#26
Posted: 10/11/04 at 12:07pm
"The Rumor" is not used in the movie of Fiddler.
"Gif me the cobra jool!"
"Pointless" Songs in Musicals — Page 2
#27
Posted: 10/11/04 at 12:09pm
can anyone name a musical that truly does not have a single unnecessary number?
"The last train out of any station will not be full of nice guys." - Dr. Hunter S. Thompson
"The last train out of any station will not be full of nice guys." - Dr. Hunter S. Thompson
"I wash my face, then drink beer, then I weep. Say a prayer and induce insincere self-abuse, till I'm fast asleep"- In Trousers
#28
Posted: 10/11/04 at 12:10pm
Magruder,
I was thinking about "The Rumor" also! The Film Version accomplishes in about 30 seconds worth of dialogue what it takes the stage version to do in a 3 minute LOUSY song!
P.S. The film version also cut "Now I Have Everything."
I was thinking about "The Rumor" also! The Film Version accomplishes in about 30 seconds worth of dialogue what it takes the stage version to do in a 3 minute LOUSY song!
P.S. The film version also cut "Now I Have Everything."
"I say YOU'RE the CUTEST one. No, I say YOU'RE the CUTEST One. And we go on like that from dawn to three."
#29
Posted: 10/11/04 at 12:13pm
I completely disagree with Cooties and Near to You. While Cooties is a silly dance number, it is explained in the plot why it is there as well as replacing the original The Roach in the film. Near to You is a gorgeous song that really tears me up. It's necessary to remind the audience that Joe's wife has never been forgotten. Especially in Act Two, when she rarely makes an appearance and the plot (as well as Joe) has been almost entirely focused on the game. And though I don't care for Something Bad, the song is not completely pointless.
Who's Got the Pain and Shipoopi are pointless excuses for dance numbers, but in musical comedies, dance numbers are never pointless, really, are they?
One song that is truly pointless that comes to mind was My Secretary's in Love in the national tour of Big. It really provided no insight to the character nor did it reinforce the plot in any way. There was no dancing, so it couldn't even fill as a pointless musical comedy dance number.
As for Hairspray being "full of pointless songs". Actually, there are no pointless songs. Every song is either plot or character driven. There's not a single pointless song in the show.
Who's Got the Pain and Shipoopi are pointless excuses for dance numbers, but in musical comedies, dance numbers are never pointless, really, are they?
One song that is truly pointless that comes to mind was My Secretary's in Love in the national tour of Big. It really provided no insight to the character nor did it reinforce the plot in any way. There was no dancing, so it couldn't even fill as a pointless musical comedy dance number.
As for Hairspray being "full of pointless songs". Actually, there are no pointless songs. Every song is either plot or character driven. There's not a single pointless song in the show.
"What can you expect from a bunch of seitan worshippers?" - Reginald Tresilian
#30
Posted: 10/11/04 at 12:15pm
Well...I do love "The Rumor". It's a bit of levity in a pretty dark Act Two. And it provides some color as to life in Anatevka. No, it's not a great song, but I always miss it when it's gone.
"Gif me the cobra jool!"
#31
Posted: 10/11/04 at 1:56pm
A lot of apparently "pointless" songs would be missed if they weren't there. I'm thinking of "Folies Bergere" in Nine which has little to do with the rest of the show but is a highlight!
Faced with these Loreleis, what man can moralize!
#32
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:22pm
As much as I LOVE Urinetown, Don't be the Bunny doesn't need to be there.
#33
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:26pm
Fugue for Tinhorn from Guys and Dolls doent REALLY hav a point.
Wicked Witch of the West
#34
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:32pm
Hi Elpha, :)
"Fugue For Tinhorns" in GUYS AND DOLLS is "pointless"?
It only sets up place, time, mood and pace for entire show! :)
"Fugue For Tinhorns" in GUYS AND DOLLS is "pointless"?
It only sets up place, time, mood and pace for entire show! :)
"I say YOU'RE the CUTEST one. No, I say YOU'RE the CUTEST One. And we go on like that from dawn to three."
Updated On: 10/11/04 at 02:32 PM
#35
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:33pm
they COULD have explained it in a short scene, thats all.. its a great song, no doubt about it!
Wicked Witch of the West
#36
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:38pm
BroadwayMatt, I don't think CHICAGO has an 'unnecessary song'. All the songs are either character or story driven.
As for an unnecessary songs, there were several in NOTRE-DAME DE PARIS, like My Heart If You Will Swear, The Pagan Ave Maria, and Moon.
Also, in the original production of CATS there was The Ballad Of Billy McGraw in Act II which was totally unnecessary. Fortunately it was later cut, and a short, Italian translation of Growltiger replaced it. (The tune of 'Ballad of Billy...' was later used in STARLIGHT EXPRESS as 'Next Time You Fall In Love'.)
As for an unnecessary songs, there were several in NOTRE-DAME DE PARIS, like My Heart If You Will Swear, The Pagan Ave Maria, and Moon.
Also, in the original production of CATS there was The Ballad Of Billy McGraw in Act II which was totally unnecessary. Fortunately it was later cut, and a short, Italian translation of Growltiger replaced it. (The tune of 'Ballad of Billy...' was later used in STARLIGHT EXPRESS as 'Next Time You Fall In Love'.)
