Wildhorn's Wonderland is Coming to Bway!- Page 3

[GatorNY]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 4:25pm

I still want to know what it is about the book that characterizes it as "Fox News-watching and Teletubby-licking.

"I feel my work is a success in so far as I get to wake up every morning and do what I love to do more than anything in the world."

I can only speak for me, but I hope that I can say this about my career someday. Just sayin.

[newintown]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 5:18pm

Babe, I was just getting carried away with epithets, there's no logic there at that point. The utter awfulness of the book sent me on a bender.

[best12bars]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 6:06pm

I don't hate "everything Wildhorn."

My criticisms can't be written off as "oh, well, he just doesn't like Wildhorn." You'll have to do better than that.

I liked "Scarlet Pimpernel" quite a bit, including his contributions. I was thoroughly entertained. Not the BEST EVER, but a solid show, all around.

However, that is the first and last time I have ever felt that way about his work. My own comments here in this thread were solely based on the brief synopsis of the plot outline, which I think is a terrible approach. It has nothing to do with a note of his music, since I haven't heard it yet.

But the creative nod to the "Alice" material is dreadful. As I said before, it's a self-help children's book. Bleecchhh.

[GatorNY]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 6:21pm

Got it. I was worried that it had a right wing message.

[best12bars]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 6:37pm

LOL

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 9:15pm

The energizer bunny of Broadway is back.

His death was greatly exaggerated. The critics will kill it as always but will be hard pressed to rip him for writing power ballads. This is as far removed from anything he has ever done. If Bonnie & Clyde makes it we would be one away from a trifecta again. Imagine if he pulled the hat trick for a second time.

I am pulling for you frankie boy.

[James885]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 9:21pm

I'm going to put myself out on a limb here and confess that I do like his scores to Jekyll and Hyde and The Civil War, so I'm curious about his latest show.

[GatorNY]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 9:49pm

That was brave James885, and good on you for having the guts to say that you enjoy those scores.

[rmusic11322]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 10:00pm

I haven't been paying much attention to this thread, but does this mean when Janet Dacal leaves In The Heights, it will be definite?

[romgitsean]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 10:15pm

^^She'd be crazy to leave In the Heights for something like this.

But as for some of the replies on this thread:

ravenquest1: "lord, another half baked Wildhorn floating turd for broadway. Who keeps giving him money for these shows?"

mshetina: "@romgitsean: If Carroll's corpse didn't start spinning after Tim Burton's abortion of a movie, I doubt something as inconsequential as a Wildhorn musical will disturb it."

onedaymore: "Frank Wildhorn is crap. Everything he's ever done, with the exception of Jekyll, is a complete failure. All he writes is piss poor attempts at show-stopping ballads. As far as Wonderland goes: The music AND book are both awful. How cliche is it to give the Queen of Hearts her own musical theatre-big-band-jazz uptempo number titled "Off with their Heads"? I'm sorry, but for an Alice in Wonderland musical, I think this children's classic is truly put to shame."

I could not have said it better myself guys. Well done. Not to mention, it is a pet peeve of mine when people combine Alice Through the Looking Glass and Alice in Wonderland. They play on two completely different themes; and to boot, it's also a sequel. R

eally, it is just as bad if not WORSE than Tim Burton's. It might be worse, cuz it has a god-awful score to emphasis a non-existant point. I mean, at least in the atrocity of a film that he directed, when Alice grew up she was still in 18th Century England...in this version Alice is a grown up adult in Wonderland.

And to boot...if there is a "younger audience", is there a message attempting to be sent to said younger audience, or just in general? I think the whole point of Alice in Wonderland, and why it's such a literary classic is because it teaches us that things don't always have to be clear cut moral story that teaches kids this and that. We don't need to emphasize violence in order to teach kids morals (like in Schweppenweltzer, also written during that time, which in order to teach kids not to do bad things would cut off their fingers. Shockhanded Peter is the musical adaptation of said story. The Queen of Hearts is a clear satire on over emphasis on children's violence) or how to treat others (almost every character condesends Alice at some point, although what they say is complete nonsense, they believe it to be true), regardless of gender or age (a lot of these characters are older men, too).

