For the Cheno haters- Page 4

[Plum]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 8:20pm

I just have a hard time calling something with legal ramifications a "right" if it's not a constitutional right. The distinction is important. People are allowed to do all kinds of things, but we don't call them rights unless they're enummerated as such.

That said- progress is being made, legally, in getting homosexual rights. Lawrence v. Texas, anyone? The Court held the exact opposite position on anti-sodomy only 17 years before, and that's not a ton of time in its terms. Romer v. Evans isn't as promising in its logic, even if the results were positive. But the situation is light-years better than it was, and better than I thought it would get under this court.

The other end of things, of course, is a legislative fix. How simple would it be to just add "homosexuality, bisexuality, or transgender status" to the list of suspect classifications? It's not happening anytime soon, but in 15-20 years? Quite possible. Smaller steps can be taken in the meantime.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 8:23pm

actually--it should be "sexual orientation/gender identity" as that covers heterosexuals, too.

[Phantom05]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 8:24pm

I really didn't want to take the time to read most of this thread, judging by the title I already knew what I was in for. Everyone has the right to their own opinions, and definitely not everyone is going to agree with each other, but to a certain degree, that's what keeps life interesting. Kristin has a right to her beliefs, and from what I've read there hasn't been anything negative that she's said. And I really think that "jacobtsf" should be ashamed for the title of this thread. It seems to me as if some people who have a problem with Cheno as an actress, are just trying be picky and start a useless, and tiringly over-discussed topic. Let people have their own opinions and their own beliefs, you can complain all that you want about the way that they live their lives, but honestly, if you live in the south it's hard not to be sucked into a lot of crap. The term "Bible-Belt" really speaks loudly! Anyhoo, stop getting worked-up over the same old topics, it's like kicking a dead horse, and honestly the few mian people who keep this thread going, obviously love drama, lay-off......And once again, what a mean title for a thread!

See Ya!

Phantom05

[Plum]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 8:24pm

Correct. :)

<---brain is melting from writing Con Law paper

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 8:28pm

Your knowledge on the subject of law is indeed something I respect. :)

[Plum]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 8:32pm

I'm thinking about applying to law school just so I can entertain my friends and family with my subsequent mental breakdown.

[DBillyP]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 10:19pm

As a liberal Christian, I would like to offer that the term "conservative Christian" is actually the oxymoron. Jesus challenged the status quo of his day and sought to bring about change. He was far from conservative.

Chly, the Bible DOES NOT condemn homosexuality. People have INTERPRETED the Bible to support that idea, just as they have used the Bible to condemn interracial marriage and to support slavery.

jrb, while we are on opposite sides of the Kristin debate (but you know I still love you as the first BWW member that I met), WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS ABOUT HOMOSEXUALITY is an excellent book, but it might take some theological training or study for most people to get their head around completely. May I suggest an article called "Christianity and Homosexuality" written by Rev. Michael S. Piazza (yes, he is my boss). It can be found at the link below. It counters the "conservative" Christian thinking in much simpler terms.



Christianity and Homosexuality

Updated On: 4/11/05 at 10:19 PM

[cathyhyatt]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 10:29pm

lytemycandyl

"Perhaps the funniest part is that this summer she refused to sign an autograph for me because she was late when I had in fact seen her at the corner SMOKING for a good 5 minutes. Now it says she doesn't smoke! Hmm... "

she better not be ****in smoking if shes a SINGER and actress...that's makes me loose ALOT of respect for her. how could she damage her instrument like that? ughh..

[Aigoo]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 10:34pm

I don't think El Chenoweth smokes. It's just not like her, and it would ruin everything that she has.

