The great irony: homophobic conservatives who love RENT — Page 3

If I equated conservative with homophobic and conservative with Republican and homophobic with Republican, I wouldn't feel the need to be redundant by listing each adjective. It's amazing how no matter how adeptly you utilize the English language, people read what they want to.

I DO NOT think conservative = homophobic

or that

Republican = homophobic

or that

conservative = Republican

I BELIEVE in the existence of the Religious Left. In Gay/Gay Friendly Republicans. In Conservative Gays. Etc Etc Etc.

I could have started this thread: Why do conservatives and why do homophobes love RENT. But, I was particularly fascinated by those people who are both.

I will tell you what I do equate, Derech:

homophobia = bigotry

bigotry = ugliness

thus,

homophobia = ugliness

Why do you choose to be so ugly?

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sanda--again, just not a good comparison. A good comparison might be a liberal loving a show that celebrates homophobia and blood sucking corporate executives. Or liberals loving a show that promotes racism.

That would be a fair comparison. But you can't quantify people who don't associate with a show--we have no idea why they don't.

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This is a great discussion. I'm jumping in to play devil's advocate (I just want to be very clear on that point up front). I did some studies on the religion-homosexuality connection not long ago, so I had to try and get into other people's heads on this. (A very scary process, I assure you.)

I agree that it's hard to love the religious fanatics. We can tolerate them but do not love, respect, or accept them. But the other side of that coin is that this is their same position on gays. To go back to the original post, for many it's a case of "love the sinner, hate the sin". You can love Angel and Collins (and the others...since we're rooting this is RENT), and love the words the characters say and the the way they say them and sing them, but still lament that their love is ultimately directed toward one of their own sex. Some will say you can love them as children of God, yet hope (pray?) that they may be cured (remember, devil's advocate here). After all, if we can only love them as people, they might see the error of their ways, change their preferences "back", and thereby enter heaven. To some people, this is the most compassionate stand that they can take.

Do you see why this research was scary for me? I offer this only as a counterpoint to the discussion. It's fascinating how a few basic assumptions (namely in the conservative religious discussion that homosexuality is a "voluntary behaviour" not a "sexual orientation") create immovable opinions.

ok....Taking my little devil mask off now that I stirred the pot.

Updated On: 8/3/05 at 12:16 PM

Lyrics I can't begin to imagine homophobic who happen to also be conservatives would be singing at the top of their lungs:


Bisexuals, trisexuals, homo sapiens,
Carcinogens, hallucinogens, men, Pee Wee Herman
German wine, turpentine, Gertrude Stein
Antonioni, Bertolucci, Kurosawa
Carmina Burana
To apathy, to entropy, to empathy, ecstasy
Vaclav Havel - The Sex Pistols, 8BC,
To no shame - never playing the Fame Game
To marijuana
To sodomy,
It's between God and me
To S & M

or

To Faggots, Lezzies, Dykes, Cross
Dressers Too

or to sing the following in the same meaning as the show:

Let He Among Us Without Sin
Be The First To Condemn

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Updated On: 8/3/05 at 12:25 PM

Mmm, now you are dicussing about how deep you love a show instead of like or dislike. Then I get your idea. If you talk about a conservative who DEEPLY adore Rent, it is different from a conservative who like and enjoy Rent.

I think your question now makes more sense to me.

However, I don't think you should judge a person hypocratic because of his artistic taste. There is good art and bad art, but no immoral art. For me, I should make judgement base on his speech and his action.

Yes, but there is a great difference. I grant the religious fanactis the right to their beliefs, and lifestyle, so long as they do no harm to anyone else. Many do not show the same respect for those who are different from them, and are actively working to limit the rights and options of those who are different.

Many do not love the sinner but hate the sin . . . they hate it all.

I think that is the core irony . . . there are those who hate all things that in any way condone homosexuality, but then say they like a musical that condones and embrances it. You cannot say that the message is wonderful, but shoot the messenger at the same time, when the messenger is itself part of the message.

At least I think that is the core irony . . .

And, for the record, I am not speaking of anyone in particular on this Board, just in generalities, which itself is always dangerous.

have we never sung lyrics we didn't agree with? I'm not exactly talking KKK....but I find myself singing along to Nelly or 50 cent or whomever because the music is catchy and it's fun to dance to. If I stop and listen to the words I'm saying, I'm a little horrified at the nasty phrases coming out of my mouth about women - and I am one! All because the music and lyrics were catchy. La Boheme is catchy because it's catchy and the lyrics roll off your tongue in fun ways. I think you could sing it and yet not be all for it's message.

Oh, I knew this thread was going to be a big ball of cognitive dissonance.

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katy--I think that was my fave post in this thread.

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"Maybe they love it because they have completely misinterpreted the message."

Perhaps they think the true heroes of the show are Joanne's parents, Alexi Darling and that preacher who makes a nasty comment after Angel's funeral.

Hey, I'll scout for you if you can find me a nice, straight, geeky boy who loves theater. Bonus points if he's here in Chicago and I don't have to leave my beloved city.

And I would also like to say to Calvin- you are adorable and intelligent and I love your posts on here.

Um, I guess I just love this whole thread. You are all fabulous!