Clay, Diana). On top of all this, she has critical praise. Her CD was featured on many critics best of 2004 or got honorble mentions. What did Kelly get? Sales are not everything. You need respect to last in the music industry.

Posted: 1/13/05 at 1:30pm

I actaully think that Deborah Cox would be much better as Lorell.

[Tom1071]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 2:33pm

Effie: Jennifer Hudson or Frenchie Davis (although I am way over her)
Lorelle: Ramona Keller (not well known but Lorelle doesn't have to be)

As for any of the other characters, I don't care who plays them as long as they are talented. Updated On: 1/13/05 at 02:33 PM

[javero]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 2:55pm

This is slighly off-topic, but Kelly Clarkson will continue to sell & chart better than the rest of the AI franchise due to the cardinal rule of marketing, the Law of Leadership. She was first out the blocks, the first to enter the mind of the consumers, and so far has delivered a decent product that appeals to mainstream sensibilities. Now if that ain't a winning formula, then you tell me just what is. Reuben is aethestically challenged, more so than Clay early in their season. Sorry, but the record company can not make him over as a "matinee idol". Finally, Fantasia is one of the least glamorous participants in any season, excepting Trencye, so the record company is struggling to make her over as a sex symbol. Honestly, I'm only passing on the views of friends of mine that are advertising execs.

The general consensus among them so far has been that had one of the young ladies of Phillipino descent won, Kelly would be history, because Kelly is not particularly attractive in the video-era sense. They also commented that Jennifer Hudson has the "it factor" to make her a star provided she shed those pounds and finds a star vehicle somehow. Most agreed that Broadway is the route for Jennifer to take. The long and short of is that Fantasia has long row to hoe. These same folks also opined a few years back that a Tony Award would be the key to Heather Headley's longevity in show business because they didn't deem her terribly marketable without one.

Updated On: 1/13/05 at 02:55 PM

[silent]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:09pm

Thank you Javero.

If Deborah won't be cast in this movie, what the hell makes you think Fantasia has a better shot?

I think Deb would be fine as either Deena or Lorell. On the other hand, I can't see Fantasia as any one of the Dreams. Period.

Updated On: 1/13/05 at 03:09 PM

[Marquise]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:14pm

i swear you people carry on worse than the members over at the motown mesage board who still bitch and whine about diana leaving the supremes after 35 years.

[javero]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:21pm

Hey Silent,
IMO the only edge that Fantasia has over anyone that can act (or SING) is the novelty of the AI win. However, that success is fleeting b/c her debut CD is losing traction on the charts and is about be in FREE FALL, lol. I like Fantasia (a little bit), but am still not over those 3 fools on the panel for dumping Jennifer Hudson & Kimberly Locke. Both ladies should seriously consider enrolling in an acting course, getting a casting agent, and trying to nab a "non-singing" role before jumping into musicals to nip all that "but can they act blues" in the bud. I also didn't mean to slame Trencye. She's got lots of spunk and DIVAtude before the acclaim, lol. Funny noone's nominated her for the role of Lorrell. Her voice is somewhat SHRILL, IMO. She probably could amp it up a bit for the part.

Updated On: 1/13/05 at 03:21 PM

[doodlenyc]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:22pm

Jennifer Hudson makes no sense, as a rookie actress especially. I thought her singing was perfectly good on AI, but she had no stage presence. Her emoting consisted of bugging her eyes as if to say "can you believe how loud I am or how long I am holding this note?" Why would the director/producers take a chance that she could carry it off? Does she even have any acting credits? Even if she did, her voice doesnt have the colors necessary...a big vibrato doesnt make a singer.
sorry...one opinion.

[javero]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:35pm

Question: All things considered (including politics), do any of you believe Jennifer Holliday capable of winning American Idol today, were it possible for her to show up with the voice she had when she was at the height of her powers?

[Marquise]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:52pm

sorry had to edit this because i read it wrong.

jennifer holliday would have been a serious contender on "AI" Updated On: 1/13/05 at 03:52 PM

[Thetruth]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:57pm

Silent, I only considered Fantasia for Lorell. Not the other Dreams. To me, The Dreams should be so distinctive that an actress playing them wouldn't be so interchangable as to say that Deborah could play either Deena or Lorell. Sheryl couldn't play Lorell and Loretta couldn't play Deena. That's my point. Deborah can sing her face off but she desn't fit any of these roles.

YOU ask what Fantasia has going for her? In regard to this role:

She's young (Deb is 30 something, which might not be bad. It all depends on if they try to skew the movie younger.

Her VOICE is distinctive and fits Lorell perfectly (shrill, high).

She has sass, spunk and she's funny, which is what Lorell needs to be.

Fantasia has great performance skills. I think she would be able to do a better job with "Ain't no Party" than Deb.


Still, I feel that she would have to tone up and get some braces in preparation for the part.


As for Kelly, Kelly got a lot of benifits the other two idols didn't get. She got to release her CD first with no other Idol competing with her. She's the first, so she's going to be the most well known


Javaro, WTF are you talking about when you say they are trying to turn Fantasia into a sex symbol? Have u seen her new video? It's a lot tamer than her competition. What have you seen that would make her look like a sex symbol?

