Morrissey: "I See No Difference Between Eating Meat and Pedophilia"

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 11:35am

“If you have access to You Tube, you should click on to what is called The video the meat industry doesn’t want you to see. If this doesn’t affect you in a moral sense then you’re probably granite. I see no difference between eating animals and paedophilia. They are both rape, violence, murder. If I’m introduced to anyone who eats beings, I walk away. Imagine, for example, if you were in a nightclub and someone said to you 'Hello, I enjoy bloodshed, throat-slitting and the destruction of life,' well, I doubt if you’d want to exchange phone numbers."

“I would like the Queen of England to be asked why she wears an electrocuted bear-cub on her head. I would like to ask all so-called celebrity chefs why they believe that animals should have no right to live. If Jamie ‘Orrible is so certain that flesh-food is tasty then why doesn’t he stick one of his children in a microwave?”





You Can Always Count on Morrissey to Ruffle Feathers

[best12bars]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:40pm

I struggle with this a lot, and every year I tell myself, I'm going to be a vegetarian. As it is, I rarely eat meat, but I do eat it. We are certainly not the only carnivorous species on the planet. Far from it. So if it's "natural" for other species, why isn't it "natural" for us? Personally, I think we've evolved far enough now that we don't need to eat meat. We are carnivores by choice, not by necessity. Other species are, too, but some would rather starve than give up meat. Lions will never eat a tofu steak. Some humans feel that way, too. Other species would die if they didn't feed off of each other.

So are you tampering with nature's food chain if you eat meat? Or don't eat it? Are you throwing off the whole eco system and food chain? Are you going to stop all other animals from eating all other animals? Or are you giving nature a hand and acting morally and responsibly toward living creatures?

I don't think there is a living species on earth that doesn't disturb, destroy, or feed off of other species in order to survive.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:46pm

"Nature's" food chain has been so tampered with at this point that so much of what is produced by big agriculture is barely even natural.

I personally have no desire to be part of a chain that includes high tech industrial killing methods that accidentally maim sentient conscious animals. Nor do I want to be part of a chain that feeds livestock food *they* wouldn't naturally eat because it's cheaper. I wonder how long the lion would last if he was eating meat that's loaded up with antibiotics and hormones?

As long as space remains,
As long as sentient beings remain,
Until then, may I too remain,
And dispel the miseries of the world.

Updated On: 1/4/14 at 12:46 PM

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:48pm

Besty,

My concern is actually that whole lifestyle and culture pushing the idea of eating meat even further and further away. More research continues to come out proving meat should be a necessary nutritional component of our diet, with the caveat of responsible moderation and careful monitoring of your food source.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:51pm

"More research continues to come out proving meat should be a necessary nutritional component of our diet"

DO show us some of that research, LH, and please make sure it includes longitudinal studies. Most of us have at least one friend eating the paleo diet who will be keeling over in a few years, they don't count as "research".

[best12bars]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:53pm

I think more than anything else it's the reckless irresponsibility of the meat (and produce and entire food) industry that's the biggest problem for me, as Namo pointed out.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:53pm

Yeah, I want to keep myself as far away from that as I possibly can.

[best12bars]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 12:56pm

Just curious ... are you a vegetarian, Namo? Or Vegan? How do you monitor your daily intake of an industry that's so spoiled and corrupt?

How do you decide what is acceptable for consumption?

Updated On: 1/4/14 at 12:56 PM

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 1:02pm

Here, Namo: http://authoritynutrition.com/7-evidence-based-health-reasons-to-eat-meat/

It includes citations by verified sources for every claim.

ETA: I emphasize the caveat previously stated. With extreme moderation and careful consideration of your food source, it is beneficial. Updated On: 1/4/14 at 01:02 PM

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 1:09pm

Vegetarian about 26 years. Stopped red meat 31 years ago.

I just try to be conscious of what I am consuming, for my own sanity I don't want to cross that line into being constantly ALERT. I try to buy organic when I can and I am delighted when yummy "new" protein trends become popular. Please sir, quinoa have another? Ugh, that was bad, even for me.

My brain seems to want to fold in on itself when I see examples of the cruelty that goes on in big business food production, but I fundamentally believe everybody should have full knowledge of how what they eat gets on their plates. That weirdly, gorgeously surreal documentary "Leviathan," about the fishing industry, had scenes of skate fish being yanked out of the ocean and picked up on meathooks while still alive and then having their wings sliced off with machetes, all the while gasping for breath.

I want to occupy no place in the demand for that kind of food.

And I never bring up my feelings about this stuff unless there's a thread like this or if I am at a dinner with somebody who goes on and on about "do-gooders" and "vegetarians" and "PETA". I give them ten minutes to go on freely. If they continue to go on, I do speak up about why I choose not to be a part of that.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 1:22pm

Liza, I clicked on every one of the footnotes. Most every article is a meta-analysis of previously existing studies. And many make the distinction between "meat" and "processed meat" (guess which variety is most common today?) with the latter being unhealthy.

Then there are things like the article that looked at hip injuries and meat eaters, to argue the possibility of better bone density among meat consumers, and the study is a case review of a whopping 44 people.

Also, your article wants to make a case against "mere" observational studies, until further down the page it cites observational studies because it gives the answer the writer was looking for.

So, you know, you really DO have to consider the sources. And remember their bottom line, "it tastes delicious." That's what motivates articles like those. On a totally unrelated to the article note, I wonder if the people who think so would still think so if they saw how that deliciousness was procured for them?

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 1:42pm

I would agree with you that processed meat and genetically altered meat is obviously far different from the meat we used to eat as kids, for the most part.

