Diversity on Broadway- Page 11

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:27pm

:::
tmcgriff said: Racism against white people is not an actual thing.

 

Yeah, everyone in the world adores white people. We're universally beloved.

:::


Looks like you've confused sense and nonsense.

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:28pm

Showface said:

Anyway, hork, what "reverse racism" has taken place that you feel so oppressed and victimized from??

 

There's no such thing as reverse racism. There's just racism. And when did I say I've been a victim of it?

 

[Showface]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:30pm

"There's no such thing as reverse racism."

 

I'm shocked. For a moment, I thought that's what your posts about that little Tumblr post were implying.

Anyway, agreed with this specific statement you made.

 

 

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:31pm

FindingNamo said: ":::
tmcgriff said:

Yeah, everyone in the world adores white people. We're universally beloved.

 

:::


Looks like you've confused sense and nonsense.

 

Are you saying we are universally beloved? Or did you not understand my sarcasm?

 

Bigotry has never been exclusively white.

 

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:32pm

Bigotry is not racism.

 

This is a really exciting time.  You have so much to learn!!!!

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:41pm

Showface said:

 

I'm shocked. For a moment, I thought that's what your posts about that little Tumblr post were implying.

 

No no, I'm not trying to play the victim here or anything. Just saying, a girl taking a class should be allowed to sing whatever she wants.

 

When I was a kid, I was in a children/teen's theater group, and for one production, a revue culled from various popular shows, they had two white girls singing "America" from West Side Story. Nobody cared. In fact, the group was owned and run by a Latino family. They were kids and nobody was being victimized by exclusion or institutionalized racism and it was fine. Because they could separate right from wrong on a case-by-case basis in their minds. Strange concept, I know.

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:43pm

FindingNamo said: "Bigotry is not racism.

 

 

 

This is a really exciting time.  You have so much to learn!!!!

 

"

Just making an Avenue Q reference.  Calm down, there.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:46pm

 They were kids and nobody was being victimized by exclusion or institutionalized racism and it was fine.

 

Am I understanding the details correctly?  They were two white kids?  Of course they weren't victimized by institutionalized racism.  Do you feel your learning curve expanding?

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:52pm

FindingNamo said: " They were kids and nobody was being victimized by exclusion or institutionalized racism and it was fine.

 

 

 

Am I understanding the details correctly?  They were two white kids?  Of course they weren't victimized by institutionalized racism.  Do you feel your learning curve expanding?

 

"

Not them. Latinas. No Latina was victimized by these two white girls singing a song written for them. Do you feel your learning curve expanding?

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:55pm

Oh, so, you're using a children's recital as an example of what, exactly?  Proof of something?  

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 4:59pm

FindingNamo said: "Oh, so, you're using a children's recital as an example of what, exactly?  Proof of something?  

 

As an example of people having their head on straight.

 

[firebolts]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:11pm

I got to the 5th page of this thread and I couldn't take anymore of it. Just a snippet of the some of the gems I read:

 

"Then there should be a white Effie!!" You idiots writing this KNOW why there can't be a white Effie. Such a childish statement and it makes a joke of the entire argument presented in this thread. 

 

"Broadway is diverse enough!" "People should ONLY be cast for their talent." Nauseating statements. Broadway is not even close to being diverse enough. Look at (almost) entirely white musicals like Something Rotten and A Gentlemen's Guide to Love and Murder. Broadway might be more diverse than Hollywood, but please go back and read the posts by POC in this thread who are in the theatre and struggle to be cast in shows, or in roles that aren't stereotypical and/or offensive. 

 

"Disney is so diverse with their casting - look at their musicals and The Avengers!" There are only two black men in the entire cast in The Avengers. And a WOC in the film? Forget it. They can barely write a coherent storyline for the main white female in the cast. 

 

It's always amusing to see to what extent some people will go to excuse racism. 

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:20pm

On the other hand, based on two white girls singing America in a children's recital, there is no diversity problem in the children's recital industry.  So at least that's squared away.

 

Hork, have you ever done any critical thinking on the statistical significance of anecdotes?

