Diversity on Broadway- Page 16

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:01pm

"Christine Daae, daughther of the famous Swedish violinist...."

You can change 3 things:

1.Make Up

2. Actors

3. The script

1 and 2 are more common. Re-writing a show for an actor is less common. And why would we, when we have option 1?

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:01 PM

[Charley Kringas Inc]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:06pm

Not that the Swedes are entirely lacking in racism of various kinds, but in a musical about a haunted opera, the idea of a black Swedish violinist is the idea that really trips you up?

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:07pm

You don't have to rewrite the show! You put an actor in, regardless of race, and you DO NOT use MAKE UP to change race!

It's that simple.

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:14pm

And why would that be a problem? White actors playing Piangi have been doing it for 30 years to look Italian (Meditteranean race). To give you 1 of 1000 examples.

 

 

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:14 PM

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:17pm

Dave19 said: "And why would that be a problem? White actors playing Piangi have been doing it for 30 years to look Italian. To give you 1 of 1000 examples.

 

 

 

 

 

"

Italian is not a race, Dave...

What are the other 999 examples?

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:17 PM

[Jay Lerner-Z]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:21pm

Hey, I just remembered tomorrow is "Back To The Future" day - maybe Dave is from 1973 or something?

Go home!

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:25pm

White, black and arabian girls in Miss Saigon have been doing it for over 25 years to play Asian bar girls in Miss Saigon. Works perfectly. 

Why wouldn't they?

Of course it would be very nice to have a Vietnam bar full of white, black and arabian girls, but why put unnecessary questions in the audiences mind? The actors clearly don't mind putting on make up.

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:25 PM

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:29pm

Dave19 said: "White, black and arabian girls in Miss Saigon have been doing it for over 25 years to play Asian bar girls in Miss Saigon. Works perfectly. 

 

Why wouldn't they?

 

"

Non-Asian women playing Asian characters in Miss Saigon does not work, and it is wrong. What you have just described is "yellow face".

[Jay Lerner-Z]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:32pm

Dave 19 is a) A moron

 

               b) A racist

 

               c) A troll

 

ANSWER 

 

Click Here To Toggle Spoiler Content

d) All of the above

 

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:32pm

And there is nothing wrong with yellow face!

The cover Ellen needs to be in the bar scenes as an Asian girl.

That's casting. You can complain about it all you want, but don't search for problems that aren't there ok.

The actress is fine with it and so is the audience.

YOU are the racist in this case.

Edit: White actors playing Meditteranean race (Piangi) is also wrong? Get over yourself. 

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:32 PM

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:34pm

Dave19 said: "And there is nothing wrong with yellow face!

 

The cover Ellen needs to be in the bar scenes as an Asian girl.

 

That's casting. You can complain about it all you want, but don't search for problem that arent's there ok.

 

"

...

I just needed to quote this so everybody can see the racism and ignorance displayed in this post.

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:34 PM

[Charley Kringas Inc]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:35pm

Dave19 said: "And there is nothing wrong with yellow face!"

 

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:37pm

Charley Kringas Inc said: "Dave19 said: "And there is nothing wrong with yellow face!"

 

 

 

 

"

This photo is the best thing to happen to this thread omg.

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:41pm

 "I just needed to quote this so everybody can see the racism and ignorance displayed in this post."

So a girl that is trying to look a bit more Asian for a role is racism? I think she is only making the differences disappear, while people like you shouting "Yellow face!!" all day only make it worse and are the true racist.

 

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:47pm

Dave19 said: " "I just needed to quote this so everybody can see the racism and ignorance displayed in this post."

 

So a girl that is trying to look a bit more Asian for a role is racism? I think she is only making the differences disappear, while people like you shouting "Yellow face!!" all day only make it worse and are the true racist.

 

 

 

"

 

"A girl trying to look a bit more Asian for the role"

 

"Only making the differences disappear"

 

 

Dave19, everybody: The BWW Race Troll 

 

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:47 PM

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:51pm

I see, avoiding the question.

