ABC Wash Post Poll: 64% of Dems Think Hillary Should Stay in Race- Page 7

[tazber]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 12:54pm

"We have the whole summer to get over our Clinton bitterness."

Oddly enough, the only ones bitter about Clinton are the Obamaniacs.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 12:56pm

I'm not sure how I feel about his 50 state strategy. It seems rather calculating and ambitious. He'll stop at nothing to be president.
Updated On: 5/14/08 at 12:56 PM

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 12:58pm

Huh? Looking at this thread alone I've said lots of nice things about her and that I think she'll be an invaluable ally for winning in November.

Whereas you have endless fearmongering about Democrats who will be voting for McCain if they can't vote for Clinton and such, and constantly employing useless and demeaning phrases such as "Obamaniacs".

If you care about a Democratic victory, you aint helping the cause much right now. Just saying.


***Edited to say I aim that last comment at Phyllis as well. A good campaign is a good campaign ;P

Updated On: 5/14/08 at 12:58 PM

[tazber]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 12:59pm

How dare you demonize him the way that Obama supporters demonize Hillary!

Where is your sense of double standards Phyllis?

[StageManager2]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 1:49pm

"Obama's 50 state strategy is building the party in meaningful ways."

Don't you mean 57?

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 1:54pm

Well I said he was building the party in meaningful ways. Didn't you hear about Kenya? They're all ready to lay down their arms and accept remote citizenship.

By 2011 we'll be building Jamba Juices in Iran.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 1:58pm

The popular vote question is moot

Why? Because Hillary just pulled ahead in the popular vote?

[StageManager2]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:04pm

"By 2011 we'll be building Jamba Juices in Iran."

Or Kool-Aid stands.

[javero]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:07pm

"His electoral map would look different from hers, so her 'swing' states are different from his."

That's an absolutely spot-on account of this year's Democratic race for the White House. I never once thought that the general election maps of 00 & 04 applied to Obama. He broke the mold which is what gave me a glint of hope for positive change this year despite an ongoing war on at least two acknowledged fronts.

I don't dislike Hillary but it was very important for all Dems to see that there was a huge segment of the base looking for an option other than the front-runner Hillary irrespective of motive. As the interloper, the minute Obama gained a toe-hold on his party nomination he took on crossfire from both the establishment candidate Hillary and McCain/right-wing media.

Obama has convinced me that he is a better politician and campaign organizer than many have given him credit for. If anything, he's been seriously underestimated.

This year each of the top three candidates for POTUS carries his/her share of negatives.

[madbrian]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:20pm

PJ - no one is buying the Clinton campaign's spin on the popular vote, just like no one is buying their contention that the delegate goal is 2209. It's all about the delegates, and he added two more superdelegates today. He also picked up the endorsement of former SEC and Fed Chairmen, which will only help with superdelegates. From MSNBC:

Also endorsing Obama were three former Securities and Exchange Commission chairmen — William Donaldson, David Ruder, and Arthur Levitt Jr., who was appointed by former President Clinton. The campaign released a joint statement by the former SEC chiefs, well as former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker, that praised Obama's "positive leadership and judgment" on economic issues.

"We are aware of the reasoned approach Mr. Obama has taken in analyzing the current financial crisis and the need for balanced regulatory reform," the statement said. "We believe that such a constructive approach can be extended broadly in the economic area as well as elsewhere."

Edit to clarify - one of Obama's superdelegate commitments is an international, so that person's vote only counts for half.

Updated On: 5/14/08 at 02:20 PM

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:41pm

Why? Because Hillary just pulled ahead in the popular vote?

Well... she didn't... but since you clearly stopped reading my post right there, I won't bother to explain again!

I don't buy the notion that Hillary will be stronger with white voters than McCain, which is her contention. According to Quinnipiac McCain beats both candidates with white voters, although both Democrats are leading McCain overall.

http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1295.xml?ReleaseID=1177

So I think Javero is totally right. Redrawing the electoral map might be a smarter game than banking on your ability to appeal to conservative moderates. The Obama name brand is already swinging tradtionally conservative districts.

[javero]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:44pm

"We are aware of the reasoned approach Mr. Obama has taken in analyzing the current financial crisis and the need for balanced regulatory reform," the statement said."

Thus, Obama ain't the Leaning Tower of Liberalism that he's been painted as. He only has to continue running right of Hillary and just left of the "closet liberal" McCain on fiscal matters to book passage to the White House. Though he'd never do it now, I really wish that Obama would join McCain this week in denouncing the latest version of the Farm Bill that's up for vote.
update on that awful Farm Bill

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:45pm

i heard hillary said that bammy was a bottom and that mishy had a collection of videos of her peggin' away.

i heard that bammy said that hillary's only staying in the race because she's pissed that mishy turned her down when she offered to polish her mahogany.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 2:55pm

Hey! I'm an Obama supporter--remember?

