SUNSET BLVD. [?]

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 7/25/05 at 9:34pm

Has "Sunet" been done by regional companies or is it "too big" to be done? Just wondering. Also, was "Sunet" considered a flop? I read the article about Jackman (who i don't think is right for the role at all), and it said it had an advance ticket sale of 37.5 million, which seems like it would have made back its investment in the advance alone. Thanks.

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 7/25/05 at 9:46pm

Sunset often played to capacity houses when Glenn Close was playing Norma, but the cost of her salary and the cost of running the show kept it from making money. Business teetered off when Betty Buckley (and then Elaine Paige) took over for Close, but the show eventually closed after 2 1/2 years without making back the initial advance. So, yes, it is considered a flop.

[RentBoy86]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 12:16am

oh, but the advancemnt is 37.5 million, so how does that work? How much did the actual production cost?

[Michael Bennett]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 12:18am

I think it actually made money when Close was attached, but it was a mistake replacing her with Betty Buckley, who didn't sell tickets.

The show has been done regionally in Chicago at the Marriott, but thats the only regional production I've heard of. Maybe there have been others?

I'm waiting for the stock productions starring Bonnie Franklin and Linda Lavin.
Updated On: 7/26/05 at 12:18 AM

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 12:53am

I definitely remember reading a long article about the show (I believe in the Times around the time of its closing), that while it was initially doing very well at the box office with Close in the lead role, after several months it was barely breaking even because of the enormous weekly running costs. By the time Buckley and later Elaine Page took over the role it was simply hemorrhaging money week after week and when it finally was forced to close it had lost several million dollars (and Webber nearly had to close up the Really Useful group -- as it was he had to lay off half the staff and he's never been the sole producer for a show again).

It was simply a case of really BAD producing. Because of the enormous weekly costs (from the expensive stage design and the star salaries), the show apparently could not turn any profit unless it got very close to selling out weekly. Most shows are capitalized and set up in a way that as long as they pull in roughly 65% to 70% attendance every week, they'll break even. For Sunset, from what I've heard, that number was closer to 85%. After Buckley and Page came in for Close, the show never got close to that, and lost money week after week for over a year. Webber finally pulled the plug after he and Really Useful had lost (I've heard) over $3 million.

I say this all from long ago memory and from what friends who worked on the show told me at the time. If I'm wrong, feel free to post a rebuttal.

[Michael Bennett]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 12:58am

Margo, that's basically what I remember hearing. Which begs the question, who was doing the financial plans for the production and why didn't they try for a bigger star replacement for Glenn Close? I'm sure they saved money with Buckley, but surely nobody thought she'd be a draw anywhere near the level of Glenn Close.

I'm frankly surprised they didn't try for Liza, who probably would have been great in 1995.

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 1:20am

Gosh, I so agree. And I think Liza still had a voice in 1995 too. She'd certainly have sold tickets if she was available.

Diahann Carroll and Rita Moreno also did the role successfully on the road -- why not bring one of them in for a few months? They both were much bigger stars than Buckley or Page (at least in New York). Heck, I'd have PAID big money to see Faye Dunaway be a trainwreck in the role (she was working overtime at the time to get the producers to let her do it).

I'm not fan of the show, but even I found it surprising that it had been such a flop for so long once it was about to close. There was no excuse for that. Bottom line, the show was mismanaged and misproduced from the moment it opened if it couldn't run if the grosses dropped below "hit status."

Updated On: 7/26/05 at 01:20 AM

[Jimmcf]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 1:49am

I heard the same thing with weekly running costs. Some of you may or may not remember the hubub when Glenn Close went on vacation (and Karen Mason was Norma) and RUG bascially said there was no change in the box office. Close was understandably steamed...she felt her performance was part of what made it a successful production (The NY Times trashed Patti LuPone in London, which also did not help her chances in the Broadway production). She was also the highest paid Broadway star at the time, pulling in $50,000 a week. So even though it had a large advance sale, it had massive weekly running costs, which when Close was not in it, did not make. There was very little room for paying back that initial investment for the production (also the most expensive at the time, around $10 million I think).

Betty Buckley replaced Close on Broadway, after replacing Patti LuPone in London. She garnered very good notices in London (and I believe the majority of NY critics liked her better than Close), and I think at that point they felt the show was the star, more than their 'Norma' (this may also explain why they cast Linda Balgord in a touring production). Buckley did keep the box office alive for a bit, but to Joe Q. Public, she is no Glenn Close. They brought in John Barrowman for a two week stint (who played 'Joe Gillis' in London), who at that time was popular being on the show "Central Park West." Buckley may have been a bigger box office draw in London, but who knows, they do not post their figures like they do here, and the producers may have felt she could sell tickets like she did in the U.K.

