Bridge & Tunnel Crowd Can No Longer Be Counted On?- Page 2

[Lot666]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 8:48am

Phantom4ever said: "As for me, someone who routinely sees 15-20 shows a year to support my Phantom addiction, I've only been back once since the closure. But that is because there is just a lack of shows good enough to warrant the trip without Phantom."

I used to visit NY 2-4 times per year and see anywhere from 5-7 shows per visit, with one of them always being Phantom. Unfortunately, the ticket prices have become completely absurd and absolutely nothing that opened in 2023 held the slightest interest for me. Consequently, I haven't been back to the city since Phantom closed last April and currently have no plans to return. The only potential I see in 2024 is the rumored transfer of Sunset Boulevard from the West End.

Updated On: 1/4/24 at 08:48 AM

[Kad]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 10:52am

Matt Rogers said: "Just a heads up that the above link sends you to the NY Post, just in case you, like me, don’t care to give that right wing rag any hits."

Correct. And the article is extremely misleadingly titled- it quotes data that indicates other concerns are larger factors in this, and the "safety concerns" in the title come from one anecdotal statement from one random person. It's part of a broader and sustained push from conservative media that Democratic cities are unsafe.

Updated On: 1/4/24 at 10:52 AM

[All So Ozmopolitan]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 11:38am

Jarethan said: "Off-Broadway provides more options, but I will bet that the vast majority of bridge and tunnel people have never seen an off-Broadway production or -- if that is too hyperbolic a statement -- have rarely ventured out of the Broadway theatre district."

I disagree. I think you're underestimating how many nonprofit subscribers are bridge and tunnel commuters. Off-Broadway/nonprofit theatre relies heavily on the full-season subscription model, which has plummeted since the pandemic. Frequent bridge and tunnel theatre-goers, who likely saw many Off-Broadway shows, are simply not returning to the city out of fear of health concerns, assumed lack of safety, or just old age (and no one younger is stepping up to "take their place".) There's also the component that what attracted the bridge and tunnel crowd in the first place was the cheery Chenoweth-led revival and not the more diverse, challenging new works from say Michael R. Jackson or Hansol Jung. 

[Jarethan]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 4:06pm

All So Ozmopolitan said: "Jarethan said: "Off-Broadway provides more options, but I will bet that the vast majority of bridge and tunnel people have never seen an off-Broadway production or -- if that is too hyperbolic a statement -- have rarely ventured out of the Broadway theatre district."

I disagree. I think you're underestimating how many nonprofit subscribers are bridge and tunnel commuters. Off-Broadway/nonprofit theatre relies heavily on the full-season subscription model, which has plummeted since the pandemic. Frequent bridge and tunnel theatre-goers, who likely saw many Off-Broadway shows, are simply not returning to the city out of fear of health concerns, assumed lack of safety, or just old age (and no one younger is stepping up to "take their place".) There's also the component that what attracted the bridge and tunnel crowd in the first place was the cheery Chenoweth-led revival and not the more diverse, challenging new works from say Michael R. Jackson or Hansol Jung."

I will take your word on the B&T off-Broadway subscription base, although I am surprised.  Have to admit that -- unless something is at the Pels or the City Center or the Mitzi Newhouse -- I only go off-Broadway for matinees (and not frequently), because I don't like getting out at 10:00pm in neighborhoods that I am not super familiar with, and then having to start looking for a taxi, since my wife refuses to ride the subways.

Re your final point, I have to admit that I fall into that category in some cases.  Based on everything I read, i concluded that the probability was high that I would hate A Strange Loop, so I did not see it.  I eventually bought the cast recording, and I did not even get through it once...so I was glad that I saved my 'slot' and my money.  I did see Gary a few seasons ago, only because of Nathan Lane.  I hated it emphatically and am willing to admit that I have no idea what it will take me to ever see anything with Taylor Mac's name associated with it again.  On the other hand, I loved Slave Play and would love forward to Harris' next play, if there ever is one.  So, I probably have one foot in the bridge and tunnel group and another in a little more adventurous group (if not completely). 

I really do believe that streaming has played a major role in reducing B&T attendance.

[RWPrincess]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 8:48pm

My main issue has been that since the LIRR started service at Grand Central, they basically cut service at Penn Station instead of treating Grand Central as incremental. The schedules on my line are not curtain time friendly on weeknights. Trains are now hourly at the times most shows let out when they used to be 2-3 times an hour. I don't want to hang out at Penn late at night. So I basically come on weekends now for matinees and the occasional 2 show day but obviously not every weekend. I still managed about 50 shows last year but that was because the new schedule started later in the year.

I also just have not been very excited about a lot of the new stuff that has opened or is coming in. So I wait for reviews and show marketing before deciding to see it.

[Jarethan]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 8:55pm

Curious…beyond a show or two, can anyone get excited with the productions announced so far for the Spring?  There is not a single thing that excites me so far.  With Cabaret, I am not so excited — I have seen a lot of Cabaret — and those prices are a deterrent for me from advanced purchase.

