THE STAGE HANDS ARE BULLIES- Page 2

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:44pm

"If I don't like that, then I can go work somewhere else."

And the producers can opt to use non-union employees, produce their shows in non-union houses and pay those employees whatever they choose. However, the League has entered into agreements with these Unions, and by doing so they have agreed to collectively bargain the work rules. They obviously feel that there is some benefit in hiring Union workers or they wouldn't be bothered.

[FlyingMonkey1223]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:44pm

WHAT? I don't "hate" the union. I find them not needed. That's all. Most grocery stores have unions just like broadway shows. I find them silly too. I live in California and we have strict labor laws which protect workers. Everyone I've known who has worked for a union and had to pay union dues have found it to be more of a hassle then a help. Your states labor laws and other laws are what protect you as workers, thus, for the most part a union is just there to make money off of employees.

[Liverpool]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:50pm

and that proves your utter ignorance.


would you rather we just go back to the feudal system where us mere peasants completely support the kinga nd should he ever get upset with us he can just behead us?

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:51pm

"I live in California and we have strict labor laws which protect workers."

Do your strict labor laws, provide for Health Insurance Plans, Pension Funds, 40lK plans? A union provides more to it's members than just safety rules, salaries and hours one can legally work.

[FlyingMonkey1223]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:54pm

No, I work for a company that provides this for me. I decided to work for a company that does this, instead of one that doesnt. I made a choice. I'm not going to get a job with a company that doesn't provide for it's employees and then go on strike because I want something more.
Updated On: 11/10/07 at 04:54 PM

[Liverpool]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:56pm

ugh you are an arrogant, ignorant shut head. **** off you union hating prick.

[FlyingMonkey1223]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:57pm

And you fellow poster, are rude and need to learn respect for others.

[DownstageRight2]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 4:58pm

Amen justaguy! These people who are bashing unions have obviously never been a member of one. Back when i waited tables in a hotel in the city i was in local 6. we had 3 health centers one in brooklyn, one in midtown and one in harlem with their own dental offices and pharmacies. it was like having your own private hospital just for members. no hmos, no forms, no hassels, no co-pays, no fees, and all thanks to the power of the ny hotel workers union. does your non-union job provide that level of employee care?

[Liverpool]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:00pm

I don't care if I'm rude at least im not too stupid and wilfully ignorant to keep railing against unions.

your ignorance is showing, you might want to tuck it in.

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:08pm

"No, I work for a company that provides this for me. I decided to work for a company that does this, instead of one that doesnt."

And as I said before the producers have made a choice to work with the Unions. And part of working with the unions is knowing that every 3 or 4 years, the contracts are renegotiated. It's not some big surprise that the Union springs on them, it's there from the beginning, and has to be dealt with.

Updated On: 11/10/07 at 05:08 PM

[NJluvstheatre]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:08pm

Ok, so I’ve been involved in theatre for nearly 30 years. Lived in NYC in the early 80’s, did my thing, toured, regional theatre, summer stock, dinner theatre, blah, blah, blah… Retired from my theatre career in 1997 live in NJ and occasionally do a local theatre gig to get my fix… That’s me..

Now, my opinion on this strike. What other job/career does anyone know of that people can get paid not to work? Let’s see, a straight play requiring no flys needs to hire a flyman to stand around and do nothing, hhmmmmm. A “move-in” that really only requires 10 guys needs 15 so 5 can stand around doing nothing, Hhmmm. And so on, and so on… The Stage Hands Union is being completely ridiculous here with their demands. C’mon folks, admit it. I know, I know.. There’s a bunch of you out there who are Equity members (retired Equity member here), and other Union members who feel you HAVE to show support. But, let’s be honest here. The Stage Hands Union is being ridiculous with these absurd demands. We have all stood backstage and watch a lot of these guys sitting around reading the paper, etc and not even breaking a sweat, getting paid dammed good mind you…. But, now their shutting down Broadway because that flyman who sits and does nothing, but gets paid for it, is out of a job.. Or, that move-in that only needed the 10 guys, the 5 others need a job. So, let’s shut down Broadway, disappoint thousands of people (so we look even worse in the eye’s of the public), drag this out and kill the shows that were not doing well anyway (several shows may close due to this strike) and when all is said and done, we go back to work with fewer shows, less jobs, and more stage hands unemployed… Now that’s using the ole brain…

Lastly, why shouldn’t the producers profit from their shows? THEY are the ones taking the risks and putting up millions to mount these shows (and giving everyone work). 8 out of 10 shows don’t recoup. The unions have forced these high mounting costs.. Sooner or later it’s going to be hard to find anyone who will put money into a Broadway show. Years ago there was indeed a need for the Unions. However, the Unions in general have become over blown, over powered, demanding, and ridiculous. All of them! I for one hope to see a union free Broadway one day and ticket prices at a level that more people can enjoy a live show.

[teka21]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:19pm

"... I live in California and we have strict labor laws which protect workers. Everyone I've known who has worked for a union and had to pay union dues have found it to be more of a hassle then a help. Your states labor laws and other laws are what protect you as workers, thus, for the most part a union is just there to make money off of employees."

