New Poll: Which LES MIS Character Do You Think Deserves Another Song in the Film?- Page 2

[tazber]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 3:56am

Having not see Les Mis live for about 5 years I watched the O2 concert last night and was surprised that although the show does seem long it's only 2 1/2 hours minus intermission.

The other thing that I didn't recall was how big a part Enjorlas actually has. He registered much more than Marius. Of course that may have had more to do with Nick Jonas being so utterly out of place and, to judge by his facial expressions, very constipated.

Updated On: 2/4/12 at 03:56 AM

[Princeton Returns]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 5:48am

Surely the new song will just be for the credits like Phantom?

[sueb1863]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:32am

I'm thinking that, too. The new song won't be for any one character, it's just something to run under the end credits and qualify for a Best Song nomination.

It'd be nice if Valjean got a song to sum up his feelings of loneliness and sorrow over losing Cosette to Marius, something acutely spelled out in the novel, but I doubt they'd ever go that route.

[jo]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:49am

Or a duet between Valjean and Cosette highlighting the growing contretemps between adoptive father and daughter about Marius. In the Neeson movie, I remember Cosette ( Claire Danes) expressing her resentment over Valjean's over-protectiveness. Valjean can express his fatherly concern, not realizing his daughter has grown up.

Another possibility -- there was buzz from insiders that Tom Hooper wants to present a more gritty picture of the characters and/or the storyline. Of course, this is not confirmed, but his cinematic vision could be different or slightly different from what we are familiar with of the stage musical...Perhaps of the life of Valjean before he found salvation with the Bishop of Digne -- and maybe a song to capture the pain and feeling of helplessness of his oppressed state?

Re the friends of the ABC -

It is Enjolras, not Enjorlas ( Hey, BWW )

And "Don Zhu-an" does grate to the ears, Grantaire! Es un nombre Espanol

[best12bars]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:02am

Having not see Les Mis live for about 5 years I watched the O2 concert last night and was surprised that although the show does seem long it's only 2 1/2 hours minus intermission.

This had to have been a cutdown version, then. I distinctly remember it going on well past 3 hours when I saw the OBC. And I don't recall them taking a 45-minute intermission.

And it was a very LONG 3 hours at that.

Updated On: 2/4/12 at 07:02 AM

[michellek45]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:15am

I agree with jo's suggestion of a duet between Valjean and Cosette- their relationship, and her character, is sorely underdeveloped. I also think Marius needs something, because he kind of prances around like an annoying love-struck puppy until "Empty Chairs." Maybe something between him and Eponine, because it seems like they have an actual friendship, and I'd like to see that built on a little.

[AEA AGMA SM]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 9:17am

The original Broadway production did run over three hours. At some point, later in the run, and I don't remember exactly when, they cut it down to get it just under three hours in order to save money on overtime costs.

[best12bars]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 9:38am

I just looked it up. The show ran 3 hours 10 minutes when it first opened in NY. I have no idea what was cut or tightened later on.

If you take out the intermission, that's a running time of 2 hrs. 55 min. If it's running 2 1/2 now, that means 25 minutes were cut (or perhaps they just tightened it up).

I didn't see it again for 15 years. I will say, despite seeing it with the full original cast on Broadway, I liked it better the second time around. Perhaps the tightening helped, or maybe it was the new cast (I saw it on tour).

Updated On: 2/4/12 at 09:38 AM

[Rumpelstiltskin]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 12:03pm

The new song should close major gaps in the storyline. We all know that Les Mis is basically a treatise on law and order, posing the question of whether the punishment fits the crime. It asks us to debate whether a 19 year sentence is appropriate for the theft of a bread loaf, but doesn't give us the relevant facts to make an informed decision. What kind of bread are we talking about? While 19 years may appear harsh for a loaf of Wonder (despite its promise to build strong bodies 12 ways), it is reasonable for a nice onion bialy or paneer-stuffed kulcha, appropriately spiced. And, if we examine the original French more closely, perhaps the "loaf of bread" was simply a lazy translation for what was more likely a cruller or croissant. Throw in a sweet marzipan filling and Valjean should thank his lucky stars for such a light sentence.

The new song "My Last Croissant - My Final Franc" will be sung by a new character, the Baker, played by Cheyenne Jackson in his underwear. (I haven't worked out why, but the wardrobe requirement is essential to the plot.) The baker's wife will be played by Patti Lupone.

[adam.peterson44]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 12:11pm

You had me at paneer-stuffed kulcha.

Cheyenne Jackson and the associated wardrobe is a nice bonus, though.

