What character has worn the most body mics at once?- Page 2
What character has worn the most body mics at once?
#25re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 6/11/06 at 12:57pmI think Rent uses the visible mics (countrymen) because it gives it more of a feel like your at a concert and not a show. Thats what I got out of it the first time I saw it at least.
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neddyfrank2
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/23/05
#26re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 6/11/06 at 1:02pmElphabuff2- I remember reading somewhere that they used them to remind people that they are performers and that this is a show.
Joshua488
Broadway Legend Joined: 9/29/04
#27re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 6/11/06 at 2:02pmI actually think that losing a mic during a performance is fun! I was Oscar in Sweet Charity at a 600-seat theatre and as I walk out for my entrance and deliver my first line, I couldn't hear myself over the speakers! So I had to recall all of my training and make an effort to project over the orchestra and match Charity's volume (whose mic was working). It was fun and definitely a bit of a challenge. Mind you, Oscar's presence in Act One isn't much, but it was still a new experience.
lifeisacabaret
Leading Actor Joined: 4/17/06
#28re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 6/11/06 at 2:13pm
Hey
Well, the unmuting and muting is handled scene by scene by the mixing desk/computer, but the operator will be watching the stage very closely and if a character is singing to another character (who is not singing but is in the scene), then either itll be pre-programmed that the non singing character's mic is muted, or the operator will bring the fader right down until the non singing character is due to sing again.
When two characters are singing right in the face of each other at the same time, then the operator's task becomes incrediby difficult, but ultimately, the physics of sound dictate that there will be bleed into the other character's mic, because the mics used in theatre are omnidirectional (and therefore pick-up sound from every direction).
However, in some shows, the above problem is abbated with a complicated, but simple method of sound re-enforcement. The radio mics (and some of the orchestra) are split into different systems (A&B), so in a duet say, one characters mic will be in the A system, and one will be in the B system. This doesnt really stop the sound bleeding, but it does help abbate the phase coupling that happens when two mics and two singers are in very close proximity. This technique generally makes the sound clearer and less muddy in duet sequences.
Notable examples of shows that use A/B systems are 'The Producers', 'The Phantom of the Opera' and 'Brundibar'.
This particular problem is helped in shows where actors wear mics that are very close to their mouths (sonically better, but visually intrusive), because the mics become more directional, and therefore there is less bleed into other mics onstage. The most commonly used headband, or boom mics, are the DPA 4066 and 4065, and the countryman E6 & ISomax HS. Sennheiser MKE-2's are also often used in an adaptor that makes them into boom mics.
Updated On: 6/11/06 at 02:13 PM
gittel
Swing Joined: 7/2/06
#29re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 10:44am
Reviving an older topic: I was wondering, why are the mics sometimes very visible on the forehead on the hairline and other times completely hidden from the naked eye? Is it the type of mic used, the skill of the person mic-ing the actor, makeup? When the mic is not visible (to the non-professional viewer) is it just further back on the actor's head and if so, wouldn't their hair rustle in the mic or wouldn't there be a greater danger of dislodging the mic?
Also, in general, how big are the receiver packs worn by the actors and where are those generally placed on the actors' bodies to remain camoflauged within their wardrobe?
Updated On: 7/23/06 at 10:44 AM
#30re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 1:31pm
Well I know that some shows will place the mic pack in wigs sometimes if the costume is tight to the body. As in the case of Passion, Mazzie wore her pack in her wig because they didn't want any visible wires due to the fact that she was naked. Jennifer Hope Wills said that when she was in Wonderful Town she wore her pack in her wig, and then in Phantom she wore it on her hip.
The is size is normally around the size of a deck of cards, correct me if I am wrong. That is the size of the mics I have used.
LuPonatic
Broadway Legend Joined: 6/12/06
#31re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 5:30pmforcing actors to "project" without microphones all the time can promote screaming, which I am against. microphones are always helpful. maybe this theatre projection things comes from the fact that theatre existed before microphones, but now that they exist, I will always offer them up, especially with an orchestra in front of the actors. it's just common sense that instruments play louder than any voice can sing.
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/31/69
#32re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 6:37pmPerformers who can't project and be understood in the last row of any theatre really ought to consider television or film for their careers or be embarassed that they aren't a real theatre performer.
#33re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 6:46pm
Don't kid yourself. Even Ethel Merman couldn't belt Elphaba's songs to the back of the Gershwin theatre without a microphone. Shows today are orchestrated differently, instruments have changed, and accoustics are not the same in every theatre.
Even the greats of yesteryear - the Martins and Mermans were mic-ed at least some point in their careers.
ThankstoPhantom
Broadway Legend Joined: 10/13/05
#34re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 6:54pm
Performers who can't project and be understood in the last row of any theatre really ought to consider television or film for their careers or be embarassed that they aren't a real theatre performer.
