Harry Potter and the order of the Phoenix Movie SPOILERS SPOILERS- Page 2

[broadway86]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 10:37am

Sacrifices character development and real underlying subtext of the scenes for action and CGI.

Odd, because I thought it had much more subtext and nuance than Phoenix, had a cleaner narrative, and was much more involving. It was one of the first times in this series of films that I was thinking "Wow, they're really not kids anymore." The acting from Watson's eyebrows distracted a little, but I felt the intentions were all there.

I have to say that I don't understand the complaints about Ron not being there in this film. IMO, this film was the first one since Sorcerer's Stone to get Ron's character right from the book.

But, that's the thing. I didn't get much of a character at all. He was practically a cipher.

[RobbO]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 10:41am

how many books are there? how many movies have there been so far?

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 10:44am

7/5

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 11:26am

Odd, because I thought it had much more subtext and nuance than Phoenix, had a cleaner narrative, and was much more involving. It was one of the first times in this series of films that I was thinking "Wow, they're really not kids anymore." The acting from Watson's eyebrows distracted a little, but I felt the intentions were all there.

I disagree. Goblet was way too fast-paced and much more jumpy than OotP, IMO. The only reason why Goblet seemed to have a clearer narrative was because the book of Goblet was all about Harry surviving the tasks then finally meeting Voldemort in the end and realizing that things will change here on out.

Order of the Phoenix was a transitional book with a lot less action, so it does seem to not have as clear of a plot than Goblet. However, I felt Order had much more little details and nuances than Goblet did, and I LOVED how they were able to slow down and let the characters breathe if you will. I know you couldn't really do that with Goblet since they had to condense into one film, but I still have to take it into consideration. I just felt that it was a great change of pace for the movie series and I am glad that we finally had a director/screenwriter who allowed us to just soak in the world rather than hammer us into it.

I have to say that I don't understand the complaints about Ron not being there in this film. IMO, this film was the first one since Sorcerer's Stone to get Ron's character right from the book.


Compared to the other films, Ron finally got real lines and was established as one of Harry's big support groups. Like in the Common room scene when he didn't hesitate to be on Harry's side, or when Harry woke up from a nightmare and Ron was already awake for Harry. Also, we got a lot of small hints of Ron's bravery and jealousy and love for Hermione (more than any other film thus far). Also the scene after Hermione and Harry come back from the Forbidden Forest after Umbridge is taken away and found out how Ron got the group away from Malfoy and co. This is the first film where I felt Ron and Hermione were on more equal footing rather than Hermione be the strongest of the trio, which she is NOT in the book.

[RobbO]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 11:27am

thanks skittles.

[ActualReality2]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 11:47am

"The special effects used for Sirius talking to Harry through the fire were completely different in this movie than the fourth one. I actually liked the newer effect better, but I still think it should have remained consistent."
"The Death Eaters costumes were also different in Goblet of Fire- I thought they were scarier in Goblet of Fire than they were in this one."

I completely agree with all of this!

The reason that I cannot enjoy these films is because they simply cannot live up to the books! I suppose if I had never read the books then I would enjoy this movie more than the others-- but so much was changed or left out.

I'm not even complaining about big things- like the complete absence of quidditch or firenze or all of the different rooms in the department of mysteries- but the little things that COULD be included but instead they decided to put in things compltely not in the book to make the film more "Hollywood".

For instance, why not include JK Rowlings detail of Grawp calling Hermione "Hermy" rather than making up some random part about him handing her a bicycle handle with a bell on it?

Things like that just really ruin it for me and I just cannot help comparing the movies to the books. I know that's the reason I'm always dissapointed- but I just can't stop doing it!

Overall, I was dissapointed - but I did love Luna and Umbridge! And was happy to see Umbridge's kitten plate collection!

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 11:57am

I think the bike scene was actually sort of precious and added more to Grawp's crush on Hermione.

