Ethel Merman's voice ?- Page 2

[COOOOLkid]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 11:02pm

WOW!!! How can you be a member of this board & not know who is widely considered to be the QUEEN OF BROADWAY???

I don't think you've been a member of this board long enough to know that BrodyFosse was just joking.

[misschung]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 11:11pm

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 11:14pm

I like Merman in the Morning.

[allofmylife]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 11:15pm

And Martin in the afternoon.

[AKDPerformer]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 1:16am

Merm's voice is an either/or.

You either love it or hate it.

Personally, i'm on the former and I think the Merm's belting pipes are genius.

[tazber]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 1:55am

"To the first poster, you have no idea how insulting your comment is about throwing Annie Get Your Gun in the garbage."

Insulting? LOL. How overdramatic.

How in the world is this offensive? I have thrown albums I hate away too. Or is it just b/c it's Merman?
If that's the case you need to learn that everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

Updated On: 11/11/07 at 01:55 AM

[StageManager2]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 2:20am

Hear, hear, taz!

ETA: For the record, I don't care for Ethel Merman... or Chita Rivera... or Carol Channing... or Gwen Verdon. Their voices grate on my nerves! Got a problem with that?

Updated On: 11/11/07 at 02:20 AM

[buffyactsing]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 2:36am

I for one would personally love to hear these anecdotes!

"And many of the singers whom I never cared for on record, would often completely blow me away live. While the sounds they made weren't always pretty, their commitment to character and the text and to using their voice as an instrument to convey emotion and character and temperament was extraordinary (I could tell several anecdotes here, but this post has gone on too long as it is)."

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 2:44am

alxscrz2, it is unfair for people to say you have to wait till puberty to appreciate Merman's voice. That's nonsense. I grew up with cast albums of GYPSY, CALL ME MADAM and ANNIE GET YOUR GUN and appreciated her voice long before puberty.

Your question is valid (and there have been plenty of reasonable responses) but the way you phrased did make you seem more like 12 than 18.

No one is saying you have to like her, but understand how important she was to the development of the musical comedy. Not just her voice and phrasing. Her persona was too big to play the traditional heroine, so authors had to find new ways to work her into the action. At first she was the wisecracking best pal of the hero but later when she became a star it was necessary to create believable romantic parts for her. With ANNIE GET YOUR GUN, Irving Berlin balanced her comedy songs with sincere romantic numbers like "I Got Lost in His Arms" to help create a fully fleshed-out character.

With GYPSY she was perhaps typecast as the loud, pushy stage mother but the role as written but the role was way more than just that and she made the most of it. Listen again to the ferocious anger she brings to her dialogue in the middle of "Some People" or all of "Rose’s Turn." Other actresses brought more pathos to the final number but Merman plays up the anger and that is what the part requires.

Still modern listeners don't really get her. Oh they love those awful screeches Idina Menzel belts out in WICKED but a genuine singer like Merman they eschew.

[allofmylife]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 4:02am

right on frontrowcenter

[westcoast_wannabe]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 4:52am

As a kid I never cared for the voices of Merman or Martin, but as I got older I realized that neither of them had voices intended to be heard on CD. They were stars during an era before microphones, and as I’ve gotten older I’ve come to realize this and appreciate them for what they were. They don’t have voices that are particularly pleasing to the ear, but once you put their voices in context and listen to the way they could interpret a song you can understand what it was about them that made them so amazing. I’ll never have the privilege of hearing them the way they were meant to be heard but I now enjoy listening to their recordings and imagining what it must have been like to see them perform.

Not everyone has to like them just because they were huge stars, but I do think that it is important to understand what made them special and appreciate them for that.

[bschneid76]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 7:38am

And you can't even compare Merman's voice to Bernadette's voice. They are totally different styles of singing. Plus, to say what many say: voices today have to use the guidance of microphones to be heard to the back of the large theatres these days. Back in the days when voices were trained to be heard in the final row of the balcony you had to have a brassy voice as Merman's. She was and is in my humble opinion, one of the greatest Broadway actresses/singers ever. If you see her in many of the movie musicals she did, you will see that she was amazing to watch. See Alexander's Ragtime Band, she blows Alice Faye right off the screen, and in Call Me Madame she is superb. She may not have the "pop" voice of Idina Menzel, but I'd rather listen to Merman any day than the screeching music heard in Wicked or other pop music where it sounds as if a singer has to strain their voices to hit the crazy high notes.

It was always hard to try to get my students in American Musical Theatre to appreciate what Ethel Merman gave us in terms of the musical sense. I feel you have to appreciate the legacy she left otherwise there wouldn't have been many of the musicals in the golden age. And I am sure had you have been in the audience to see "Gypsy", "Annie Get Your Gun" and "Call Me Madame" you would have seen something truly special. Sadly, I was no able to see Ms. Merman perform, but thankfully seeing her perform on film got me to appreciate her even more. She was a gifted performer, and knew what she was doing. And if ANYONE can throw their voices without the aide of a microphone to the back of the Imperial, Majestic, or Hilton Theatres, I am sure the Merm would never had let us down.