[Thetruth]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 3:59pm

If Jen was on the first AI she wouldn't have gotten through to the semi-finals because they were looking for something more cookie-cuter and slim. 2nd AI she might've had a chance. 3rd she would've taken Jen Hudsons place in the "Three Divas" and won the show instead of Fantasia.

[javero]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 4:05pm

OK Marquise, then I gather from your desription of her as a "serious contender" you wouldn't consider her a shoe-in which is cool. However, what I hope some of the Jennifer Hudson naysayers will reveal is why the aversion to her "style of singing" which was most definitely influenced by that of Jennifer Holliday. Applying the same logic of countless others on here, Jennifer Holliday would not even be qualified to take on the role of Effie. Let me elaborate. Miss Holliday was not hardly a seasoned actress when initially cast in DREAMGIRLS. Her voice was not doubt considered quite "round" at the time by the hoity toities which is a polite way of saying...Lastly, several posters (who know what they are talking about) have pointed out that Jennifer Holliday required a great deal of "hand holding" in the acting dept. before the production was brought on stream. Its nice to be a nostalgia buff, but we need brace ourselves for the fact that neither Dame Judy Dench or Jennifer Holliday will be the one bringing Effie to life on that doggone screen.

Updated On: 1/13/05 at 04:05 PM

[musicfan2]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 4:11pm

As for Kelly, Kelly got a lot of benifits the other two idols didn't get. She got to release her CD first with no other Idol competing with her. She's the first, so she's going to be the most well known


Or she is a great singer who is putting out great songs that appeal to the public. She has lasted for over two and a half years and is still going strong. Give the girl some credit and please don't write it off as luck. You may not like her or her music (just as I am not a fan of Fantasia), but you can not deny her talent and popularity. You could also argue that Kelly was at a disadvantage because the audience of American Idol 1 was half the size of the audience of season 3.
Updated On: 1/13/05 at 04:11 PM

[javero]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 4:15pm

I say both in regard to Kelly. She's a great singer, IMO and she had the avantage of "first strike". Wow, we've covered a lot of ground in this thread.

Updated On: 1/13/05 at 04:15 PM

[perfusion]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 5:01pm

I would love to see Sheryl Lee Ralph,Loretta Devine,Jennifer Holiday & Deborah or Teresa Burrell in the movie as there original characters in the present on the night of a Dreams reunion,then they could talk about how they all got started & flasback.
Wishful thinking ,but it would be so cool to see them all together again. I remember seeing Sheryl,Jennifer & Loretta on the Vibe talk show a few years ago they still had the chemistry they had in the 1980's.

[Plum]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 5:06pm

How did this become an American Idol thread? Oy.

[perfusion]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 5:21pm

Sombody mentioned Fantasia & all h*** broke loose.

HAHAAHA!!!!!!

[Marquise]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 5:22pm

yes javero, you got my point exactly. she would most def have been a serious contender. would she have won? who knows?
and yes, jennifer holliday was very much a raw talent when she was cast as "effie" in one of the early "dreamgirls" workshops and michael bennett didn't really have any real faith in her at the time.
the original workshop actually had nell carter as "effie", when carter left for LA and the sit-com "Gimme A Break" she was replaced briefly by Cheryl Barnes, who can be seen in the motion picture version of "Hair" (and it's soundtrack) singing the sh!t out of "Easy To Be Hard". When the workshop was picked back up after a brief hiatus Barnes no longer proved available so Holliday was chosen. In the middle of all this the show was undergoing some major changes and what initially was a "Valley of the Dolls" type scenario with three young black girls trying to make it in show business evolved into the story of a black singing trio a la The Supremes. The "Effie" character was diminished somewhat and the spotlight given more to the "Deena" character. This didn't sit well with Holliday and she abruptly left and was replaced by Jenifer Lewis.
Bennett wanted Cheryl Barnes back in the role, but the authors of the piece (Tom Eyen and Henry Krieger) had such faith in Holliday (despite her limited acting ability) that they succeeded in convincing Bennett that Holliday was the one for the part.
They eventually won Holliday back by telling her that they would beef the character of "Effie" up and give her a happy ending and not the death sentence they initially had given the character.
She returned and the rest is Broadway History.
For a fascinating look into the making of "Dreamgirls" you should most definitely read "A Chorus Line and the musicals of Michael Bennett" by Ken Mandelbaum.
It's out of print but I'm sure a library somewhere has a copy.

Updated On: 1/13/05 at 05:22 PM

[Thetruth]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 5:22pm

I'm not dissin Kelly. I posted my comment in response to Silent blasting Fantasia's career. I'm a fan of Kelly's as well...Also, it could be said that it was harder for Fantasia and Ruben to win because more people tried out and the pool of talent was greater in those seasons :) Either way, this ain't about Kelly. I'm willing to go on record in saying that she will not be one of The Dreams. Maybe she could be in "Cadillac Car"

[Plum]

Posted: 1/13/05 at 6:27pm

So...anyone who knows this musical better than I do want to talk about something other than casting? What, for example, might be cut? How would you like to see it presented?