After Buckley left, Elaine Paige repeated her 'Norma' which was first seen in London (Paige actually stepped in for 2 weeks with very little rehersal when Buckley was hospitalized, and formally replaced Buckley when she left for Broadway). Although my favorite performer (and the best 'Norma' in my book, having seen all the Broadway ladies and their understudies - Mason and Janet Metz); if Buckley is not known by Joe Q. Public, Paige is even less so (at least in America). Paige was billed as making her long awaited Broadway debut, but from what I saw, there was not much publicity in the mass media, as the show had been running for a while and may have been considered old news. So at that point, they still had these massive weekly running costs (though deserving, I doubt Paige could command Close's salary on Broadway, although she was the highest paid West End performer when she opened "The King and I" there), ran through the advance sale (which was pretty much just for Close) and posting big discounts. It's a shame really, for I thought the show was at it's best when Elaine was in it. The rest of the leads did not change throughout the run - Alan Campbell as Joe, Alice Ripley (pre-'Side Show" as Betty) and George Hearn as Max.

Petula Clark took over for Paige in London (with Rita Moreno filling in during her vacation). I did not see Clark, but have her cd sampler and she does not seem quite as bad as reported. Debra Byrne played 'Norma' in the Australian production (with Hugh Jackman as 'Joe'); she seems to sing the hell out of the songs on her cd "New Ways To Dream," but I believe that production was also somewhat troubled. Byrne was absent frequently, and reportedly unhappy with her singing of a cd sampler sent to people in advance of the production.

Updated On: 7/26/05 at 01:49 AM

[Flight0017]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 5:08am

Margo: I need to correct you. Rita Moreno did not do Sunset Boulevard on the road, she did it in London in the fall of 1996 for a few weeks when Petula Clark was on vacation.

It's interesting to note that Sunset Boulevard had a worldwide collapse at around 1996/1997 when all productions but one were closed. At the most, there were six productions running worldwide (Broadway, first US tour, London, Niedernhausen, Melbourne and Canada). All productions were closed except the one in Niedernhausen, Germany, as the rights to that particular production were sold. It managed to stay alive until May 1998, when it closed because of huge financial difficulties. (Luckily I got to see the penultimate performance of that production. Yay!)

A second US tour (starring Petula Clark) began in 1998, and toured for around 18 months. In 2001, a UK tour was launched, and it toured successfully for about a year.

Since then, there haven't been any big scale productions. 2004 saw two concert productions (one in Cork, Ireland and the other in Sydney, Australia) as well as the regional production in Lincolnshire, IL that MB mentioned.

In mid-August a semi-staged production will play five performances in Melbourne, Australia. I will be in the audience, and I will gladly post a report when I return from Oz

Updated On: 7/26/05 at 05:08 AM

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 8:23am

I saw Petula Clark while visiting my sister in Philadelphia. She was sooooooooooooo bad it was funny. I know several people who saw the 2001 UK tour (with Faith Brown and Earl Carpenter) and said it was great. I've heard the CD sampler and Brown sounded fabulous.

[Glebb]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 8:30am

I saw Petulia in London. Pitiful.

[melissa errico fan]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 8:35am

She made me want to rip my ears out and blind myself.

[Adam Chris]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 10:32am

Petula was bad. Really bad.

[Flight0017]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 11:13am

I thought Petula was great. Yes, her style of singing is very different, there's no denying that. But I still loved her as Norma.

[ChiChi]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 11:31am

I really liked Petula.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 12:07pm

SUNSET BLVD - the musical, is a piece of GARBAGE! It is not worthy of any awards; all the wrong people put it together for all the wrong reasons. Whatever power the show has is drawn from the far superior screenplay. Nothing that Andrew Lloyd Webber or any of his team of collaborators wrote for the show is worthy of the source.

Diahann Carroll was terrible in the Toronto production, which lost a lot of money for LIVENT and may have contributed to their abrupt decline. The day I saw the show was a Saturday matinee late in the run with a heavily papered house. (My seats were comps - I would NEVER pay to see that show!) To say she was phoning in the performance is overstatement. As if to compensate Rex Smith was overplaying everything.

There was a wonderful feature story published in SHOW MUSIC magazine that explained that the reason the show was created was to help save RUG. Unable, or unwilling to write a fresh score for the show, Lloyd Webber chose a handful of trunk songs and had the lyricists fit them with new words. (Ever wonder why the score for that show doesn't sound like a unified score? Now you know.) The show was rushed intro production and all the "creative" decisions were money driven. The choice to cast Glenn Close in the U.S. production was an attempt to guarantee a successful launch in New York. The producers hoped that by convincing everyone the show was the star they could keep it running long enough to turn a profit. It won the 1995 Tony award ONLY because the only other "new" musical that season was SMOKEY JOE'S CAFE - a "jukebox" show built around the Lieber/Stoller pop catalogue. They even gave the awards for Best Book and Best Score to SUNSET by acclamation. (In other years when there weren't enough nominees the categories were eliminated.) How can SUNSET be a Best Score? Best is of 3 or more. (Better of two, Best of Many.)