You just have to see the films as fan fiction because they'll never be the perfect adaptation the way you want it be. Maybe in 20 years or so, the BBC will turn the books into a series where they will be faithful. Also, I understand some people not liking them taking time away from putting more from the books into the films to include non-book cinematic scenes, however, you have to understand that the films and books are different mediums, and just because it works on the page doesn't mean it'll have the same effect on film.

I rather have a more cinematic movie that got the spirit of the books with important aspects of the story explained with clear exposition than have one that was just a wooden staged version of the book on film.

[broadway86]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 11:58am

I disagree. Goblet was way too fast-paced and much more jumpy than OotP, IMO.

Really? For a large novel into a 157 minute adaptation, I thought the pacing was as good as it was going to be. More jumpy that Phoenix? Hell, nah!!! :)

The only reason why Goblet seemed to have a clearer narrative was because the book of Goblet was all about Harry surviving the tasks then finally meeting Voldemort in the end and realizing that things will change here on out.

Yes, and the movie featured all of that. It managed to entertain, and work as a thriller and coming-of-age story. Like I said before, in all fairness, this latest film had the most to condense in the least amount of time. But, I thought that it failed on a basic, storytelling level. And I think that's something that Goblet, cuts and all, didn't drop the ball on. Updated On: 7/11/07 at 11:58 AM

[orangeskittles]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 11:58am

The cat plates were hilarious. Everyone was laughing when Harry first walked into her office, because it was so absurd- and he looked absolutely horrified. I'd probably go mad too if I had to stay in an office that looked like that.

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 12:05pm

To be fair though, Order of the Phoenix (the book) didn't have a clear story either. It seemed like a very hellish year at school until the very end. The only thing the book has to keep all the episodic chapters together is the feeling that there is more than what people are telling Harry, which is the case for a lot of the books.

Updated On: 7/11/07 at 12:05 PM

[broadway86]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 12:13pm

To be fair though, Order of the Phoenix (the book) didn't have a clear story either.

That is very true. And, unless I'm mistaking, it is one of the only books in the series to not center around one major story point (i.e. the Tri-Wizard Tournament). It's more of a bridge between the adventures.

[Lavieboheme3090]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 12:31pm

Spoiler


When Serius was killed, I didn't think that she used the killing curse to to it, but he was pushed into the arch, and that is one of the mysteries still to be revealed with the voices and all.

[Cruel_Sandwich]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 12:32pm

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! EBERT IS OFFENDED THAT THE FILM IS TOO DARK!

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 12:34pm

Ebert needs to realize that the themes of the books were dark from the beginning. It wasn't that golden world that Chris Columbus made it out to be in the first film.

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 2:18pm

Ebert's review is so monumentally stupid, and kind of depressed me. He's such a smart guy. At least the majority of the other critics got it right. I think Ebert'll be even more disappointed in the next one!

Broadway86, you should see it again. The first time I saw Phoenix I walked out liking it a lot but thinking that, like all the Potter films, maybe it didn't completely work for me as a whole. But the second time you see it you know what NOT to expect, and you just watch the movie, and it comes together much better.

[broadway86]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 2:51pm

Oh, I'm all for giving movies a second shot, and I'll certainly see this again at some point. But, my problems with it weren't so much what was left out, but what was on the screen in front of me. Know what I mean?

[Sondheim Geek]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 3:03pm

I hate that the films are just "dark", though. The books are witty, fast paced, and extremely funny... the fact that they cut a ton, and it still sogged down just shows how awful the screenplay was. The scene with Petunia and Vernon was hilarious AND dark in the book... in the movie it was... boring.

I think that the fourth and third movies were strongest. I know that a lot of book fans can't stand the third movie, but I thought that Cuarón's direction worked so well with the way that book was structured. This time around... there was no vison, no nothing, just mess.

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 3:12pm

Ah well, too bad the two of you didn't enjoy it. I did!

[Mamie]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 3:21pm

I have absolutely nothing to add to this conversation. I'm only posting this in order to return the title to something a little less colorful than Papa's offering.