And you know what, philly03? To quote you,

"To each his own PB Ent"

And same to you. It almost angers me that this show is in fact a literal waste of time and space. Its worth no ones time to see it, it takes the space some original musical could use to attempt to create something great, wonderful, and fresh AND it pisses on Lewis Caroll's work...all at the same time.

And hey, I love Lestat and Enron. Two shows that divided people love and hate, and it's hard to defend something that you genuinely really like, but everyone else thinks is pretentious/****ty. So, I feel for you. But as you're entitled to your opinions, we're entitled to ours.

[BroadwayBound115]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 10:36pm

Even though I am a HUGE fan of Frank Wildhorn's work, I am not a supporter of this coming to Broadway. The music isn't even that great. It doesn't sound like typical Frank Wildhorn. I love most of his other shows, but this one seems so out of whack and so off that I would hate for it to see Broadway. Janet Dacal is excellent in In The Heights, but her voice sounds so strained in Wonderland. Maybe a new leading lady will give this a glimmer of potential. I don't know. Godspeed his Bonnie & Clyde to the great white way!

[Kad]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 10:46pm

"And as PB Ent said, Frank's been great for the community. His shows brought new (& well, quite frankly dangerous and bizarre) crowds to the theatre, principles himself on bringing theatre back into the central light of America, and even when he fails (& it can be a huge failure) he doesn't stop writing."

....What. He's not a revolutionary. And what crowds has he brought that weren't already coming? And if he prides himself on bring theatre back to the central light of America, why's he got shows opening in Europe?

[PB ENT.]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:02pm

KAD~ check your facts when you quote someone. That quote was from philly03 NOT ME. You bashers are something else.

[philly03]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:15pm

"eally, it is just as bad if not WORSE than Tim Burton's. It might be worse, cuz it has a god-awful score to emphasis a non-existant point. I mean, at least in the atrocity of a film that he directed, when Alice grew up she was still in 18th Century England...in this version Alice is a grown up adult in Wonderland."

...you clearly have NOT seen the show.
*SPOILERS* Alice is at a "Lewis Carroll Award" Ceremony, for which she has won ("Ah, an Alice has won the Alice award!"). Her daughter overhears her father & Alice's phone conversation where he tells Alice he is divorcing, and Chloe (their daughter) runs away. Something happens to Alice as she's looking for her daughter and she finds herself in Wonderland. I believe in Houston it was one of those "all a dream" things. */end*

This has NEVER attempted to be a SEQUEL or an adaptation. Perhaps a bit of a spin-off, if you even want to call it that. It calls itself "Inspired by..."

The musical wishes to seek out the finding who you are/being who you are, and the balance needed in life. Work, responsibility, fun, family, love, etc. Deepest & most meaningful message ever? No, but this isn't a show that's trying to do that.


BroadwayBound115 - This score is incredibly Wildhorn! It's very pop-y, and filled with ballads. I for one am open to re-orchestrated it, although that won't really do anything for anyone on here. I agree though, Dacal isn't ready to be a leading lady, atleast in a Wildhorn show. They sing first then act. She seems opposite (say what you want, oh well)

onedaymore - Plenty of other versions of the tale have the Queen singing a song "Off With their heads." Considering it's one of the main things she says, I see no problem with it. Cliche? Hmm maybe, but if she didn't say it, you'd be complaining too.

Kad - Because he found legitimate success in Europe with respect for his work. If I was in his position, I'd also take my projects to Europe. People here give no respect and many write off his projects before they even reach Broadway. I didn't mean to make him sound revolutionary, but plenty of failed composers have given up and left to do film scores or other things. With his different shows he's attracted different types of audiences, although most stuck to his shows (& yes, those '80s rockers or D listers' fans).

I still will never ever understand the hate for Frank Wildhorn, seems like you all love to watch to see what he will do next anyway - whether it be to see him fail or whatever your reasons are.

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:18pm

Dacal isn't ready to be a leading lady, atleast in a Wildhorn show.

