Nine: The Musical. Just might be the finest ever written — Page 2

dramamama611 said: "Funny...I dont often think about this musical. But when prompted, am reminded how much I love it.
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I saw Nine and Dreamgirls the same weekend on Broadway back in

(not really a spoiler, just well, it was a while ago) At the time, I enjoyed thought more highly of Nine, but for some reason, over the years, I remembered the staging and impact of Dreamgirls more.

I actually enjoyed the movie version of Nine more than Sweeney Todd. I have seen it a few times. I sat through Sweeney Todd once all the way through. Tried to watch it again on DVD and turned it off. And Sweeney Todd is my favorite musical. JMO

Javi said: "Rosscoe, I just saw the Melbourne production on Thursday (I assume it's the same one you saw) and loved it. 'Nine' is one of my top 5 musicals and so we managed to plan a trip to Melbourne to see it...as well as 'School of Rock' and 'Gentleman's Guide To Love and Murder'. Everyone who came with me loved the show as well, so I'm glad we were able to fit it into our trip. I saw the Antonio Banderas Broadway revival and that's when I fell in love with the musical. That was just a beautiful production and made a big impact on me."





Sadly due due to coming back from LA , I missed seeing the final show on Saturday night . I could spend my the rest of my life seeing a production of Nine weekly.

I appreciate Rob Marshall's work on CHICAGO and his version of ANNIE (my favorite)...but NINE was all wrong, and the score bore the brunt of the bad decision-making. So many of the most atmospheric songs were jettisoned, BE ITALIAN was turned into a MEIN HERR ON MARS, songs were added purely to give star actresses a chance to be shot like objects of desire (CINEMA ITALIANO? can't remember the name of that Kate Hudson number)...

NINE's score is beautiful, haunting and mesmerizing when it's not competing with enormous sets, swirling cameras, fast cutting, relentless close-ups, etc etc. It's NOT Fosse's CABARET, nor should it try to be. It's an interior work, and it should be intense and personal. I have no issue with some of the cast-- I thought Daniel Day Lewis was an intriguing choice, though I was hoping for Banderas; and I think Dench, Kidman and Loren were intriguing decisions. But Cruz, Hudson, Fergie....all talented and gorgeous, but none of whom made me want to think more about Guido and his 'coming of age.' It became a variety show.

John Adams which is your favorite?

I love the Australian recording, but than again i must have seen that production at least thirty times

As flawed as the movie is, Be Italian is, in my opinion, one of the most showstopping numbers in any movie musical.

Do ya think that's do to him "being influenced" ( stealing) the staging of the Fosse "mein herr" number?

Not judging Fergie's performance- blame must go to the director.

HugoP said: "I appreciate Rob Marshall's work on CHICAGO and his version of ANNIE (my favorite)...but NINE was all wrong, and the score bore the brunt of the bad decision-making. So many of the most atmospheric songs were jettisoned, BE ITALIAN was turned into a MEIN HERR ON MARS, songs were added purely to give star actresses a chance to be shot like objects of desire (CINEMA ITALIANO? can't remember the name of that Kate Hudson number)...

NINE's score is beautiful, haunting and mesmerizing when it's not competing with enormous sets, swirling cameras, fast cutting, relentless close-ups, etc etc. It's NOT Fosse's CABARET, nor should it try to be. It's an interior work, and it should be intense and personal. I have no issue with some of the cast-- I thought Daniel Day Lewis was an intriguing choice, though I was hoping for Banderas; and I think Dench, Kidman and Loren were intriguing decisions. But Cruz, Hudson, Fergie....all talented and gorgeous, but none of whom made me want to think more about Guido and his 'coming of age.' It became a variety show."

Nine isn't a 'coming of age' story. IMO, it's the opposite. It's about a man having a mid-life crisis; a man who feels he's lost his mojo, trying to get 'his groove' back. He's (literally) orchestrated everything in his life, especially women, but is currently feeling lost and (for lack of a better word) impotent.