[TheatreFan4]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 10:35pm

Broadway Flash said: "It’s not just right wing outlets. Have you watched ABC news recently? New York Times? All it does is talk about crime and the migrant crisis, and tolls, and all the city’s other problems. Can easily see suburbanites thinking, not going into that mess. This is what I’ve been talking about for years. The first order of business is to clean up midtown. Secondly, they should have a new campaign like they did back in the day. The I Love NY commercials. I love watching those online, even tho it was before my time. They need to entice people to come into the city and see a show by making it look very fabulous. I hope the Tony Awards this year at Lincoln Center is a good look."

There's nothing to clean up. There's been minimal increase in crime in the city and no where near where it was for MOST of Broadway's history. What you're talking about is media not distorting facts... and then you want media to also be the ones to help save it with "I Love NY" ****? Lol. 

[jkcohen626]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 11:17pm

This was over a year ago now, but I think it's still true: When I was taking a Producing class, Andrew Flatt from Disney on Broadway did a phenomenal guest lecture for us. One of the key things he talked about was, of course, Disney's post-COVID recovery. He gave the example of a suburban family where one parent works in the city and the other closer to home (or doesn't work). On any random weeknight pre-pandemic, the parent closer to home might pick up their kids, bring them into the city, and meet up with the other parent for dinner and a show.

As of Fall 2022, this archetype had significantly lower attendance than pre-pandemic. Disney thought it was for primarily two reasons: 1. The parent who used to work in the city was still working at home, which made it harder for them to finish work in time to commute in in time for curtain and 2. The families developed other entertainment habits during the pandemic that they prioritized. 

I'm originally from the Bay Area, not New York, but I do still see some of the same patterns with my family.

For reason 1: when I was in High School, my Mom worked in San Francisco. When we would go to a show, I'd take the train into the city after school to meet her. She'd usually park by the theatre in the morning and BART back-and-forth to her office, so it would be maybe 15 minutes from leaving her desk to meeting me at our dinner spot. She could get a full, even late work day in before the show. Now she works down on the Peninsula, much closer to home. She does still go to shows, but now she has to leave early and deal with horrible Bay Area rush hour traffic to get up to the city. It's just much more difficult. 

For reason 2: During the pandemic, my family definitely developed non-theatre family entertainment habits in a way we never did before. Even now that everyone's back to work and school, it's common for them (or us when I'm home) to watch TV or a movie after dinner on random weeknights. They always have TV shows they're working through as a family. That never really happened pre-Pandemic. We're theatre people, so we still love going to see shows. But, I could totally see that affecting other families. If you were going to shows for the family bonding, but you're finding that in significantly cheaper, more convenient ways, do you need to see shows anymore? My answer woud be of course, but I could understand families who say no. 

[UWS10023]

Posted: 1/4/24 at 11:32pm

I think there is less consideration for others because of the times we live in and tempers are more on display but this could be said about any major city. I think some of the more recent crimes have seemed more brazen and have happened in areas which are usually more immune. And subway stabbings seem to be reported repeatedly. The protesting is done in a respectful manner but often causes congestion and rerouting. I can see where some people would lose interest in coming into the city.

[SellingOut]

Posted: 1/5/24 at 9:32am

I’m about 2 hours from NYC, and typically go to 3-4 shows a year.  Going is a day trip for me and I love it.  It has never been “cheap” but post-pandemic the discount codes are few and far between and the amount of special/priority seating has increased.  Even if I can spend $200 a ticket, I can’t usually find someone to go with me even if they are interested.  I’ve gone alone but usually prefer someone to join me.  I also won’t go and sit far back or in a bad spot - it’s not worth the trip at that point.  If I lived in the city I’d do more rush tickets or check out off Broadway shows  for sure.  I like to have my ticket(s) before I go if I’m going to take the trip.  Entertainment/ticket prices in general have skyrocketed over the last few years.

As far as crime goes, I’ve never felt unsafe but continue to stay alert - as one would do anywhere.  

[Ensemble1671017357]

Posted: 1/5/24 at 12:35pm

Matt Rogers said: "Just a heads up that the above link sends you to the NY Post, just in case you, like me, don’t care to give that right wing rag any hits."

 

The NYPost article reports on reasons for the undeniable drop in attendance, revenue and longevity using surveys and interviews. Why would anyone not be interested in reading what they have to say to see if it makes sense - unless they fear the truth?

[JSquared2]

Posted: 1/5/24 at 12:39pm

Ensemble1671017357 said: "Matt Rogers said: "Just a heads up that the above link sends you to the NY Post, just in case you, like me, don’t care to give that right wing rag any hits."



The NYPost article reports on reasons for the undeniable drop in attendance, revenue and longevity using surveys and interviews. Why would anyone not be interested in reading what they have to say to see if it makes sense - unless they fear the truth?"

 

For the same reasons one wouldn't read the National Enquirer (or watch Fox News) to get their news.

[Ensemble1671017357]

Posted: 1/5/24 at 12:57pm

JSquared2 said: "Ensemble1671017357 said: "Matt Rogers said: "Just a heads up that the above link sends you to the NY Post, just in case you, like me, don’t care to give that right wing rag any hits."



The NYPost article reports on reasons for the undeniable drop in attendance, revenue and longevity using surveys and interviews. Why would anyone not be interested in reading what they have to say to see if it makes sense - unless they fear the truth?"



For the same reasons one wouldn't read theNational Enquirer (or watch Fox News) to get their news."

 

Thankfully, many people were not afraid to read the article and there has been lively and thoughtful discussion as a result.