You do have to be somewhat hypersensitive about it, but it is possible to be a stickler about the source (and treatment) of your meat. I am a meat eater but am very cautious about it. It's certainly not for everyone, just as being a vegetarian or vegan isn't, but I think it strikes a delicate balance. If I cannot vouch for the source of the meat, I won't eat it. But I still eat meat when it meets my personal threshold.

[best12bars]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 1:47pm

Namo, thanks for that post (at 1:09pm). I appreciate your perspective, and I agree with pretty much everything you said there.

I will say this ... when I lived in California for 23 years, it was a lot easier to make vegetarian and organic choices at the super market and at restaurants than it is here in the "beef belt," where they do everything (in)humanly possible to encourage you to believe you're a T-Rex out on a bender.

Aside from simply not carrying many items, they actually charge more for food items that used to cost me less in CA, because they aren't carnivorous choices. The politics of food.

It's still possible to do it (especially in a college town, where I live), even if I have to work harder to make good decisions. The biggest problem with living in a college town is the overabundance of "bar food" ... meaning anything deep-fried that can be eaten with your fingers, dipped in sauce, and served out of the back of a pickup truck on game day. Ugh.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 2:00pm

"I would agree with you that processed meat …"

That's not me, you're agreeing with, Liza. That's from the article you linked trying to make people feel better about eating meat.

b12, conscious eating is a challenge for everybody! Me too. Back when I gave up meat, there weren't vary many vegetarian options available in the northeast either. It got easier for a while until vegetarian shelf space was taken over by gluten-free options.

I will be honest with how I came to give up red meat. It was 1981. A mysterious cancer was striking gay men. I started going to a health food store, thinking, well, vitamins might help! I picked up a pamphlet by some guru somewhere who was arguing for eating the plant-based living diet rather than the dead flesh animal diet. I was working at a record store at the time (I will NOT tell you which High Fidelity character was most like me), and McDonald's was the go-to. So, I thought, red meat IS kinda gross. I cut that out in my "I have to do SOMETHING for my health" period of GRID panic.

Five years later I got involved with a vegetarian, so it was easy to give up the rest of it.

Now, what I am about to say is "merely" observational during the past five years: my older, leaner, omnivore brother has to be on statins for cholesterol maintenance. and my primary care doc says he only sees cholesterol levels like mine in patients who are on statin drugs. So that is what worked really well for me, but we all have different bodies and genetic histories.

My exposure to the horrors of animal slaughter came years after I had given up meat. So it was easy for me to say I do NOT want to be part of THAT.

Updated On: 1/4/14 at 02:00 PM

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 2:03pm

So, back to the original post, would you agree with Morrissey that eating meat is like pedophilia?

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 2:03pm

Of course not. I also disagreed with him when he said that Chinese people are another race than human. There is a LOT to disagree with Morrissey about.

Updated On: 1/4/14 at 02:03 PM

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 2:25pm

Why would any one agree with his statement? Morrisey is an idiot.

[Wilmingtom]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 2:30pm

I do eat meat. If a cow, for instance, was not put on earth to give us milk, meat and leather, why is it here at all? It serves no other purpose. It's our responsibility, however, to patronize companies that treat their livestock humanely.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 2:36pm

"If a cow, for instance, was not put on earth to give us milk, meat and leather, why is it here at all?"

Is that really how you view the world?

If so, how did the world go from that to "If a cow for instance, was not put on this earth to live shackled in over-crowded and inhumane conditions while being force fed things she would never choose to ingest in a billion years so that she can be artificially induced to give chemically-laden milk and later have her throat slashed, why is she here?"

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 3:16pm

But I think there are two different arguments going on here.

Are we arguing about the very idea/concept of humans eating meat? Or are we arguing about the concept of the humane treatment of livestock? There are produce companies that treat their animals humanely and do not force feed harmful antibiotics or chemicals to their livestock. So, I'm all for that.

Namo, are you completely against the idea of slaughtering an animal with intent to consume irregardless of its treatment while alive? Or are you only comfortable with the slaughtering of an animal as long as it was treated humanely during its days on earth?

[Jane2]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 3:28pm

This issue will always be a source of controversy, I think. Neither side can prove it's the correct side. Well, yes it IS true that some animals are treated inhumanely but are we meant to eat meat or not?

I think about this a lot. I'm not a big meat eater, but there are times I can swear my body craves it. that's when I get a big juicy burger.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 3:34pm

Liza, I am actually free from having to make a distinction on that point in the discussion because more than two decades ago I decided not to be a part of that. So I am not a part of that.

I also think it's a bit academic for folks to say "I am all for animals being humanely treated while alive and slaughtered in way that's less vicious" as if it's easy to locate or affordable to purchase such meat. It's like EVERYBODY is in favor of clothes that aren't made in sweatshops or dangerous conditions in the developing world but it's REALLY HARD to find or afford such clothing in the US.

[Wilmingtom]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 3:59pm

Liza, you got my point about treating livestock humanely, which many companies do conscientiously, as well they should. A cow, like a chicken, is not meant to simply die of old age. To ignore the ways in which they are useful is insulting to the animal.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 4:03pm

Wow.

[Liza's Headband]

Posted: 1/4/14 at 4:04pm

"I am actually free from having to make a distinction on that point in the discussion because more than two decades ago I decided not to be a part of that. So I am not a part of that. "

You're also free of having a legitimate two-way dialogue about it, then. It's easy to knock someone else's belief when you have an easy out from espousing your own. It suddenly becomes a one sided conversation, which doesn't help anyone. Debate and conversation is healthy.

"...as if it's easy to locate or affordable to purchase such meat."

I never said it was easy or affordable. Much the opposite actually. As I previously stated, you do have to be somewhat hypersensitive about it if you want to live by that particular philosophy. And I am. But I also know that it's not always an option and will compromise instead (skip the meat!).

Updated On: 1/4/14 at 04:04 PM