Lincoln Center wants a new theatre?
Posted: 3/27/23 at 6:55am
How do they use the space where the Big Apple Circus sets their tent up in the Winter during the rest of the year?
Posted: 3/27/23 at 8:56am
It’s mostly used as an open park. Fashion week used to set up their big tent shows there but moved back to Bryant park some time ago.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 8:59am
inception said: "How do they use the space where the Big Apple Circus sets their tent up in the Winter during the rest of the year?"
It’s Damrosch Park. There is a band-shell there, some grass, and a big cobblestoned place so they can set up chairs (or the big tent). They do music performances, film screenings, etc.
Updated On: 3/27/23 at 08:59 AM
Posted: 3/27/23 at 9:01am
Is the OP referring to Lincoln Center THEATER, or Lincoln Center the parent organization? Those are two very different things. I wouldn’t be surprised if Henry Timms (LC parent organization’s CEO) wanted a performance space that was not tied to any constituent organizations, since the parent org is trying to do more producing of its own. If LCT wants another Broadway (or Off-Bway) house in addition to the Beaumont, that would involve scaling up their operations quite a lot.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 10:24am
Broadway Flash said: "LCT wants another Broadway house."
I’m sure they’re envious of Roundabout’s rental income and flexibility, and the Public’s output with multiple off-B stages.
Remind me of the circumstances that went into the Beaumont being designated a Broadway house? That seems like something that was unique to the 1960s and the people involved at the time, and might be unlikely to happen again for another house in that neighborhood.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 10:46am
ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "Broadway Flash said: "LCT wants another Broadway house."
I’m sure they’re envious of Roundabout’s rental income and flexibility, and the Public’s output with multiple off-B stages.
Remind me of the circumstances that went into the Beaumont being designated a Broadway house? That seems like something that was unique to the 1960s and the people involved at the time, and might be unlikely to happen again for another house in that neighborhood."
It's more so any theater in New York can be theoretically deemed a Broadway theater by the American theater wing so long as is has a capacity of at least 500 seats and the space is predominantly used to house theatrical productions. This is why every so often there is a push for the Apollo to get designated a Broadway house, but that would mean they would have to forgo most of their concert, comedy, and legendary amateur nights that keep the lights on.
If I am being honest I would love for LCT to build a backbox space or a circular theater in the round with a 500 seat capacity to allow for more experimental shows. ( I know the CITS is in the round, but we can't deny the oval shape not the most ideal, along with its fly space and storage issues) Having that type of theater operated by a Non-profit would also allow for it to likely be more sustainable. Once again I know the Circle in the Square is currently operated by a non-profit, but they more so simply act as a landlord instead of theater company.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 11:39am
ATG just acquired/merged with Jujamcyn's theaters. Brick and mortar theaters that are purely rental properties with no air rights attached might be more affordable at this moment.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 12:04pm
I'd love another in-the-round or flexible space so much. My dream --- which will never happen --- would be to gut the Broadway. or at minimum reconfuigure it as a thrust with wraparound stadium seating.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 12:11pm
sinister teashop said: "ATG just acquired/merged with Jujamcyn's theaters. Brick and mortar theaters that are purely rental properties with no air rights attached might be more affordable at this moment."
I just don't see any Broadway landlords selling right now. They're all in stable financial condition (that we know of), and there's no shortage of product in the marketplace.
All the owners have probably made overtures to CITS. The Sondheim could certainly be in play when Roundabout's 20-year lease is up in 2028 (Shubert, Nederlander, and Jujamcyn all bid for it originally to be the operator), but Douglas Durst is on Roundabout's Board and may feel partial to the current tenant.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 12:36pm
Yeah, I feel like the Shuberts have some pretty undesirable theatres that they might want to off-load. But, the things that make them undesirable to the Shuberts make them even more undesirable to Lincoln Center. If Shubert never seems to be able to have big succeses in The Broadway (crossing my fingers for HLL), Lincoln Center is going to have ti eve n harder with the types of shows they tend to do.
I'd assume Lincoln Center would want something under 1500 seats, but those are so easy to fill that why would anyone sell one at the moment?
Posted: 3/27/23 at 12:48pm
I do not EVER see Shubert offloading houses, being that it's a nonprofit with a singular goal to break even and keep its foundation going; it's highly successful, and that would be a sign of failure the likes of which we haven't seen from the Organization since the Jacobs/Schoenfeld coup. They and their Board know these are incredibly valuable New York City assets –– true diamonds in the rough.