But actually, both Donna Brazile and Howard Dean have said that Michigan and Florida WILL be seated at the May 31 meeting of the Rules Committee.

That means that as of June 1, the necessary delegate count will be somewhere between the 2025 (minus MI and FL) and the 2209 (including them), depending on what percentage of MI and FL delegates the final formula uses.

So until then, why should Clinton withdraw? Each of these landslide victories reinforces her position in the party. And, far from hurting the party, the protracted campaign is solidifying enthusiasm on both sides.

It's also delaying the onset of the Republican 527s, which is a GOOD thing, since they are going to be phenomenally ugly.

After large wins in WV and Kentucky and another large win in Puerto Rico, Hillary will be the one bringing the needed Latinos and working-class whites into the party.

Then all Obama has to do is make a big show out of offering her VP or Senate Majority Leader--and all those voters come into the fold.

As long as Obama's ego doesn't F*CK it up--or his Hillary-hating wife and supporters!--we should be one big happy Democratic family by mid-June.

[madbrian]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:05pm

I don't think she should withdraw. Her victory in WV, and her expected win in Kentucky and probably PR, will look much better for Obama with her in the race than on the sidelines. The media seems to be forgetting that Huckabee won states after McCain had clinched the nom. In fact, Huckabee won states after he had suspended his campaign.

As for the 527s, I'd love to see Obama declare that any person or organization that is associated with a negative 527 ad will be 'persona non grata' in his administration. He should then call upon McCain to join him in that declaration.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:07pm

You misunderstand the nature of the 527s. By law, they can have nothing to do with either party or any campaign--they have to be groups of citizens unaffiliated with parties--so any disavowal from McCain will be moot.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:10pm

From yesterday's Washingon Post:

"We will attack Obama viciously on all fair issues, whether they are national security, whether they are taxes or the economy," promised Chris LaCivita, one of the Republican strategists behind the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, the group that attacked Democratic presidential candidate John F. Kerry in 2004. LaCivita added: "At the end of the day, every individual has a right to participate in the political process whether John McCain likes it or not. It's their constitutional right."
Obama, McCain Aim to Curb '527s'

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:16pm

mb, the last primary huck won was on feb. 9th. he dropped out on march 4th which was coincidentally the night that john mccain clinched the nomination.

any other lies you'd like to spread?

btw, as long as we're lying, bammy's a muslim, swore allegieance to louis farrakhan, told jimmy meeks that he'll sign a federal amendment banning gay marriage and privately refers to white people as devils who must be destroyed.

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:16pm

Hey! I'm an Obama supporter--remember?

With supporters like these... :P N e wayz, yes, they have said that the delegates will be seated, but they won't be seated as the numbers currently stand and the Obama campaign has to give the go ahead to their decision. I'm sure you realize how unlikely it is for them to agree to something that would give Hillary Clinton any real advantage.

She'll win Kentucky but I guarantee the PR is going to be close. It's not for a while and I expect Obama to campaign heavily there. Not to mention that Obama has a large win coming from OR. Again, the polls show that McCain trounces Hillary AND Obama with white voters. I don't know why you think they will make or break us when they aren't even a sure thing for Hillary.

Offering Hill the VP is a dangerous game, too dangerous. Better Jim Webb for those working class whiteys or Richardson for those latinos.

"As long as Obama's ego doesn't F*CK it up--or his Hillary-hating wife and supporters!--we should be one big happy Democratic family by mid-June. "

Considering the voting polls show more self righteous hate coming from the Hillary camp... but I agree, we'll be fine by the convention.

Updated On: 5/14/08 at 03:16 PM

[madbrian]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:18pm

I do understand 527s, and I know that neither candidate can directly control the actions of those organizations. I do believe, however, that the individuals and organizations behind the 527s have a vested interest in the outcome of the election, and may very well expect access to the administration if they are successful.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:21pm

in other words, you're looking for pretty words that really mean nothing?

i see why you're an obama fan.

[javero]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:22pm

"I do believe, however, that the individuals and organizations behind the 527s have a vested interest in the outcome of the election, and may very well expect access to the administration if they are successful."

Yep, it's mos def quid pro quo!

I also believe McCain's denouncement of them to be purely self-serving. There are skeletons in that closet and the DC press corps is trying to pry the door open right now as I type.

Updated On: 5/14/08 at 03:22 PM

[Namaste]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:26pm

Just dropping by this long-winded thread to give some kudos to my candidate for the WV win!

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:29pm

namaste, she didn't win. bammy just chose not to contest that state because he has an intense loathing of rednecks.

[papalovesmambo]

Posted: 5/14/08 at 3:30pm

namaste, she didn't win. bammy just chose not to contest that state because he has an intense loathing of rednecks.