[caitiesus1522]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 3:26pm

First off, I really like the movie. So far it was my favorite (I hated POA and thought GOF was eh)

The good things- Acting. Radcliff was amazing, it really added a lot. Also Luna and Umbridge were exactly what I pictured when reading. ALl the other acting was much better.

Hermione, she seemed to be a little more like she was in the books, even though she still is too pretty and has some stupid lines that irk me.

Sets. After hearing about them on the LeakyMugs it was great to finally see them.

Effects. I wish I could watch the battle in 3D. Some things again were odd, but overall I like them.

Things that annoyed me

The big one. In the book Bellatrix hits Sirius with a green spell and he falls into the veil. In the movie, she said "Avada Kedavra." I think the JK Rowling did not say it was the killing curse for a reason so it bugged me a lot. And yeah, I know she has final approval over the movie, but I still think we will find out more about what happened with the veil in 10 days (Yay!) and that it was not the killing curse.

The reasoning for Harry going back to the Dursley's was not explained. I found this protection Harry had to be pretty important and Harry and Dumbledore's conversation at the end was already pretty short because the prophesy was not thoroughly explained, when we have been told that the wording is important.

The twins exit was not as good. I wanted to see the swamp

The lack of McGonagall, especially with Harry wanting to become an Auror. I thought that scene between the two of them would have been amazing.

And the last thing that really bugged me (and always will) is the students (and adults) wearing Muggle clothing.
Updated On: 7/11/07 at 03:26 PM

[broadway86]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 4:06pm

Ah well, too bad the two of you didn't enjoy it. I did!

Very happy you liked it. Wish I could say the same. Maybe next year...

[Lindsay Hameister]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 4:16pm

wow am I one of few who really liked it? i guess the 5th book is my least favorite so i don't remember details about it, it did seem a little choppy I saw it in 3D iMAX it was amazing! and i thought that dan, rupert, and emma really stepped it up a notch. Duddly how ever was a but awkward. I liked all the action, I liked the movie better than the book any way. *please please don't kill me for saying that.*

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 4:24pm

It's okay. The reviews are actually very, very good for the movie, a lot of people thought it was the best one yet. I guess only box office will tell!

Broadway86, I have pretty high hopes for Half-blood Prince. It's much more focused, much less dense, and I think they'll be able to be pretty faithful to the book. Plus I can't wait to see that ending sequence...

Anyway, who cares about the movie! Ten days until the book comes out!

[ActualReality2]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 4:28pm

I realize that many things have to be changed in order to turn such an intricate book into a 2 and a half or so hour movie, but I can't help being annoyed by it!

"It wasn't that golden world that Chris Columbus made it out to be in the first film."
I for one think that Chris Columbus was the only one who really understood Harry Potter and kept it as close to the book as possible!


"When Serius was killed, I didn't think that she used the killing curse to to it, but he was pushed into the arch, and that is one of the mysteries still to be revealed with the voices and all."
This part made me so upset, because we all know that Rowling gives the go ahead on these things-which most likely means that Sirius will NOT be coming back from the curtain - or else she would have told them to not have Bellatrix say the killing curse. I was still holding on to the hope that Sirius was "just behind the curtain" Bummer

"The lack of McGonagall, especially with Harry wanting to become an Auror. I thought that scene between the two of them would have been amazing."
In the book McGonagall had such a good part and she really became one of my favorite characters because of the way she stood up to Umbridge and defended Harry. She basically had none of this in the movie - except for the short scene on the stairs!

[Roninjoey]

Posted: 7/11/07 at 4:50pm

Come on... Rowling said he was dead three years ago when the book came out.

Besides... two of the publicized covers for the seventh book show Harry either behind the veil or getting sucked into it, so it's still going to play a part.

I forgot about the auror thing though. Wtf? That totally should have been in there. I want to hear McGonnigal declare that she will do everything in her power to ensure that Harry becomes an auror.