Well she is doing just great as the leading female in IN THE HEIGHTS. A show that is infinitely better and more successful than any Wildhorn show.

[philly03]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:21pm

Yupp, I'm aware of that, that's why I said she's not ready to be a Wildhorn leading lady. She couldn't by herself carry this show, and she's Alice in an Alice musical. I thought she was very good, but think they can do better. I'm more than open to having her open the musical on Broadway, and will hope that with the new In the Heights experience as well that she will be ready and able to carry the show.

That said, if I was Dacal I would absolutely take the opportunity to star and create an original role on Broadway as opposed to going back to the In the Heights chorus or whatever...

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:25pm

That said, if I was Dacal I would absolutely take the opportunity to star and create an original role on Broadway as opposed to going back to the In the Heights chorus or whatever...

I agree with that. But she created the featured role of Carla in Heights. She was never in the chorus.
Updated On: 8/3/10 at 11:25 PM

[TRiceFan]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:40pm

Philly03, i would have to disagree. "I for one am open to re-orchestrated it, although that won't really do anything for anyone on here." Orchestration, to me, is at least on third of the score, the other parts being the original score and lyrics. See, i believe this show could work if it had like, Jonathon Tunick or Micheal Starobin to orchestrate it. As far as the book goes, probably just borrowing Hugh Wheeler from Sondheim could help.
And, props to basically making this thread a conversation between everyone and you

[minicko88]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:41pm

Ok, I find it funny that some of you come on here trashing the work of Frank Wildhorn, and yet his work continues to return to Broadway. How many shows that you wrote been on broadway? I do not think Frank is the best, but I can't believe the disrespect you are showing to a man who spends his life trying to thrill theater goers. I saw this show at the Alley theater earlier this year, and even though it had many faults, I found the show to be quite enjoyable. I agree with philly... The show has faults (The book!), but it does have a great message, and with some serious work on the book, the show could be quite successful. The score isn't perfect, but I absolutely loved "Misunderstood" and the song in which the writer sings. However, some of the songs such as "Go with the Flow" and the caterpillar song needs some work. Give the show and Wildhorn a break... and wait and see what the critics think.

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:48pm

and wait and see what the critics think.

LOL.

[philly03]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:52pm

Thanks minicko88 & T RiceFan.... I'll stand up for something I like and defend the bad rep it doesn't deserve that it's getting. A shame...

They have no problem defending their favourite out of town shows that didn't get any where near raves (Catch Me If You Can, The Addams Family) either, will go as far as going on Spiderman threads saying you have to give that a chance, but come on Wildhorn's Wonderland thread and trash it like their's no tomorrow.

Luckily, he writes for the fans, and he has TONS of them, just most are in the closet on here, so he will continue to write. Wonderland is a project for his fans... it's all different styles of music with the ballads the fans have loved with comic and sweeping action.

Tricefan...I WANT them to re-orchestrate it. It sounds too clangy or something the way it is now. Like too much. I think simplier would be better for the majority of this score, especially Alice's songs.

[TRiceFan]

Posted: 8/3/10 at 11:59pm

See, Wildhorn is pretty decent at songwriting. But i feel he could do much better when he has more to work with. The way a show should work is Book, then lyrics based on that, then music set to the lyrics. But if the foundation, the book, is bad, what else do they have to work with? I'm not saying a book has to be good for a show to work, but it helps to have a good book.

[BosBroad]

Posted: 8/4/10 at 12:05am

Hmmmm. How can this get produced but something like The Visit not?

I just don't get it....


Updated On: 8/4/10 at 12:05 AM

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 8/4/10 at 12:51am

and wait and see what the critics think.

Unfortunately, because it's a Wildhorn show, the critics have probably already written their reviews. Just like most of you.

[Mildred Plotka]

Posted: 8/4/10 at 1:44am

That's totally it! We don't really hate Wildhorn, we're just sheep!

And when the critics hate the show you'll say they don't matter.

The investors for this show would be better off lighting their money on fire in Times Square.

More people would probably show up, too.

I've heard this donkey turd of a score. It's embarrassingly awful.