[Chlydomnestra]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 10:57pm

I'm not saying that I agree or disagree with gay marriage, and the fact is, I think at some point it will be legal for two men or two women to marry and therefore take advantage of all the rights those couples who are strait are able to use (ie health insurance policies, adoptions without bias, tax breaks if any, etc). I will not be one of the Christians who marches on DC to oppose this, but that does not mean that I as a Christian think it is okay. As I've said before, I think it's a sexual sin, just as many other sexual acts, and I don't disaprove with one more than the other. JRB, I agree that the current translation of the Bible has flaws and misinterpretations in it, as things do become lost in translation, but it's the closest interpretation I and other Christians have. Nonetheless, I also somewhat agree that religion should not interfere with civil rights. On the lesser end of denying civil rights, there are a lot of laws, both local and federal, that have been put in place that deny my civil rights. It's against the law to not where my seat belt, it's my right to choose, and I should risk being fined. If it is every restaurant diners civil right to be free from smoking, then it is also every diners civil right to be free from the foul smell and loud voices that accompany alcohol, not to mention what happens when those people leave. And for those still school aged, it is an infringement on your civil rights to allow a potentially violent child (be they mentally retarded or severely and persistently mentally ill) simply because the IDEA (individuals with disabilities education act) requires students be instructed in the least restrictive environment. And last but not least, I am bothered by those who lobby for a gun ban. If that gets passed, at any point in the future, I find that a major infringement on civil rights. It is a persons right to have a gun, and it shouldn't be banned, because there is potential to hurt others. That would be like, justfying the continued ban on gay marriage, because there is potential to spread STD's. Both are ridiculous, generalizations that stereotype people, which is just not okay.
I guess the end story is that thank God our government is ever changing, and that some of these things can and will be changed over a course of years, decades, etc.
And, I think this is gonna be my last post on this thread, simply because I don't think anything will be solved from all of this. Everyone is free to believe politically and religiously as they choose, and hopefully everyone on this board is tolerant enough to respect those different opinions, instead of trying to change them. I know I haven't changed anyone's mind, and that wasn't my point, I simply wanted to give my point of view. And to wrap it back to the KC thing, some people are gonna dislike it and boycott, others are gonna accept and move on...but it's all on the individual to make that decision. Make no mistake, I really don't care who anybody wants to marry, in the sense that I would support a law banning it or not show up for one of my friends union ceremony, but I don't want anyone caring about what I think is right or wrong according to my religious beliefs. Plain and simple, a person can believe somebody is doing something wrong, and still remain friends with them. Good thing too, or I would have lost a lot of friends, and would have abandoned many friends as well, and life is a lot more fun and interesting with them.
I hope we can all just agree to disagree...and realize that disagreeing or thinking a persons opinion is wrong does not equal hating that person. I don't know of any person on this board, or in my life in general that I hate.'
JRB, excellent legal points and Plum, always the source of entertainment and humor. EVERYONE ON THIS BOARD ROCKS! YAY THEATRE!!!

[Chlydomnestra]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 11:02pm

Sorry, DBilly, I didn't see your post before I posted, but I did not say the Bible condemns homosexuality. It references homosexuality as a sin, but it references many other things as sins too, and I am aware that there are different interpretations, but I am not that Christian who uses those passages of the Bible as justification for condemnation. It's NOT okay to do that.
PS Thanks for the article link!

[DBillyP]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 11:05pm

Chly, I am sorry if I misinterpreted your post, but let me say this, the Bible DOES NOT reference homosexuality a sin. Again, it has been misinterpreted. I hope the article will help shed some light.

[Plum]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 11:06pm

Lots of singers smoke. They probably shouldn't, but really, no one smokes because they should. Look at the video of the making of the Company OBC sometime. Everybody is smoking like chimney.

[BroadwayBest]

Posted: 4/11/05 at 11:20pm

I've heard the songs and they are definitely different from what I was hoping for. Makes you think that "Big Broadway Diva" thing is all an act.

Of course this album could be an act too....
Would You Like To Find Out How I Almost Replaced My Fulltime Income Using Little Signature Files Like You're Reading Now?

[Jazzysuite82]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 2:30am

or it could just be one person expressing different parts of themselves. Ya know humans tend to be a little complicated. Their jobs don't always define who they are.