Ultimately, he needs his mama to provide the advice he needs to get back on track.

I thought the movie (and its cast) was very good, even though I was disappointed by the cuts to the score. I feel like Marshall didn't trust that audiences would appreciate the score in its entirety, and I'm not certain he was wrong about that. The addition of "Cinema Italiano" (which to my ears was very stereotypical of the flavor of 60's Italian movies), and the numbers that were retained from the original score make me think Marshall dumbed it down to accommodate a larger audience appeal. Although I was disappointed, I'm not so sure it wasn't a good choice.

I thought Daniel Day Lewis was amazing as Guido, and that it was a very good choice to remove all but the two songs that most exemplify his character's story arc (Lewis isn't a singer - but outside of the stage version, neither is Guido).

I don't feel like the movie was meant to emulate the stage version, and although I missed hearing the complete score (and honestly I missed A LOT!), I was very satisfied overall.

Updated On: 11/5/18 at 09:32 AM

John Adams: I referenced Guido's 'coming of age' as central to the show because I felt-- in the musical-- Guido does, indeed, 'come of age'-- finally, in middle age-- by reconciling with the little boy still inside him. This is one of the things the movie downplays-- when you lose GETTING TALL and songs that involve the boy, you lose the essence of the piece. For me, at least.

Agree with you on Lewis. Loved the performance though I know a lot of people do not.

John Adams said: "HugoP said: "I appreciate Rob Marshall's work on CHICAGO and his version of ANNIE (my favorite)...but NINE was all wrong, and the score bore the brunt of the bad decision-making. So many of the most atmospheric songs were jettisoned, BE ITALIAN was turned into a MEIN HERR ON MARS, songs were added purely to give star actresses a chance to be shot like objects of desire (CINEMA ITALIANO? can't remember the name of that Kate Hudson number)...

NINE's score is beautiful, haunting and mesmerizing when it's not competing with enormous sets, swirling cameras, fast cutting, relentless close-ups, etc etc. It's NOT Fosse's CABARET, nor should it try to be. It's an interior work, and it should be intense and personal. I have no issue with some of the cast-- I thought Daniel Day Lewis was an intriguing choice, though I was hoping for Banderas; and I think Dench, Kidman and Loren were intriguing decisions. But Cruz, Hudson, Fergie....all talented and gorgeous, but none of whom made me want to think more about Guido and his 'coming of age.' It became a variety show."

Nine isn't a 'coming of age' story. IMO, it's the opposite. It's about a man having a mid-life crisis; a man who feels he's lost his mojo,trying to get 'his groove' back.He's (literally) orchestrated everything in his life, especially women, but is currently feeling lost and (for lack of a better word) impotent.

Ultimately, he needs his mama to provide the advice he needs to get back on track.

I thought the movie (and its cast) was very good, even though I was disappointed by the cuts to the score. I feel like Marshall didn't trust that audiences would appreciate the score in its entirety, and I'm not certain he was wrong about that. The addition of "Cinema Italiano" (which to my ears was very stereotypical of the flavor of 60's Italian movies), and the numbers that were retained fromthe original score make me think Marshall dumbed it down to accommodate a larger audience appeal. Although I was disappointed, I'm not so sure it wasn't a good choice.

I thought Daniel Day Lewis was amazing as Guido, and that it was a very good choice to remove all but the two songs that most exemplify his character's story arc (Lewis isn't a singer - but outside of the stage version, neither is Guido).

I don't feel like the movie was meant to emulate the stage version, and although I missed hearing the complete score (and honestly I missed A LOT!), I was very satisfied overall."



I agree with your interpretation of the point of the story. I don't see how anyone could see it as a coming of age story. I also thought that Day Lewis was very good, but he could not compensate for the poor decisions made by Marshall. I disagree emphatically with you re Cinema Italiano maybe being a good choice.