She definitely had it. And I will continue to try to get more Musical Theatre "Lovers" to appreciate her more, as with many of the Musical Theatre stars and composers of the "Golden Age" that now many of my generation have deemed too horrid to listen to.

[Patti LuPone FANatic]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 7:58am

soulgrrl... from time to time, people will post "over the top" comments. It's called "verbal irony" and it's meant to be a joke. from RC in Austin, TeXaS P.S. Margo dearest.... you ought to be a professional writer. You sparkle!!

[Ed_Mottershead]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 8:02am

I had the good fortune to see Merman live on four occasions: the original Gypsy, the Lincoln Center revival of Annie Get Your Gun (twice) and her Carnegie Hall concert. No one ever touched her in Gypsy -- I've seen all the Broadway revivals (including the Encores! version with Patti LuPone) and there's just no comparison. One composer (I think it was Porter or Berlin) had said that if you were writing a lyric for Merman, it had better be good because everyone's going to hear it. Her diction was phenominal and her voice seemed to bounce off the wall of the second balcony. They don't make 'em like that anymore!

[westcoast_wannabe]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 8:07am

As a side note if you want to see what a comic genius she was watch It A Mad Mad Mad Mad World. That movie is filled with comedy LEGENDS and Merman still walks away with the picture.

[bschneid76]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 8:13am

Or even the 30 seconds she had on the film of Airplane. She is so funny singing "Everything's Coming Up Roses" And I thought she was the best thing in film "A Mad Mad...World."

[Gypsy9]

Posted: 11/11/07 at 10:36am

As a great, great fan of Ethel Merman, I truly appreciate the many glowing posts about her, particularly Margo's insightful one. As I have said in earlier posts, most people who have found her voice grating and unsatisfying have never seen her live, when she could truly astound the theatregoer. I was one who had the great privilege of seeing her live--first in HAPPY HUNTING, when I literally sat in the proverbial last row of the Majestic, and had no trouble hearing her clarion voice and impecable diction; second in her triumphant GYPSY, which I saw three times in NY and twice on tour; next in the Lincoln Center revival of ANNIE GET YOUR GUN; then in the last of the HELLO DOLLYs(which was actually written with her in mind); and lastly in her triumphant Carnegie Hall concert, which was her last big time public performance, and the audience went wild. So retrieve your CD recording of GYPSY from the waste basket and try it once more, with all of these positive posts in your mind as you hear a legend singing her heart out.

[PurpleMezzo]

Posted: 3/7/18 at 5:40pm

She is the best Mama Rose there has been. I enjoy characters in Broadway shows much more than just talented, perfectly trained singing. Do I want to listen to her sing the role of Anastasia? No way. Mama Rose? Definitely.

[Ludlow29]

Posted: 3/7/18 at 6:32pm

Though only 9 years old when I saw her in GYPSY, I will never forget how electrifying she was.  It was the kind of performance that sent chills down my spine and, 58 years later, I still don't believe I've ever seen a greater performance in musical theatre. - Michael Colby

Updated On: 3/8/18 at 06:32 PM

[Elfuhbuh]

Posted: 3/8/18 at 5:39pm

I'm sure she was a great live performer and a wonderful actress, but I simply just can't listen to her sing. She's too nasally for my ears. (And sure, make the argument that she could belt to the back of the house, but if I don't like a voice, then I don't really care how loud it is.) 

[Jarethan]

Posted: 3/8/18 at 6:39pm

I am probably in the minority, but: if the amplification is good, I don't care whether it is amplified.  The fact that she had the lungs was certainly more important in her heyday than it is today.  

I have seen her only twice on the stage (revival of AGYG and Dolly), countless times on TV, and have listened to several of her albums many times, specifically AGYG and Gypsy.  I liked the sheer commitment she gave to a song, but I found her actual voice borderline unpleasant and exaggerated; and her acting was almost primitive. sort of like the jokes about old time opera singers planting their feet and just singing. I much prefer listening to Angela Lansbury sing the Gypsy score...her voice, if not the trumpet that Merman is, is surprisingly powerful and much more pleasant.

I should mention that I saw Mary Martin in I Do! I Do! and in London, when I was on my first trip to Europe with my parents.  I was clearly young (15 or 16 for Dolly, 17 with I Do!), but i was not overwhelmed by her performances either (I had already seen Channing and (I think) Ginger Rogers.  Her strength seemed to be her confidence when on stage; her voice was pleasant, but not IMO as good as many of today's successful performers.

So, is it that styles have changed since their heydays on stage, and we expect more of our superstars?

 

[Cat Guy]

Posted: 3/8/18 at 8:24pm

That wonderful voice!