An Act?! ok.....
Updated On: 4/12/05 at 02:30 AM

[Chlydomnestra]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 6:51am

Two years smoke free, and I still crave a cigarrette now and then! LOL

[jacobtsf]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 7:33am

phantom05-I am not a "cheno-hater" but I find the people who use her Christianity as a reason not to like her to be rediculous. I highly doubt that the reason anyone dislikes Cheno is because of her religion.

Wow, this has turned into some discussion, when it was orriginally posted to END the discussion, oh well.

[cathyhyatt]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 11:29am

oimg if u sing and u smoke...you should die. omg seriously!!? how can you do that to yourself? its disgusting. ahhhh people that makes me angry...its like they don't respect their instrument! ah or themselves for that matter.

[robbiej]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 11:51am

I sing and I smoked for ten years. I quit August 22, 2004. MANY MANY MANY MANY of your favorite singers enjoy a smoke now and then...or more often. Trust me, I've smoked with them.

Onto what the Bible says about homosexuality. It says NOTHING about homosexuality. It may make reference to men laying with men blah blah blah. But that does not reference homosexuality. I know it's kind of a hard concept to wrap one's head around, but homosexuality didn't exist until the end of the 19th Century. Oh...sex between men did...and lots of it. But what we know of as homosexuality as an identifier, an orientation, wasn't in the public consciousness until the end of the 19th Century. So, no, the Bible says nothing about homosexuality. It doesn't take into account that men can be in loving relationships with other men and women w/ women. It says nothing about stable, functioning gay families that work in much the same way as heterosexual families (not that I think all gays and lesbians need to ape hetero relationship models in order to have a full and loving relationship...but that's a different topic). The Bible is, in fact, obsolete when it comes to viewing modern same-sex relationships. It just wasn't in the realm of possibility when the Bible was being written. And don't even get me started on the Greeks who were, in essence, pederasts who believed in a dominant/submissive, hierarchical relationship between men and boys and not in the equal partnerships we see now.

And Plum, I LOVE that COMPANY dvd with everyone puffing away whilst recording.

[keggss23]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 12:13pm

"oimg if u sing and u smoke...you should die. omg seriously!!? how can you do that to yourself? its disgusting. ahhhh people that makes me angry...its like they don't respect their instrument! ah or themselves for that matter."

Excuse me? You don't even know me! Who in the hell do you think you are? I understand that you think smoking is disgusting, but to actually say that we SHOULD die is by far the worst comment I have read on this board.

I am going to go have a cigarette now and then maybe I'll sing an aria.

Updated On: 4/12/05 at 12:13 PM

[LouW95]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 12:22pm

The main point has long been adbandoned-- Kristin used bad judgement in appearing on a show which raises millions of dollars to spread lies and hatred against gays. She should have known better- a bad career move as she lost many fans. There are many other places to plug a Christian based product but not through Robertson & his 700 Club. Her appearance on THAT program NOT her religion is why many are upset.
Updated On: 4/12/05 at 12:22 PM

[VIETgrlTerifa]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 1:28pm

I think along with Chenoweth, we should boycott:

Brad Pitt
P. Diddy
Penelope Cruz
Noah Wylie
Alfre Woodward

for appearing in One Campaign commercial with Pat Robertson:

http://www.one.org/

I also think we should add Jamie Foxx, Tom Hanks, Rita Wilson, Bono and Orlando Bloom to that list since I saw them do the same ad on tv with Robertson in it as well.

Updated On: 4/12/05 at 01:28 PM

[robbiej]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 1:33pm

Other than Alfre Woodard, I would have no problem boycotting any one of those people!

[Spooky]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 2:29pm

She's doing a conversation as part of the Broadway Divas as Gay Icons series.

Don't know if she's doing it to promote her CD or not.
Link

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 4/12/05 at 2:44pm

Maybe someone could get some answers from her; ask her a non-aggressive, thoughtful question about the 700 club, or more specifically, having a gay fan base but participating in programs that don't support such a fan base.