Teacher reprimanded after student sees nude art on museum field trip- Page 3

[jimnysf]

Posted: 9/28/06 at 6:08pm

I almost failed "Mechanical Drawing". I couldn't make a straight line, even with a "T Square". That held me back from being the greatest architect since Mike Brady.

[Jane2]

Posted: 9/28/06 at 6:13pm

Stage Manager, I see-we're talking about different situations. I taught elementary art, where the students do not have a choice-they must have art when their class was scheduled. So, in this way, it isn't fair to grade them. Only a portion of students excel in art. I was happy if a student merely tried the work!

In high school it's different-you elect to take art.

[StageManager2]

Posted: 9/28/06 at 6:38pm

So do you hate me now?

[Dollypop]

Posted: 9/28/06 at 6:54pm

Golly gee. Just today one of my male students took his pants off in class.

I hate my job.

[The Grovers Corners Yenta]

Posted: 9/28/06 at 7:54pm

If you had only given that student a pass to the restroom......................

[Jane2]

Posted: 9/28/06 at 8:47pm

"So do you hate me now"

Yes.

[Anakela]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:18pm

Just bumping this up because the NY Times article on this names the "OMG nekkid art!!!" pieces that the school group walked past-

Retracing her route this week through the museum’s European and contemporary galleries, Ms. McGee passed the marble torso of a Greek youth from a funerary relief, circa 330 B.C.; its label reads, “his nude body has the radiant purity of an athlete in his prime.” She passed sculptor Auguste Rodin’s tormented “Shade;” Aristide Maillol’s “Flora,” with her clingy sheer garment; and Jean Arp’s “Star in a Dream.”

None, Ms. McGee said, seemed offensive.

if anyone was interested in doing some Google image searches on them.

Also, the last quote was priceless:
Another parent, Maijken Kozcara, said Ms. McGee had taught her children effectively. “I thought she was the greatest,” Ms. Kozcara said. But “knowing Texas, the way things work here” she said of the teacher’s suspension, “I wasn’t really amazed. I was like, ‘Yeah, right.’ ”
NY Times link

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:27pm

There are simply no words. None. What is this country coming to? We're moving backwards instead of forwards.

I hope Ms. McGee gets work somewhere else, where she'd be appreciated.

[JohnBoy2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:27pm

I almost failed "Mechanical Drawing". I couldn't make a straight line, even with a "T Square". That held me back from being the greatest architect since Mike Brady.

As I understand it, Mike Brady had issues with that straight stuff, as well.

[jasonf]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:36pm

I can't imagine that THIS was the sole reason for the firing - there were clealy other issues here...

And as for classroom teachers not appreciating the work of math and art teachers I have two comments as a classroom teacher myself. First, I appreciate the work you do, but I also appreciate the time away from the kids to plan and meet with my team. Second, do the art/music (encore teachers as we call them in my school) EVER bother to find out about what the kids are doing in their academic classes either? In fact, the classroom teachers in my school somewhat resent the easier schedule that the encore teachers have -- yes, they may have more hours per day to work in terms of class time, but they have no homeroom/unit responisibilities and spend little to no time grading papers as we do (I teach seventh and eighth grade English, so I am often drowning in papers). While I value the arts very highly and am glad my students get the chance to learn from these other teachers, school responsibility and hours put in are VASTLY different, despite the same pay, which can cause resentment from classroom teachers. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't get rid of the encore programs at my school for anything, but the fact remains that the classroom teachers (at least in my school) shoulder far more responsibility in terms of caring for the kids, time spent grading, and with NCLB laws, the weight of test scores and keeping the school off governmental lists than our counterparts.

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:42pm

As specialists, we art and music teachers do not have a class to call our own. We see a different class each period of the day and week. My students numbered in the thousands per week. You, as a classroom teacher, have your own class. You are responsible for and I'm sure you care about their entire education. That is why you are expected to know something about what they are doing in art as well as in their other specialty subjects.

And to answer your question further-I often tied my art lessons to what the students were studying in social studies, math, geography and so on. SO-yes.

ETA-No one's saying you don't deserve a free period, Jason. What we're complaining about is that we are looked upon ONLY as a free period.

Updated On: 10/2/06 at 02:42 PM

[jasonf]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:58pm

Jane,
While I don't have thousands of kids per week, I do have 140 which is a pretty demanding schedule in and of itself. I have five differnet classes who are all at different points due to our crazy scheduling.

Maybe it's different in middle and elementary schools. The encore programs are well respected in my school, and rightfully so. I think our gripe is more with the uneven responsibilities given out amongst staff who SHOULD be at the same level.

I also know I have NEVER been asked by anyone in the encore department about what is happening in my classroom.

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 2:59pm

Jason, perhaps we're talking about two entirely different things. I'm talking about elementary school.

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:08pm

Arts teachers (I'm assuming this resentment falls to music and theatre teachers as well) have a nice little pit if they're actually reviled by you "normal" teachers.
My band teacher spent 2-3 hours at the end of every school day in the fall to conduct band practice. On Fridays, she had rehearsal followed by a football game. On away games that were close enough, she was required to organize the transportation to the away game so our band could be there.
In the Spring, she had practices for concert season as well as coordinating the winter guard classes which were 100% volunteer at my school (color guard only got to be in "band" during the fall; in the spring, they were defaulted into PE).
So my band teacher put in as much, if not more, hourse into her class than any of my regular teachers.