The reason why there ARE state and federal laws that protect workers is ONLY because unions have struggled, organized, and lobbied hard for such legislation. Without unions there would be no OSHA, no minimum wage, no consumer protective regulation, no workplace protections. Learn your history, people! As soon as you take these hard won rights for granted and trash our unions, you put all these accomplishments at risk.

[Tkt2Ride]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:19pm

I live in California too and this guy is just plain ignorant. Let him think whatever he likes. California is full of Union Workers and if you check his other posts, he is complaining about how much he gets paid and having no option. Must be lazy too. Even in my non-Union jobs I got raises and promotions.

It really depends on the type of work that you choose to do. Unions help non-Union jobs because employers are challenged to keep up their standards in fear that workers might organize and hire their own representation as in becoming unionized. So even those who aren't Union benefit from Unions because they organize and are responsible for passing many of the work rules this "monkey" loves so much, even though he doesn't benefit too much from them himself.

[BroadwayBound86]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:22pm

I believe people should be paid for their work! And they should have protections so they are not treated poorly BUT they should not be paid for time or jobs that are not required.

So then you also believe that standby and swing shouldn't get a weekly salary? Considering there could be a week or two period where they would not need to perform. Why should they get paid for sitting around the theater for nothing?! Because by your standards they don't deserve the pay they get either.
Updated On: 11/10/07 at 05:22 PM

[Bobby Maler]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:22pm

You guys, I am a member of a union. Actor's Equity, as a matter of fact, and I want to urge everyone who is in a union NOT to support the extreme selfishness of IATSE. They have ruined union's credibility by striking like this. Anyone who thinks this is about wages are the ones who are uneducated. IATSE members get paid upwards of $200,000 a year. I think that is more than adequate compensation for highly skilled labor. To force the producers to hire workers that are not needed is irresponsible. That's like Actor's Equity striking because they want producers to hire 20 actors even if it's a four character play.

I fully support the writer's strike (and in fact, will be marching with them next week). They are striking for a percentage of the DVD and internet royalties which they should rightly have a share in.

In this instance, Local One is making us all look bad and is hurting the industry, audiences, and the NY economy. Please don't stand with them.

[NJluvstheatre]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:24pm

Your wrong.. Stand-by's/understudies are rehearsing during the day, keeping up with their lines, blocking, choreography, etc. But, to pay a flyman to sit backstage of a show that has no flys is just WRONG!

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:28pm

"IATSE members get paid upwards of $200,000 a year."

Proof please.

[NuggetMonkeys]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:29pm

I love how people have just joined to share their impassioned opinions on this matter:
NJluvstheatre - 10/26
downstageright2-11/8
Noel&Cole - TODAY
I smell some socks.
I smell some puppets.
I smell some socky wocky crocky docky puppets.

Updated On: 11/10/07 at 05:29 PM

[bryan]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:29pm

i hope they get what they need and hope this will be over soon.

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:29pm

"Stand-by's/understudies are rehearsing during the day, keeping up with their lines, blocking, choreography, etc."

But, they don't rehearse everyday, they're only allowed 12 hours of rehearsal a week. So, if they don't go on, they should only be paid for those 12 hours, right?

[FlyingMonkey1223]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:31pm

I really don't appreciate the personal attacks on here, and can't believe BBW allows it on their board. Because I have a different opinion on things I'm stupid and lazy? Because I've stated I work for a large company and don't make much money in comparison to what they take in I'm stupid? I get promotions and raises too, and am not part of a union and my company competes with other companies and employee rages too, and we are non-union. That's just a part of life and how companies work. They want to make profit. I do not really believe unions are a good thing in 2007. In the past I'm sure they were needed, and may have brought many good things to the work force, but with so many state laws governing employment regulations it just appears to me to be a load of bull.

[NJluvstheatre]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:33pm

Their job is to be up on a role, stand in the wings and be ready to go on each day at a moments notice...

But, you believe that a flyman sitting backstage of a show that has no flys (thus he will NEVER do anything ever) should get paid to sit there and do nothing?? C'mon....

[BroadwayBound86]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:36pm

Their job is to be up on a role, stand in the wings and be ready to go on each day at a moments notice...

Yet depending on the show they aren't even required to be at the theater as long as they are within a few blocks and have a pager/cell phone on them.

[JustAGuy]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:43pm

"But, you believe that a flyman sitting backstage of a show that has no flys (thus he will NEVER do anything ever) should get paid to sit there and do nothing?? C'mon...."

If this were the only issue that the strike was about, I'd say yes, that it's stupid. But it's not. It's just one of the issues that the league is putting forth to make Local One look greedy and petty. There are a number of other issues that need to be negotiated, this one just happens to give the League some good PR.

[GladysBumps]

Posted: 11/10/07 at 5:59pm

As for the injustice of being paid for standing around with one's arms hanging, I'm not even going to go there, it's been a given for years, but what is plainly clear is the total disregard the stage hands union members have for the audience in general. There is no way in hell it would have been any less effective if they'd played out the week and began the strike Monday. Except they might have come across like menches and maybe even gotten a sympathy vote from the public, but as it stands . . . .