There have been discussions on this board re what makes something dated. I think dated refers, AMONG OTHER THINGS, to something that is just not entertaining these days, because sensibilities / tastes have changed so significantly that it is almost cringeworthy to watch. If Rob Marshall wanted to pay homage to a certain entertainment style from the early 60s, he had to make it good for what it was. IMO he did not While Italiano was something that would have been popular on Hullapalloo (sic), anyone who would pay money to see a Broadway show would not have watched that show.

I don't want to watch a long homage to something that was not good in its original form, especially when the song chosen is probably the worst thing Yeston ever wrote.

I love both the original and revival cast albums. I don't think the movie works as a movie. I forget when it came out but I saw it in theaters around some holiday... terrible choice (not mine). But it's grown on me as a series of music videos. I'll sometimes watch a few songs in isolation and think "this is not that bad."

I still haven't brought myself to watch Sweeney Todd or Into the Woods. I don't want to hear those scores with "actors who sing."

darquegk said: "I think part of the strangeness of the film is that it tried to mash up too many styles, genres and settings. NINE is based on a Fellini film about Fellini, but is never implied to be set in Fellini's 1960s hipster Italy; every context clue hints instead at a 1930s-1940s setting, in the days of early Technicolor and epic film. Meanwhile, Marshall tries to mash it up with elements of Fellini's own 8 1/2, then shoots the whole thing in a non-Fellini style more akin to French New Wave "zou bisou bisou" hipness."

Great points. Marshall is a director without a real point-of-view.

Jarethan said: "If Rob Marshall wanted to pay homage to a certain entertainment style from the early 60s, he had to make it good for what it was. IMO he did not While Italiano was something that would have been popular on Hullapalloo (sic), anyone who would pay money to see a Broadway show would not have watched that show.

I don't want to watch a long homage to something that was not good in its original form, especially when the song chosen is probably the worst thing Yeston ever wrote."

I don't think Marshall wanted to pay homage to Italian movies of the 60s, so much as he wanted to emphasize Guido's character as being an Italian movie director by saturating the audience with visuals that evoke Italian cinema of the era.

I think the set-up dialogue to the song (about how Americans over-romanticize Italian cinema and Italian directors) is worth re-visiting:

I think that Kate Hudson's character really emphasizes how Americans fantasized about Italy based on the Italian movies we saw, in that era. ...Keeping in mind that at that time, air travel was reserved predominantly for the wealthy, and that middle and lower class Americans could only dream about visiting Italy. What we saw on screen was a romantic fantasy we could not afford to make reality...

Which is why I think "Cinema Italiano" works for me. First, it's jazz - like in the underscore of 60s Italian movies. Secondly, the lyrics mention many of the romanticized visuals that were seen in movies of that time - the cars, the fashion, etc. And (for my tastes) the brilliant casting of Kate Hudson, who looks SOOOOO much like the 60s version of her mother, Goldie Hawn.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I feel Marshall was not so much trying to create homage, as to include images that evoke the flavor of Italian cinema. The film version moves in a direction that the stage version cannot - it incorporates film techniques and imagery of the kinds of films Guido might have been making.

Also, in respect to the notion of inclusion of evocative images from Italian cinema of the era, another brilliant choice of casting (although musically, the movie suffered for it, yet again) - casting Sophia Loren as Guido's mother. Perfect choice (cinematically) - not so much in terms of respecting the score.

Again in terms of visuals, I think Fergie was not the best choice for Saragina, although in this instance, the music was victorious over the imagery. IMO, Saragina should ALWAYS look like a stereotypical Italian mama - with sufficient "meat on her bones" (in an attempt to be polite).

Saragina is Guido's introduction to sexuality. Although it's a stereotype that women marry their fathers and men marry their mothers, this is one instance where (for the sake of story), I think it's a much stronger visual to have Saragina look like a stereotypical version of what Guido's mother might have looked like (that is to say how an audience might stereotypically picture what Italian mothers should look like). Like Anthony's mother from the Prince spaghetti commercials: