Casting by Race- Page 3

[Flahooley]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:15pm

I felt I had to re-post my thoughts on the matter:

Colorblind casting is important in all situations, except when the central conflicts of the play are race related. Therefore a black Scarett O'Hara would be foolish, but a black Eliza Dolittle could work.

If you can't accept this, my guess is that you are one of the MANY overpriveleged European Americans who go the theatre, have little genuine imagination, and secretly believe that the white race is the "standard" race and everything else is "substandard"

[JemimaPearl]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:19pm

to an extent colorblind casting is fine. My issue is when a racially charged show uses colorblind casting. In a recent production of Seussical I saw, the boy who played Jojo, who was white by the way, somehow managed to play Seaweed in a legalized production of Hairspray. Call me crazy, but I really don't think it works to have a white person sing "Run and Tell That." It al;so wouldn't work to cast a black person as Tevye in "Fiddler on the Roof." It really depends on the show.

[Flahooley]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:24pm

You could have black Tevye, the central conflict is not about issues of race in FIDDLER...it is about the dying of tradition.

HAIRSPRAY is all about race. Therefore a European-American Tracey is necessary.

[Matthewjames]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:34pm

I have a good example that some people might now like. some people might not ever know who the hell i'm talking about but..

Saycon sengbloh as elphaba in wicked- it works

syacon senglboh as mimi in rent- it doesn't

while she was a great mimi i always chuckled alittle when she and other mimi's that were obviously not spanish would sing the line "Feels too damn much like home, when the spanish babies cry"

[JemimaPearl]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:36pm

Flahooley- Race does have to do with Fiddler. They even make that point in the movie, Camp. I do have to point out that there really was no one of Jewish African or Carribean descent and in Russia during the time Fiddler took place

Updated On: 8/2/06 at 09:36 PM

[gustof777]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:39pm

Saycon was a fine Mimi and that one line doesn't mean really anything. There are a lot of explanations that you could use for that line

[Flahooley]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:42pm

I stand by original post. I know that there were no Africans in Russia at the time, but they didn't speak english either. They didn't sing their thoughts.

One of the great gifts of theatre is to stretch the imagination. To see a "box" and it become a couch or a table or some object other than a "box."

The same goes with gifted actors who can touch the essence of the character and what the play is about. I would much rather see James Earl Jones attempt Teyve than say, Don Knotts.. and Don Knots was white.

I'd rather see Audra McDonald attemp Eliza rather than Britney Spears. And Britney is white.

Theatre is about Drama and drama is conflict. If casting an actor negates the conflict..then no theatre. But that is only if the conflict has to do with race.

You can argue that that is Jews vs. Russians, but if argue that, you'll never see a MY FAIR LADY unless it done my real cockeys and upper class brits.




Updated On: 8/2/06 at 09:42 PM

[Link Larkin Wanabe]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:42pm

Jemima...The enitre shtetl also never used to break into synchronised songs spreading rumors and singing about matchmakers.

Akiva

[JemimaPearl]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:48pm

Well, I really don't want to sound rude, but that's musical theater. Characters sing their thoughts. It's not just Fiddler. And as for the gossiping, if they were at all like my grandparents (and my family is Russian and Jewish, and left for the same reason and at the same time as the characters in Fiddler)then, yes. They did spend a lot of time gossiping. The writers of Fiddler were not coming up with the characterization from nowhere.

[NYC4Life]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:49pm

"while she was a great mimi i always chuckled alittle when she and other mimi's that were obviously not spanish would sing the line "Feels too damn much like home, when the spanish babies cry" "

are you mad?! puerto rican people can look any race. wow. you just dont think they are puerto rican.

[Flahooley]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:49pm

JemimaPearl.
That is theatre.. not just musical theatre: the suspension of disbelief (theatre 101) We try to get at the essense of things. That is what make theatre exciting and important.

I don't mean to sound rude either, but if you are serious about Fiddler only being cast with real Russians and real Jews you'll proably never see a production of the show again.
Updated On: 8/2/06 at 09:49 PM

[Flahooley]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:49pm

JemimaPearl.
That is theatre.. not just musical theatre: the suspension of disbelief (theatre 101) We try to get at the essense of things. That is what make theatre exciting and important.