And a big ol' "Yes, please!" to more songs sung by Aaron Tveit as Enjolras. Updated On: 2/4/12 at 12:11 PM

[jdtp12]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 2:15pm

"I'm thinking that, too. The new song won't be for any one character, it's just something to run under the end credits and qualify for a Best Song nomination."

I thought that songs during the credits no longer qualify for Best Song? Don't they actually have to be in the film?

Perhaps they could add a new song where the instrumental for "Bring Him Home" is after the battle..

[sueb1863]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 2:28pm

I'm not sure if they changed the rules for Best Song, although that would explain why there are only two nominees this year.

And I really don't want them to cut the instrumental BHH right after the barricades fall. That's one of the best, most dramatic points in the show for me, and it'd be so effective on film, playing under the action as Valjean escapes with Marius, we see the bodies of Enjolras and Gavroche, and Javert looking for Valjean among the dead bodies of the students. I REALLY hope Hooper leaves that part in.

Updated On: 2/4/12 at 02:28 PM

[darquegk]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 5:59pm

Speaking of which...

During that segment, I wonder if the camera will spin 360 degrees around the battlefield, emulating the famous spinning barricade.

[jo]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:01pm

http://www.oscars.org/awards/academyawards/rules/rule16.html

>>CATEGORIES

A.Original Score:
An original score is a substantial body of music that serves as original dramatic underscoring and is written specifically for the motion picture by the submitting composer.

B.Original Song:
An original song consists of words and music, both of which are original and written specifically for the motion picture. There must be a clearly audible, intelligible, substantive rendition (not necessarily visually presented) of both lyric and melody, used in the body of the motion picture or as the first music cue in the end credits.

C.Original Musical:
An original musical consists of not fewer than five original songs (as defined in Paragraph I.B above) by the same writer or team of writers either used as voiceovers or visually performed. Each of these songs must be substantively rendered, clearly audible, intelligible, and must further the storyline of the motion picture. An arbitrary group of songs unessential to the storyline will not be considered eligible<<<



So long as it is the first music cue in the end credits, if it is not in the body of the motion picture.

[henrikegerman]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:23pm

"And "Don Zhu-an" does grate to the ears, Grantaire! Es un nombre Espanol"

Si Senor Jo, pero no se pronunciaba asi en Paris en ese epoca. Era pronunciado "Zhou-an" alli, como "Don Zho-Se" en Carmen de Bizet. Era similar en Inglaterra en la epoca de Hugo, mas o menos, como "Don Jew-an" en el poema de Don Byron.

Este cuento no ocurre en Espana, ocurre en Francia.

Para razones similares, la opera de Mozart, cantado como si en Italiano, no se llama Don Juan. Se llama Don Giovanni!



Updated On: 2/4/12 at 06:23 PM

[jo]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:37pm

Bien sur!

En Francais, "Don Juan" est "Monsieur Jean" ( comme Jean Valjean).

It is still grating to the ears, to hear it said as Don ZHU-AN

[best12bars]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:40pm

"Original Musical"

When the hell did they add that category for an Oscar? It's not on this year's list, nor have I seen a Best Original Musical Score award in many, many years. (Like, the 1940s.)

They had the award for Best Comedy Or Musical Score when they also had the Best Dramatic Score award ... for a couple of years in the '90s, but that was it.

Maybe they need to have a quota of eligible movies to have this category activate. (A quota they never actually meet.)

[jo]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 6:47pm

Best Original Score is more colloquially known to movie fans as Best Film Score -- I think composers like Danny Elfman et al have won Oscars for this in more recent years. I am wondering if Schonberg will do the film scoring ( for dramatic emphasis) for this movie, as it is mostly sung-through. Maybe in quieter moments? Or highly-charged dramatic moments? Isn't this process part of post-production, as it is meant to highlight dramatically what is occuring in the film?

But Best Original Musical has also got me stumped :confused:



Updated On: 2/4/12 at 06:47 PM

[My Oh My]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:03pm

-Les Miserables London at the Barbican was nearly 4 hours long. It kept shrinking as they cut material during previews. There was a chase scene between Javert and Valjean that was cut early on.

-There was much tension between directors Trevor Nunn & John Caird and Mackintosh over the running time. Mackintosh kept demanding cuts in order to make it no more than two and a half hours. When the show reached a total running time of 3 hours, excluding intermission, Nunn refused to cut it back any more. He believed a lot of the material that Mackintosh wanted cut was essential for character development. For example, they had tried the inn scene without the intro and jumped right into "Master of the House." It was ultimately decided that the scene felt rushed and the characters random without the intro so they insisted on keeping it in.