So almost everyone? Training has changed...and even if they do learn, they may lose that technique after a time because they become so used to mics. (NOTE: But they should always project somewhat.)
How to properly use its/it's:
Its is the possessive. It's is the contraction for it is...
Updated On: 7/23/06 at 06:54 PM
lifeisacabaret
Leading Actor Joined: 4/17/06
#35re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 6:55pm
EDIT: This is a reply to tom14850 (others posted inbetween me clicking the reply button and my post being finished).
Oh, darling, that hasnt been true or relevant for about 40 years.
No one on earth could sing say, Judas or Tommy over a live pit band without the help of a microphone, physics and physiology dictate it.
If, as you seem to think is preferable, no microphones were allowed, then all the shows would be of the 'oklahoma' etc variety- no electronic instruments in the pit, and instrumental ensembles composed of many, many strings. Theatregoing would be entirely different because the vast majority of shows would not be the same or as dynamicly impressive without their current orchestrations.
I dont even know why people still hold that massively outdated view- there hasnt been a major musical of note anywhere in the last 30 that didnt use radio mics. You ask any performer in a musical if they'd like to sing 8 shows a week (particularly a lead) without a mic. Not one would say yes, unless they were hugely masochistic, or were in a pseudo-opera, such as sweeney todd or something like WSS, and even then they'd still, more than likely still want their mics, because singing without one would totally alter the performance they were able to give- and they duration of a run of that performance would be drastically shortened because voices would get fatigued far quicker.
I know people will throw up the Merm as an example of someone who didnt need a body mic but a) she sang in shows with no electronic instruments in the pit and b)as showbizzy fabulous as she was, she was hardly known for her vocally nuanced and emotionally expressive singing- she belted it out to the back row, with that being a primary concern.
Updated On: 7/23/06 at 06:55 PM
BwayBaby18
Broadway Legend Joined: 2/19/05
#36re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 6:57pm
LuPonatic - "forcing actors to "project" without microphones all the time can promote screaming"
Then explain why we are micing people who scream?
Also some people would be up ****'s creek without a mic. I am not trying to make this sound like a stab at you, but Patti was completely understandable during some dialouge in Sweeney.
#37re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 6:58pmTis true, MB. Also, doesn't equity require mics if any music in the pit is amplified? (and most are...)
"It's not so much do what you like, as it is that you like what you do." SS
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana." GMarx
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana." GMarx
lifeisacabaret
Leading Actor Joined: 4/17/06
#38re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 7:01pm
"I am not trying to make this sound like a stab at you, but Patti was completely understandable during some dialouge in Sweeney"
What does this mean? The microphones are not muted for dialogue in Sweeney- i have the technical magazine article in front of me, and it is very detailed. If you couldnt hear the sound as coming from a speaker and not her, then its because the sound system is very comprehensively programmed, imaged and operated.
The microphones in musical theatre are on all the time- its the psycho-acoustics principle. The brain needs to hear a sound coming from a source consistently- not speakers for singing, directly from the mouth for dialogue. Carefull imaging and programming can make the design consistent enough that it will always sound like the sounds coming from the actors are coming from them.
Updated On: 7/23/06 at 07:01 PM
#39re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 7:29pm
Refering to the pseudo-opera comment, even in opera they don't make the singers sing 8 shows a week. They will give double/triple cast leads in the production and each lead will sing a show and have 1 to 2 days off to rest the voice.
This is a reference to vocal studies. When you learn to sing, you sing from the mask, which goes back to the ancient greek theatre when they would wear masks with cones around the mouth to help with project in productions. So even in ancient Greece they had projection aides.
In Opera you can still sing with dynamics and project to the last row of the opera house. Just go see Renee Fleming live, her piano's are mind blowing. And I was sitting in the very back of the hall, she is amazing.
Jon
Broadway Legend Joined: 2/20/04
#40re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 7:52pmI have certainly never heard of Equity requiring mikes if amplified music is used. I am musical director at an Equity theatre, and I often use synthesizers and electric pianos. Obviously, the sound comes out of speakers. We have never used any kind of microphones for our actors. The theatre has a seating capacioty of 180. There are 11 rows of seats. Anyone who can'r project that far REALLY needs to get out of the business. Yet, I am constantly hearing of less-than-200-seat theatres using body mikes!
#41re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 8:34pm^Sorry Jon, I was only referring to Broadway houses...
"It's not so much do what you like, as it is that you like what you do." SS
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana." GMarx
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana." GMarx
#42re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 8:38pm
Who turns the microphones off when they go offstage for costume changes and things like that?
Updated On: 7/23/06 at 08:38 PM
morosco
Broadway Legend Joined: 7/10/04
#43re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 8:45pm
"Who turns the microphones off when they go offstage for costume changes and things like that?"