I don't mean to sound rude either, but if you are serious about Fiddler only being cast with real Russians and real Jews you'll proably never see a production of the show again.
Updated On: 8/2/06 at 09:49 PM

[Jon]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:52pm

What the hell is "a legalized production of Hairspray"? Unless it was Broadway, Vegas, or the National Tour, it was an ILLEGAL production.

[JemimaPearl]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:58pm

It's not so much the country of oigin or the religeon that is necessary to the show, but the characters do have to be believeably Russian and Jewish (not actually Russian or Jewish). I was simply speaking about the characters, not the actors. if anyone sees the the movie Campthere is a scene that shows this as an example of how colorblind casting can only go so far (it gets worse in the movie too. A white girl in Dreamgirls) I'm sorry if this has offended anyone, but this thread makes it difficult not to offend anyone. I'm simply stating my opinion on Race casting, not race.

Posted: 8/2/06 at 9:59pm

Okay, NYC4Life, so the ON GOLDEN POND revival was a bad example? I guess it was poorly cast. I have mixed marriages in my family but I'm not so ignorant as to think that every family group is that way. In fact, the Thayers in On Golden Pond would not have been involved in a mixed marriage. Color blind casting is a limousine liberal way of making the world right as far as they are concerned. You don't really believe in it. When you praise a producer for casting Rebecca Luker in a leading role in St. Louis Woman or Cabin in the Sky, I'll believe you. On the other hand maybe I'm not understanding you. It's a little difficult to understand you given the poor English...or are they typos?

[Link Larkin Wanabe]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:04pm

"Well, I really don't want to sound rude, but that's musical theater."

Exactly. It's already not realisitic. So who gives a flying f*** how dark or light any actor's skin is? For me colourblind casting should be as part of this "musical theatre" world as much as breaking out into song is.

Akiva

[NYC4Life]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:07pm

I was saying it was a poor example because On Golden Pond has nothing to do with race. It has to do with relationships in a family. Ethel could be vietnamese, norman could be white and Chelsea could be their adopted black child and i would still feel the same way for the characters if it was acted well.

[Flahooley]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:08pm

JemimaPearl -

Think about what you are saying.

Why is the casting of a white girl in the DREAMGIRLS a mistake? Because the overiding conflict of DREAMGIRLS is about RACE realations. Therefore, it negates the conflict and drama is lost.

You can't have it both ways.

[gustof777]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:11pm

and in Camp they are playing it for the comedy. It's not supposed to be serious. I mean the man she's singing to is like five!

[Funny Face]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:15pm

Well, here's a thought:

Maybe colorblind casting is necessary because there is a discrepent number of good roles for minorites than for whites.

[Funny Face]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:30pm

OK, any intelligent resposnes to that, now?

[Link Larkin Wanabe]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 10:30pm

Hah, this RightAmerica is the new Stephen Colbert of this board. I'm loving it.

Akiva

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 11:24pm

RightAmerica--

Did you not see my previous response? I don't agree with you. Please don't look to me for support.

As I've said before, it depends on the show/role. If you'll pardon the phrase, it's not a black and white issue. Sometimes colorblind casting works, sometimes it doesn't.
Updated On: 8/2/06 at 11:24 PM

[Link Larkin Wanabe]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 11:29pm

RightAmerica is clearly a FAKE conservative, making extreme right wingers look ridiculous...aka...my Colbert analogy.

At least I hope this is the case....otherwise he is just freaky and a bit nazi-ish.

Akiva

[wonderfulwizard11]

Posted: 8/2/06 at 11:56pm

I think it just does depend on the role. For example, I can see a black Javert or a black Eliza, but some roles really are race-specific.

For me, if the role doesn't have any reference to the race of the characetr, then cast any race in the role. It really doesn't bother me, as long as the person is talented. However, if the role is race-specific (Seaweed in Hairspray, etc.) the cast the race the role calls for.