[itravel94]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 1:06pm

I saw the production at the Marriott Lincolnshire in Illinois and it was wonderful. The women who played the lead was outstanding (I believe she lived locally in the Chicago area). The production was amazing for that size theater and it was performed "in the round" so they had to play to all 4 sides of the audience. True, Sunset Boulevard is not a great musical, but I enjoyed it.

[Sant]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 1:37pm

"the reason the show was created was to help save RUG."

No, ALW wanted to do the show even before CATS but couldn't get the rights. SUNSET was on/off project for him for the next 10 years or so, until Paramount finally showed green light for the project.

Rumor has it that several other composers and directors were also thinking of turning this movie into a stage musical. Even Gloria Swanson, the original Norma Desmond, was working on the musical version of the film - working title was BOULEVARD! - and even performed a song from it (called "Those Wonderful People Out There In The Dark") in The Steve Allen Show.

[Jimmcf]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 3:46pm

Even Sondheim and Hal Prince had eyed it at one time as a possible musical, but I believe could not get the musical rights. Lloyd Webber was the first to get them.

And though in the minority in this thread, it is one of my favorite shows.

[ChiChi]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 4:06pm

I read that Sondheim thought it to be a good vehicle for Lansbury.

[pattifan2]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 4:09pm

I only saw two Normas in London - Patti, the best in my opinion, and Elaine. I thought Elaine really brought out the humour. She's also a very 'mannered' performer which suited the role down to the ground. I did hear a concert version on BBC Radio with Petula and Michael Ball. She was excruciating. I think I read somewhere that all the Normas after Patti had the score transposed slightly?? Does anyone know if this was the case?

[Michael Bennett]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 4:09pm

If I'm remembering correctly, however, Sondheim and Hal Prince's concept for the show was to update the material and to make Norma a faded actress once known for playing roles like Doris Day. I'm not sure how much of it was that they were denied rights (because that is a horrible concept) or that they just never really did anything with it.

This was about 1980, after Sweeney. And yes they thought it would be a good vehicle for Lansbury.
Updated On: 7/26/05 at 04:09 PM

[Jimmcf]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 4:15pm

I believe that the keys were changed to suit each actress - in Close's case they were lowered, and I think one of the problems Lloyd Webber had with Dunaway was that they were going to have to be lowered still.

In a documentary of Paige, Lloyd Webber is interviewed and said her version of "As If We Never Said Goodbye" was the best he had seen - that she truly had the mastery of the song. I am not sure if keys were changed for her.

[WOSQ]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 4:18pm

The overarching artistic problem with Sunset Blvd as a musical is that it was more material for an opera (character and death) than a musical play. This is one of those times when the fatal flaw was at the decision of what show to write.

It was a case of bad producing--real bad. The LA company closing after Glenn Close left it cost those investors money and left a bad taste in several theatrical biggie's mouths (the Shuberts).

No one, repeat no one, believed they couldn't find a star who could sing to take over in LA. Michelle Lee turned the LA production down.

Then the settlements that had to be paid to Faye Dunaway and Patti Lupone were not small change.

Betty Buckley may be a "big star" in her own mind and on these boards, but the general public doesn't know who she is. Elaine Paige is a delightful super-talented woman, but if Betty Buckley is comparatively unknown, Elaine Paige is completely unknown in the US. When you cast a replacement, find someone who is known to another segment of the audience that has not already seen the show with another star.

Glenn Close - stage, prestige TV and mostly classy movies;
Betty Buckley - stage and long ago TV;
Elaine Paige - London, making her American debut.

Se what I mean? It ought to have been the other way around: Elaine, Betty, Glenn.

By the way, Elaine Paige is considerably shorter than Glenn and Betty and they rebuilt the staircase for her! Do you have a clue what that cost? It is something you do not do when the show's box office is seriously winding down.

Bad choice of material;
Mediocre execution (Alice Ripley's role has to be one of the most thankless ever written);
Over designed;
Poor business decisions;
All make for a disasterous Broadway run.

And now there is a film version in the works? Say it ain't so.

[pattifan2]

Posted: 7/26/05 at 4:27pm

Jimmcf - I saw the interview with LW you refer to. He said it was the only time he has ever stood and applauded one of his own numbers.