Typically it's done by the operator at the sound board. Each mic is assigned to it's own fader switch. When the actor leaves or enters the stage the board op either slides the fader up or down. On Broadway this task has become somewhat automated. The board op can press a button and the faders set themselves like a light cue. Without having to do these routine tasks, the operator can fully devote his time to mixing the show.
#44re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 8:49pm^True. But I've heard it go wrong and the audience gets an earful! Bathroom breaks, swearing, farting...
"It's not so much do what you like, as it is that you like what you do." SS
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana." GMarx
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana." GMarx
#45re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 11:26pm
"I remember reading somewhere that they used them to remind people that they are performers and that this is a show."
Oh! A Brechtian device!
jonartdesigns
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/15/04
#46re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 11:31pm
back onto topic i reall that the phantom of the opera wears 3, one in his hairline ,one in the edge of the mask, and one over his ear.
as to the need for microphones, take a show like the wedding singer or rent- their band is electric guitars and synthesizers, it would be a moot point to try to try to sing over that
"Grease," the fourth revival of the season, is the worst show in the history of theater and represents an unparalleled assault on Western civilization and its values. - Michael Reidel
#47re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/23/06 at 11:33pm
"Performers who can't project and be understood in the last row of any theatre really ought to consider television or film for their careers or be embarassed that they aren't a real theatre performer."
Yes, actors can project -- However, forcing an actor to project through a large auditorium, correct me if I am wrong, can cause some audience members to lose what the actor is saying because sound is absorbed from many sources throughout the theatre (ie. ears, walls, curtains ...etc.).
Also, I know this from experience, projecting through a large auditorium without a mic can also cause actors voices to become hoarse and possibly ruin their vocal chords. Again, correct me if I am wrong.
When I have worked in University/Professional Theatre, any actor that I have seen wear mic packs have it on a wasteband in their lowerback under their costume. My school also utilizes Trojan condoms to keep the micpacks from getting damp, non-lubricated of course.
lifeisacabaret
Leading Actor Joined: 4/17/06
#48re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/24/06 at 4:19am
In Reference to the phantom- he actually wears two. Both over his left ear, usually extending about an inch following the line of the cheekbone (this is subject to the bone-structure of the actor though). This arrangement for the phantom wasnt always the case- until about 10 years ago, actors playing the phantom wore one over the ear and another (white) one in the place that a newsreader would usually wear one. The two mics over the ear format is the case in London and on Broadway, but some productions still go for the 1 over the ear and one on the chest. There have been occasions in the past when an actor has been wear two over the ear and one on the chest- this was the case in london for a while, but as with all things in a show, the sound design is adapted.
The reason why the phantom does not wear one further up his hairline (on the forehead) is because that would be far to close to the mask, and that would cause major reflections into the mic element, which would cause the sound to sound VERY odd. The over the ear position is not the most sonically advantageous, but sometimes compromises have to be made when there is an element of costume in the way.
"Who turns the microphones off when they go offstage for costume changes and things like that?"
In reference to this, it is all pre-programmed, and the board operator does not move the faders up and down to mute and unmute the microphones. The muting and unmuting is done in a pre-programmed order using the mute switch in each channel and the consoles automation system. The operator just needs to press the 'next' button to get to the next scene (incidentally, pressing the next button may also fire a sound effect or playback trigger as part of the cue). To make the task of mixing the show with such a large amount of radio mics, groups of mics are assigned to faders called 'VCA's' at the centre of the consoles. These arrangements may change during the show, so in say scene one, vca 1 may be for the band, with vca 2 for the phantom, vca 3 for christine and vca 4 for the offstage chorus. In another scene, vca 1 may be for the band, with vca 2 for raoul, vca 3 for carlotta, vca 4 for andre, vca 5 for piangi etc etc. This makes the task of mixing a musical easier, but overall it is not an easy task at all. There are so many input sources to keep and eye on, and keeping the balance between the band and the cast is a very difficult job, primarily because actors are rarely consistent- even if they have been singing a role for 2 years, their levels may change wildly during the week. During the show, the task if mixing is very thought and labour intensive- it requires intense contribution to keep all the levels constant, in line with what the actors are doing.
Some things to look at:-
http://www.cadac-sound.com/frameset.asp?P=products/j-type.htm
http://www.digico.org/DiGiCo-05/d5t.htm
http://www.yamahaproaudio.com/products/mixers/pm1d/index.html
These three sound desks are the most commonly used in professional theatre and on broadway.
Updated On: 7/24/06 at 04:19 AM
algy
Broadway Star Joined: 10/19/05
#49re: What character has worn the most body mics at once?
Posted: 7/24/06 at 8:37amOn the "where is the mic pack" issue - the best that I've seen recently was at Rocky Horror (UK Tour, just been in WE) where Rocky (and Frank too I think) had it in the front of pants. To be honest, there's no where else for Rocky to have it - all he's wearing are the leopard print pants, but it was a nice touch. Padded though so it wasn't obvious.
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