Tensions grew and some shouting matches between producer and directors ensued. A cut Mackintosh proposed because he felt it was useless to the story was "Stars." Nunn reasoned that without "Stars" Javert is a one dimensional figure and that, in those 3 minutes, there is a substantial amount of essential information about the inspector that fleshes him out. Mackintosh later said he was unhappy with the placement of the song before "Look Down." Both actually had valid points and the song was moved to after "Look Down," which worked better. I still think it was foolish of Mackintosh to think the song should be trashed because it felt misplaced. Such drastic action was clearly not needed and I'm glad Trevor stood his ground or Javert would be a hollow character and literally a shadow of the one who "Swears by the stars!!!" :)

-"Ten Little Bullets," the original version of what we know as "Little People" on the London cast recording was cut very early on, much to John Caird's reluctance. He loved its biting lyrics and what it brought to Gavroche. Lyrics from the cut song were incorporated into his death scene sung to the same tune in the 2006 Broadway revival. I hardly get to say this because rants on the revivals horrible orchestration overshadow anything positive I have to say about that production, but the revival was remarkable in that it restored lots of little bits cut during the show's original run at the Imperial and the casts were among the strongest.

-The show's running time was officially 3 hours. Every production I've seen (I've seen all three original U.S. tours, the current anniversary tour, Broadway--both original and revival, and London) up until 2001 ran 3 hours with a 15 min. intermission. The first round of cuts were introduced into the Broadway production and later the U.S. 3rd national tour and London during that year. Something tells me the first round of cuts could have taken place earlier but there is more than one instance where cuts were introduced and I always get them mixed up. Please correct where necessary.

Updated On: 2/4/12 at 07:03 PM

[henrikegerman]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:06pm

"En Francais, "Don Juan" est "Monsieur Jean" ( comme Jean Valjean). "

Jo, I think you're missing my point. Not that the names have national variations, but that this particular famous character was pronounced by the French not as "monsieur Jean" but as "Don Zhou-an," exactly as it is stated in the show. Similarly Don Jose in Carmen is Don Zho-se in the opera.

I do get your point that you find it grating. I, on the other hand, think it's exactly how it would have been pronounced by this character.


Read more: https://forum.broadwayworld.com/readmessage.php?page=2&thread=1041677&boardname=&boardid=1#ixzz1lSeGIpFB

[My Oh My]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:14pm

Muchacho Henrick! Me tienes muuuuy confudido!!

"Don Zhou-uan" y "Don JEW-UAN" no son el mismo! Yo he escuchado "Zhou-uan" y se escucha natural.

Y en Londres a veces se decia "Don-Waun"!!!! Ahhhh. XD

[jo]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:17pm

I know what you're saying . Comprendo mucho.

What I was saying was that since the French pronunciation of "J" as in "Jean" is a hard J, then it follows that Juan will likely be pronounced in that way.

Btw, me llamo Josefina ( espanol) so hearing it pronounced as ZHO-sefina is understandably a little disconcerting. Of course when it is in French ( Josephine) from which my Jo is derived, it becomes a hard J. Tres confusing



Updated On: 2/4/12 at 07:17 PM

[jo]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:26pm

My-Oh-My

Another song which faced early cut was EMPTY CHAIRS AT EMPTY TABLES -- on hindsight, that song was the final lament for the idealism of Marius's comrades. Can't imagine that we almost missed another iconic song.

Tom Hooper has already said that he expects the running time to be around 2 1/2 hours ( maybe based on the screenplay?). It is going to be an amazing feat how he is going to accomplish infusing his own cinematic vision ( presumably, he wants to enhance the characters, making the movie more dramatically-charged) and finding the right songs and recitatives and still come out with a final product that will please LesMis fans and draw new audience interest to this movie musical.



Updated On: 2/4/12 at 07:26 PM

[My Oh My]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 7:30pm

But Don Juan is a Spanish name so it should be pronounced "Don H-uan," no? Not "Dawn Jew-waun," lol. I mean, now I'm confused. Ahh.

EDIT: I vaguely remember ECAET being considered for cutting. That would have been terrible! Probably Cammack's idea, lol.

Updated On: 2/4/12 at 07:30 PM

[chewy5000]

Posted: 2/4/12 at 9:18pm

What the show really needs is a dance remix of Do You Hear The People Sing

Or a contemporary version of Lovely Ladies featuring Lady GaGa.