Philosophical Question about Kiss of the Spider Woman (Possible spoilers!)- Page 4

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 4/18/08 at 2:28pm

Valentin doesn't identify as gay, but that doesn't mean he can't be attracted to Molina. As Weez mentioned (and Kinsey agrees), it's not an issue that can be discussed in absolutes. There's a lot of gray area between 100% straight and 100% gay, and yes, it is narrow-minded to continuing arguing as though those are the only two explanations for Valentin's character.

Updated On: 4/18/08 at 02:28 PM

[SporkGoddess]

Posted: 4/18/08 at 3:36pm

I agree; that explanation makes the most sense.

[morosco]

Posted: 4/18/08 at 3:55pm

Here's an interesting analysis I found online.
Inside Kiss of the Spider Woman

[morosco]

Posted: 4/18/08 at 4:03pm

A excerpt from the above mentioned analysis...

After their first night of sex, Valentin says, "No, I don’t have any regrets about anything. The more I think of it the more I’m convinced that sex is innocence itself." This is not the Valentin we met at the beginning of the story.

Valentin has sex with Molina because it’s the one way he knows to give Molina the greatest gift he has to give. After all Molina has done for him, the giving of this gift seems to be only a minor sacrifice. He knows Molina loves him, that all Molina wants is to be with him. But it’s not entirely altruistic. Valentin also knows that Molina will be so grateful he might be willing to pay Valentin back by delivering a message to the revolutionaries when he gets out. But if we allow that the novel is a legitimate source for the backstory and psychology of these characters, then we must conclude that the sex is not only a ploy to get Molina to help him, even though that may be part of it.

Valentin really does come to love Molina ultimately. We see this when Valentin himself is willing to reveal important information to the warden in order to save Molina. Though that love is not sexual for Valentin, it is still a very deep love, a love of respect and kindness and deep human connection. The sex is not primarily a manipulation; it is a loving gift. Valentin describes what it means to be a man:

Not taking any crap is one thing, but that’s not the most important. What really makes a man is a lot more, it has to do with not humiliating someone else with an order, or a tip. Even more, it’s not letting the person next to you feel degraded, feel bad.

Valentin would not have sex with Molina merely as a manipulation. That would not be manly. As Mike Deaver wrote, "In the end, the radical discovers there is grace in giving of yourself."

And it’s important to remember that Molina doesn’t see himself as a gay man; he sees himself as a woman, a classy woman "down on her luck." Molina says in the novel:

But as for my friends and myself, we’re a hundred percent female. We don’t go in for those little games – that’s strictly for homos. We’re normal women; we sleep with men.

And ultimately, Valentin begins to see Molina that way too. Valentin says to Molina, "I mean that if you enjoy being a woman, you shouldn’t feel any the less because of it." So, in a sense, in the mixed-up, upside-down world of prison life, Valentin isn’t really having gay sex; he’s having sex with a "hundred percent female."

[BkCollector]

Posted: 4/18/08 at 4:12pm

Thank you, finally some real scholarship on the this issue.

I hate dilettantes.