Shall I delve into what drama/theatre teachers do? Or choir? I can't speak to physical Art teachers since I didnt' take an art class in high school (or college) but I'm sure they do things extracurricularly that should earn more than your disdain at having to manage a homeroom.

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:12pm

Bway, here's a big huge cyber kiss for understanding!!!! xoxoxoxox

[StageManager2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:18pm

bway gets a smooch, but I get disdain?

[jasonf]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:19pm

Umm - In addition to being a regular classroom teacher (and managing a homeroom/unit is FAR more work than you think it is - it's enough that we've actually petitioned to have it as a stipended position as well because the imbalance IS so unfair) I also run a drama club in the fall, produce/direct a play for a local theater festival, and produce/direct two class plays written by my students and taken from gestation to full blown production in two months. Please don't tell me about "extra" work that other teachers do -- next time I'm at school every day for a three month period a good three hours past my contracted time and then go home and grade papers I'll remember how little I do.

[bwaysinger]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:34pm

No, no, calm down, Jason. You are the one who tossed out the "other teachers do too little." I mean, if you want a pissing contest, I'm sure you can find one of those teachers who do nothing to do it with.

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:46pm

oy, this wasn't intended to be a "who does more work" contest. Most teachers do their share of work.

This was all about the ignorance of many parents, teachers, and administrators in the area of the arts. And if you don't agree that this ignorance does exist, the subject of this thread should bring it forth for you.

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:48pm

Stage manager-you have my undying appreciation for a good sense of humor! I told you that way back when-remember?

[StageManager2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:54pm

Vaguely.

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:56pm

right. LOL!!!!

[singingwendy]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 3:57pm

Wow....I hadn't been reading this thread..and now come back to it..and wow!!!!


I am an elementary vocal music teacher. However, I am also the child of an elementary classroom teacher and a high school "specialist" teacher. My mother and I often have had this "who has the tougher job" discussion". I think it really comes down to the fact that the teaching is different.

As a classroom teacher, yes you have hands on activities but in a good arts classroom that IS the activity. An arts teacher....actually any "specialist" is ON all day. There is no desk work. There is not the opportunity to say "read pages 10-15 silently.". You are on from the minute the kids come into your room. You are also under pressure to get everything you want to teach them that day in 45 minutes or less. If you don't it will be an entire week until you see them again, and you know they will not remember everything they said the week before. And in 45 minutes there will be another class at your door.....and their teacher may not be supervising them, because this is her prep time.

Yes, we may not have papers to grade, but we tend to have more to prepare.....at least on the elementary level. We are teaching 6 different levels at once, and due to days off...like today...no one grade level is ever recieving the same lesson in a single week. There are many days around March and April that I look at my class and say "What did we do last week"?

Also it is expected that we put on art shows or concerts or presentations, which are not written into our contracts, nor are we given time to prepare for.

I'm just majorly bitter about prep time because in our last contract our union agreed to increase prep time for class times and not specialists. Why? Because they had to put information into each student "portfolio". Oh yes...the portfolio that only contains their math and english information. I have asked several times when I get to add to the portfolio....as I feel that those two things are not a full picture of an education. I was given a puzzled look by the administrators and a dirty look by the other arts teachers who didnt' want to have "more work". I don't begrudge anyone their prep time. Just dont' tell me I don't need or deserve as much as a classroom teacher.

This just feeds the fire of "well, they're not real teachers". My previous principal addressed her first letter to the staff as "Dear Teachers and Specialists". Hmmm...guess I don't teach them anything...what we do is just special.

And as far as knowing what's going on in my room and in their classrooms...yes I know what they're studying because I'm required to go to tons of inservices about things in the classroom that don't apply to me. However, I don't feel that I should HAVE to integrate my curriculum into the classroom teachers. I have my subject to teach...and a curriculum to cover. If they coincide..that's great, and if not....well, that's OK too.

Ok...time to get off the soapbox.....

[Jane2]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 4:01pm

Well done, Wendy-your experience is also mine.

[jasonf]

Posted: 10/2/06 at 4:15pm

Believe me, I don't begrudge anyone prep time - and Wendy, I definitely think it's unfair that "specialists" DON'T get the time they should.

I have to ask though, and maybe this is the way my school is set up, forget your classes and concerts etc. -- what other responsibilities do you have as a specialist? My gripe (and others I know) isn't with the amount of work you do or the importance of it, but with the fact that as classroom teachers we are PILED on with other stuff that the speciailists don't have to do and don't seem to CARE about as long as their classes aren't missed. I'm not going to go into the list of differences, but there is a HUGE difference in my school in terms of extra responsibilities (and I know at least in my school that the music department IS contracted for the morning and afternoon rehearsals). Yes, the arts are underappreciated, I am NOT arguing that, but the imbalance in work load works two ways and I don't think many specialists realize that fact.