Well, good luck with sending angry letters to the producers of Phantom and Miss Saigon, insisting they keep the race separation in tact and how disgusting it is for the actors playing Piangi to give themselves a Meditteranean touch with make up. Because Meditteranean people are clearly not the same people as other people! Keep up the great work showface. You make the world a better place.

 

Ps, Isn't it tiresome to shout Blackface and Yellowface all day to other people?

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:51 PM

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:55pm

"Keep up the great work showface, You make the world a better place."

 

Why thank you, Dave19! I'm so flattered! 

 

 

"Because Meditteranean people are clearly not the same people as other people!"

 

Do you even read? Who even said that?  Oh that's right, no one!

 

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:55 PM

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:56pm

reprise

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:56pm

Well, how dare someone use make up to look Meditteranean, is your opinion, right?

 

Tip: Let it go

 

Only racists are offended by it.

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 08:56 PM

[AHLiebross]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:57pm

At the risk of being shouted down (figuratively, of course), I think maybe Dave and I are saying the same thing about ethnically diverse casting: The race of the actor does not matter. Sometimes the race of the CHARACTER matters, and sometimes, it does not. I still think that Christine, Raoul, and the Phantom should be white CHARACTERS, regardless of the race of the actors playing them. I also think that Eliza, Higgins, Mrs. Higgins, Freddy Eynsford-Hill, Alfred Doolittle, and some of the others in MFL should be white CHARACTERS. Pickering can be anything as a character. In fact, if Pickering were a nonwhite character, that would show Higgins' general lack of bigotry.

A recent movie starring Meryl Streep, Kevin Kline, and Audra McDonald showed how race-neutral casting for a major character should work in realistic movies, but I don't think plays and musicals have to be as rigid in keeping casting consistent. Audra McDonald played Kevin Kline's second wife, who raised the kids he had with the Meryl Streep character. By casting an actor of color, the producer and director opened the movie to a great many black background actors, because the stepmom's black extended family attended the son's wedding, which was shown in the film. The reason that consistency is important in realistic movies but not in the theater is that we all expect to have to suspend disbelief to a greater extent in the theater than in film.

Back to Dave: Where Dave and I part company is when make-up is permissible and when it is not. I don't think anyone would care about dark make-up if it were not for the history of disrespect shown by the white theater, film, and TV establishment through the use of "blackface," "yellowface," and "redface." However, because of that shameful history, changing a white actor's race through make-up rightfully makes people squirm. On the other hand, using whiteface on a person of color to play a white character does not bother me in the least because it can help avoid confusion when an actor of color plays a white character.

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 8:59pm

Dave19 said: "Well, how dare someone use make up to look Meditteranean, is your opinion, right?

 

"

Yes

I am against using makeup to change races. 

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 9:00pm

Showface said: "Dave19 said: "Well, how dare someone use make up to look Meditteranean, is your opinion, right?

 

 

 

"

 

Yes

 

I am against using makeup to change races. 

 

"

Tip: Let it go

 

Only racists are offended by it.

[Dave19]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 9:07pm

"On the other hand, using whiteface on a person of color to play a white character does not bother me in the least because it can help avoid confusion when an actor of color plays a white character."

 

That doesn't bother me either.

Because I see the actor as a person. Not as a color. The written character can have a color though (storyline etc). But any actor can play it.

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 09:07 PM

[AHLiebross]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 9:10pm

DramaMama wrote in response to my suggestion for a version of MFL with Eliza being a black New Yorker:

"Lord, this DOES sound awful.  No one needs another story with a white knight saving the sad black person's life."

DramaMama, I agree with you and specifically said that the Professor should be black. Hence, the "white knight" would only figuratively be white, which, in my view, solves the problem of condescension.

[Showface]

Posted: 10/20/15 at 9:32pm

Wow...

I don't approve of "blackface" and "yellowface", so I must be a racist.

Wow.

 

The fact that I don't approve of this apparently makes me racist, instead of you know, a decent human being. Behold, everyone, this is what is perfectly acceptable in Dave19's eyes:

(I am so racist for finding this photo below offensive and an issue)

 

Updated On: 10/20/15 at 09:32 PM