#37
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:41pm
Yes I Can, BroadwayMatt.
CAROUSEL. Every song advances plot, adds layer to character or sets tone of scene.
CAROUSEL. Every song advances plot, adds layer to character or sets tone of scene.
"I say YOU'RE the CUTEST one. No, I say YOU'RE the CUTEST One. And we go on like that from dawn to three."
#38
Posted: 10/11/04 at 2:45pm
Sant,
I agree with you about CHICAGO except for one minor exception: "Class" is just a Comedy Number for Velma and Mama; doesn't really advance plot or tell us more about the characters.
I agree with you about CHICAGO except for one minor exception: "Class" is just a Comedy Number for Velma and Mama; doesn't really advance plot or tell us more about the characters.
"I say YOU'RE the CUTEST one. No, I say YOU'RE the CUTEST One. And we go on like that from dawn to three."
#39
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:08pm
Mary E,
I think it does, in Class Mama and Velma sing about how they despise people with no manners and no good breeding, and yet the other (Mama) is a corrupted one and the other shameless opportunist. So I see it as they are accusing others being selfish, opportunists, vulgar etc, moralizing others and yet they cant' see/admit their own faults. So I don't see it just as a comic number, I see it those two characters and learning how TRULY vain they are.
I think it does, in Class Mama and Velma sing about how they despise people with no manners and no good breeding, and yet the other (Mama) is a corrupted one and the other shameless opportunist. So I see it as they are accusing others being selfish, opportunists, vulgar etc, moralizing others and yet they cant' see/admit their own faults. So I don't see it just as a comic number, I see it those two characters and learning how TRULY vain they are.
#40
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:14pm
I can see Mary Ethel's point about Class. Yes, it is a song that is more character-driven than plot-driven, but does it really tell us anything new about the characters? No. It is a funny song and delightful to hear performed, but it is an extraneous number at that point in the show.
"What can you expect from a bunch of seitan worshippers?" - Reginald Tresilian
#41
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:19pm
EXCELLENT point, Sant. I now see the light re: "Class"
Is the word you might be searching for 'hypocrite'?
Is the word you might be searching for 'hypocrite'?
"I say YOU'RE the CUTEST one. No, I say YOU'RE the CUTEST One. And we go on like that from dawn to three."
#42
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:26pm
HA Class is a very good song, and preformed properly it's phenomenal!
Wicked Witch of the West
#43
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:41pm
"Don't Be the Bunny" absolutely needs to be where it is in Urinetown. It's the point where Cladwell's idealogies clash with Hope's, it drives Act One with a jolt into the set-up for the Act One finale, and it is also the moment where Cladwell begins to "crack" and he shows his ruthlessness and lunacy. It's also just a wonderful song and dance about social Darwinism. It's not pointless...at all.
"Gif me the cobra jool!"
#44
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:43pm
Mary E,
Yes! 'Hypocrite' is the word. Thank you sweetie! :)
Yes! 'Hypocrite' is the word. Thank you sweetie! :)
#45
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:44pm
I think you're right BwayMatt... Near To You isn't "pointless." It's just not as integrated as some of the other songs, especially since (following your point) Meg isn't really that much of a part of act II. Maybe I just am sick of hearing it every night (i'm in a longer run of DY right now) and I let my boredom get in the way :)
From the evil she done Lord
Set her free, Set her free, Set me free
Don't let my sorrow
Make evil of me
#46
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:57pm
Magruder,
I'm a little confused. "Be Like The Bluebird" is not on John McGlinn's Reconstruction CD of ANYTHING GOES and we know how thorough HE is.
(CD includes "Kate The Great," which was dropped after opening night because of "sexy" lyrics.)
I'm a little confused. "Be Like The Bluebird" is not on John McGlinn's Reconstruction CD of ANYTHING GOES and we know how thorough HE is.
(CD includes "Kate The Great," which was dropped after opening night because of "sexy" lyrics.)
"I say YOU'RE the CUTEST one. No, I say YOU'RE the CUTEST One. And we go on like that from dawn to three."
#47
Posted: 10/11/04 at 3:58pm
Mary Ethel -
Check again. It's there. Track #16.
Check again. It's there. Track #16.
"Gif me the cobra jool!"
Updated On: 10/11/04 at 03:58 PM
#48
Posted: 10/11/04 at 4:38pm
I agree that "Don't Be the Bunny" isn't pointless. If there's a pointless song in "Urinetown", it's "What is Urinetown". I guess it's only there as a second act opening.
A little swash, a bit of buckle - you'll love it more than bread.
#49
Posted: 10/11/04 at 4:40pm
i think Big Blonde and Beautiful from Hairspray didnt NEED to be there though it was great and hilarious!
Wicked Witch of the West
#50
Posted: 10/11/04 at 4:42pm
The second act opening of 'Urinetown' might be funny or useful if they hadn't already explained what Urinetown was. As it is, though, it's a pointless song because we already know the locals are idiots and it's just telling us AGAIN that the locals have weird ideas of what Urinetown really is ... and we know what it is anyway (assuming we've seen Act 1.) Waste of a song.
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