The Shubert Org regularly fills nearly every one of its houses, and producers are willing to take even a not-great house like the Lyceum. The Broadway can be a problem-house, but let's see how HLL does. They'll also have another musical house to work with now that Phantom is moving out.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 1:23pm
Are you sure that Shubert is non-profit? I've never heard that before.
I think the Majestic is likely to become the next Broadway. But, as you said, they still have no reason to off-load.
I do think there is an avenue to market a theatre sale or long-term lease as a partnership (maybe there is some sort of co-producing agreement) or as a show of support for non-profit professional theatre. But, this is probably all moot and they wont sell.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 1:46pm
jkcohen626 said: "Are you sure that Shubert is non-profit? I've never heard that before."
The nonprofit status is widely known, though a complex bit of accounting. Michael Riedel's book goes into great detail about it, as does this article.
Due to a 1979 IRS ruling, all income from the Shubert Organization flows into the nonprofit Shubert Foundation. There are no shareholders of the Shubert Org, just salaried employees. All income goes to salaries, operations, theatre upkeep & refurbishment, and millions and millions per year in grants via the Foundation.
I think you're allowing your brain to spin out with hypotheticals. Unless there was some legal ruling or an apocalyptic catastrophe, I see zero reason why Shubert would ever sell their valuable assets in my lifetime.
Updated On: 3/27/23 at 01:46 PM
Posted: 3/27/23 at 2:21pm
I wish someone would make use of Stage 42. I think it's such a great theater. Just big enough.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 2:30pm
Why not build a theater on top of an existing building or revert the Mark Helliger back into a legitimate theater?
Posted: 3/27/23 at 2:39pm
Dollypop said: "Why not build a theater on top of an existing building or revert the Mark Helliger back into a legitimate theater?"
It's been a while, but, as of 2006, they wouldn't sell.
TBH, they don't have incentive to sell, just like the theatre owners.
https://nypost.com/2010/03/28/the-broadway-gem-you-will-never-see-unless-you-pray/
Posted: 3/27/23 at 3:06pm
RippedMan said: "I wish someone would make use of Stage 42. I think it's such a great theater. Just big enough."
Shubert doesn't see a need for another theatre in their portfolio (they abandoned plans for that open space next to the Imperial). If Shubert wanted to make Stage 42 a Broadway house they could have added one seat and done that years ago. It's a lovely and comfortable space, but seemingly cursed until the right tenant comes along.
And before someone suggests it, the 42nd Street houses are not viable because of no loading docks + complexities of the neighborhood. It would have to be a new space all together.
I don't know how Nederlander feels about their portfolio –– it wouldn't hurt them to have another playhouse –– and ATG might be cooling off on acquisitions for the time being, now that they have Jujamcyn.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 4:17pm
I know it's the location - and i would have thought Kinky Boots would have ran - but I think if you put something in it like Six, it would be a great option. It's modern, good size.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 4:27pm
Instead of abandoning 42nd street, shouldn’t Broadway be trying to reclaim 42nd street?
Posted: 3/27/23 at 4:42pm
Broadway Flash said: "Instead of abandoning 42nd street, shouldn’t Broadway be trying to reclaim 42nd street?"
I think that ship has sailed. That would involve theatre owners buying up multiple major buildings at sky-high prices. 42 between 7 & 8 is probably irreparable at this point. There's a big new retail development going in, Dave & Busters and Toussauds are tourist-trap staples of the street, plus chain restaurants & low-price shopping. I bet Roundabout and New 42 and the New Victory wish they could change their entrances to 43rd, like the Lyric did (smartly).
Posted: 3/27/23 at 4:55pm
What big new retail going in? Are u talking about the Times Square theatre? They don’t have a tenant anymore.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 5:57pm
ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "I don't know how Nederlander feels about their portfolio –– it wouldn't hurt them to have another playhouse –– and ATG might be cooling off on acquisitions for the time being, now that they have Jujamcyn."
I've always found it interesting how different Nederlander's portfolio is than Shubert and Jujamcyn. The latter too have a very similar ratio of sub-1000-seat houses to 1000-1500-seat houses to greater than 1500-seat houses with Jujamcyn having 20% small, 60% medium, 20% large and Shubert having 17% small, 59% medium, and 24% large. Meanwhile, Nederlander has 0% small, 44% medium, and 66% large!
They definitely have settled into their niche of bigger more commercial musicals though. I'm not sure they feel any need to diversify because it's been working for them.
Posted: 3/27/23 at 7:49pm
Wow this thread manages to have a supersized order of refried beans. Suffice it to say these are not new topics and the same thing will happen now as happened in the past. Nothing. Suffice it also to say that some of the things being mentioned here happened on a different playing field.
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