Updated On: 10/17/15 at 05:20 PM

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:28pm

firebolts said:

"Broadway is diverse enough!" "People should ONLY be cast for their talent." Nauseating statements. Broadway is not even close to being diverse enough. Look at (almost) entirely white musicals like Something Rotten and A Gentlemen's Guide to Love and Murder.

 

Aaaand, we're back to this. Those shows are set in England. And not modern England, but old timey England. Where there were a lot of white people and not a lot of not-white people. So every show has to have a quota of non-white people? Are you freaking kidding me?

 

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:30pm

FindingNamo said: "On the other hand, based on two white girls singing America in a children's recital, there is no diversity problem in the children's recital industry.  So at least that's squared away.

 

 

 

Hork, have you ever done any critical thinking on the statistical significance of anecdotes?

 

"

Jesus Christ, that's the biggest straw man I've ever seen.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:33pm

Fortunately the time of audiences not even noticing nothing but a parade of white faces -- because that's just the way it's always been -- on professional stages is coming to a close.  It's great to see all different kinds of people on stage and this is something regional theaters around the country have really been investing in recent years.  It's paying off in younger, more diverse audiences finding enthusiasm for the arts and getting interested in telling their stories to the larger community as well.

 

Like all developments that start at the ground level, Broadway is finally recognizing this potential and learning to do something about it.  

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:34pm

Showface said: "This conversation took place a few months ago, but with Dave19

 

Holy crap, I think hork is Dave19.

 

 

 

Updated On: 10/17/15 at 05:34 PM

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 5:55pm

Oh god.  The deja effing vu makes sense now.

[firebolts]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 6:33pm

As for the statement "90% of the Broadway audience is white": You are right - it is! But it's because it was structured to be that way from the early beginnings of theatre history. But more accurately, theatre was designed to be the exclusive domain of white men; this was evident in Greek theatre, Renaissance theatre, and so on. American theatre was a white privilege in the 19th century and 20th century. It alienated an entire population of American minorities for decades - this greatly shaped the 90% white audience that we see today. That number does not exist because whites are genetically predisposed to enjoying theatre, but because it was molded through decades and decades of xenophobia and America's overall troubled history of race. Do some research and see how many POC were students at performing arts university programs in the 60, 70s, and 80s - that number would be quite small in comparison to the percentage of white students that were enrolled in them. 

 

It's now, in 2015, that Broadway theatre is now greatly diversifying. If shows such as Hamilton, In the Heights, and Allegiance continue to written and produced, I can almost guarantee that the number of white audience members will decrease and the audience will diversify, and that is such a great thing. 

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 6:34pm

FindingNamo said: "On the other hand, based on two white girls singing America in a children's recital, there is no diversity problem in the children's recital industry.  So at least that's squared away.

 

Incidentally, any kid could join this theater group. And every kid who joined was cast in this show. I think there was exactly one Latina girl. She sang "If They Could See Me Now." So no, there was no diversity problem, just a lack of interest among Latinos. And anyway, it was 30 years ago. Sorry to burst your "everything is racism" bubble.

 

"

 

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 6:36pm

It definitely illustrates and speaks powerfully to your point about racism TODAY in professional theater not being a problem.  At all.  

 

 

[Charley Kringas Inc]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 6:58pm

hork said: "Aaaand, we're back to this. Those shows are set in England. And not modern England, but old timey England. Where there were a lot of white people and not a lot of not-white people. So every show has to have a quota of non-white people? Are you freaking kidding me?"

Not only are both Something Rotten and Gentleman's Guide farcical and fantastical, thus hardly requiring strict adherence to historical racial population ratios, but there were plenty of not-white-people in Elizabethan England, so shut your piehole.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 7:02pm

But 30 years ago two white children sang America, ergo... something or other.

[hork]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 7:03pm

FindingNamo said: "It definitely illustrates and speaks powerfully to your point about racism TODAY in professional theater not being a problem.  At all.  

 

Oh ok, so you really do think I'm using it as an argument about racism today. Then I stand by my straw man comment.  

 

 

 

"

 

[firebolts]

Posted: 10/17/15 at 7:05pm

FindingNamo said: "But 30 years ago two white children sang America, ergo... something or other."

 

A+

Updated On: 10/17/15 at 07:05 PM